Why are the new army books so expensive?

[The Low King]

Where where they before the switchover? im talkin in pounds stirling....your dollars confuse me.

I buy the books because i like them, the point im making is that £5 extra hardly makes a difference to me, plus i prefer the new Hard cover books to the old ones, they are prettier

[Lord Dan]

I don't know what they were going for in pounds, because here that's an answer to the question of what they weigh. I think it's about 14 pounds, if my conversions are up-to-date.

They were $20 for a very long time, then bumped to $22 across the board about 2 years back. When that large space marine codex came out (can't remember the release) it set a new price point somewhere below $30, after which all softcover army books were reset to $33 when the first hardcover book came out.

I understand your point, and understand that a 5 pound increase isn't that much. Taken in the context of the overall price raise, which amounts to almost double that number, I feel the new price point is unacceptable.

[ftayl5]

I like the new books, they're pretty :3 and much more resistant to cat related damage.

On the other hand they cost $70 AU, which is by far the most expensive book I have ever bought.

[Lord Dan]

On the other hand they cost $70 AU, which is by far the most expensive book I have ever bought.

I'm beginning to think GW sets arbitrary high prices in Australia to see what people are willing to pay. Given that the US dollar and AUS dollar are about equal there's no reason you should be paying almost 75% more than us.

[The bearded one]

@ Lord Dan: sweet, I've just been sigged again

on the topic at hand; sure, it'd be great if they were (significantly) cheaper, but the current price does not deter me from buying every single hardcover book. I've got all the 8th edition armybooks, blood in the badlands and storm of magic. Spending 7.50-10 euro's more on the obligatory book purchase that only occurs every 3-4+ months doesn't make me gnaw my tail in anguish. And in the case of this particular price rise I'm getting something better out of it. My skaven and beastmen books are starting to wither at the edges already, but the O&G book is still spikly sparkly clean.

[eron12]

Dozens? Like 24 (first applicable for dozens)? Which part have you been cast in plays of LoTR?

While I wouldn't say I'm at dozens, I expect I will be by the time I'm 42. My father, who's in his mid-60s reads Lord of the Rings at least once a year.

Depends, are we talking about University study books?

*wallet remembers and cries*

I don't remember college text books going up signifigantly on me. They were super expensive before, they are super expensive now.

[COLOR="#33ccff"]
Just look at university books as another example. Expensive to make, hardback, select audience, and extortionately priced too. The big rule book costs less than many university books of the same size.

And students complain about the cost of text books too. A lot. As well as complaining about professors who requrie an excessive number of books. If anything the comparison to text books shows just how silly GW's prices have become.

You're also paying for the authors' contributions, the artists' contributions, distribution, and then standard profit.

And some of us have been paying for that some contribution for several books now. Are illistrators still being paid for images commissioned more than ten years ago?

Standard profit is one thing, GW levels of profit are another.

[Lord Solar Plexus]

What are GW supposed to do they gave you a better product, and not charge you more for it, when apple broughy out the ipad 2 they increased the price did they not, but when gw does it suddenly its a problem.
...
I was at a tordement and watched as my opponent said how bad the binding was on his book, as he then slide the small rule book between it pages and closed it to placing his elbow on it to rest his head.

Did the ipad 1 fall apart too?

I can totally see what you mean. The other day, someone complained to me about his car, and then I saw him actually driving it. Can you imagine? He even put his case in the boot! No wonder his product deteriorates, Stupid is using it.

Everything used to cost less. Now they cost more. That's pretty much how things work.

That's not at all how things work, that's an overly simplistic approach. What's more, it's definitively not how it should work from a consumer's point of view. Some people act as if they were shareholders only and never consumers. I find that rather weird. Do you not see that with a line like that you can "justify" everything? Bread going up 100 %? "No worries, TV sets and airplanes are also getting more expensive, it all evens out!" "The litre of unleaded costs 4 Euros!" "No worries, that was to be expected."

Expected, hmm? What does that even mean? Isn't that just an empty catch phrase? What did you do, collect bullion to compensate?

[Urgat]

I'm beginning to think GW sets arbitrary high prices in Australia to see what people are willing to pay. Given that the US dollar and AUS dollar are about equal there's no reason you should be paying almost 75% more than us.

It certainly has to do with handling and shipping costs, not the product itself. It does sound absurdly prohibitive either way though, I'm not arguing that.
Oh, and I love the new books.

[azhagmorglum]

You're comparing the price difference between the more recent, absurdly overpriced softcover rulebooks at $33, not with where there were at just before the hardcover switchover.

For contrast, imagine if GW increased the price of their 10-man plastic core sets by 25% to $33. Next, as they redo each kit, they just re-release the sprue (while making the plastic more durable with slightly more bitz) for an additional $8. Is there additional value there? I'd argue no. Sure, it's only $8 more than what you were paying "before", however if what you were paying before was already too much then the new price increase would just be infuriating.

You mean like what they did with the plastic orcs? ...wait......

Come on, new edition : O&G armybook + 10 plastic orcs = 55,75 euros. Compare that to the previous edition : O&G armybook + 19 (!!) orcs = 45 euros
So for 10 more euros, you get 9 less models and hardcover...One can't tell me there's nothing wrong here , all the more that those plastic orcs are like 12 years old now !

[Mati]

Not only hard cover - colored pictures too! ;-)

[blackseven]

The army books were cheaper before... but they were cheap. Softcover is okay, but monochrome? That's product a B-list company puts out.

PP (Warmahordes) books are full color - mostly softcover with limited numbers of full color. D&D books are full color, and that hardcovers are *roughly* the same price (MSRP) as the new Army Books (D&D is in practice cheaper because WOTC/Hasbro doesn't crack down on discounters.)

Now, GW books ARE expensive, but they were (IMHO) MORE of a ripoff when they were black/white. Black/white printing is CHEAP compared to even simple 4-color printing. Plus, the product LOOKED cheap - not fitting a top of the line brand. D&D has been full color for over a decade. PP has been full color a long time as well (I think their original RPG module and books were B/W, but not the wargame.) Heck, World of Darkness uses color too (not full, IIRC.) GURPS uses full color now. Who still uses B/W? Battletech - because it's not an A-list property anymore.

[Quinzy]

And students complain about the cost of text books too. A lot. As well as complaining about professors who requrie an excessive number of books. If anything the comparison to text books shows just how silly GW's prices have become.

They are silly, but they are comparable. I don't particularly enjoy paying more money, but it's not like there's no precedent, and it's not like it's particularly unreasonable.

And some of us have been paying for that some contribution for several books now. Are illistrators still being paid for images commissioned more than ten years ago?

Standard profit is one thing, GW levels of profit are another.

You've got to pay for the new art, and the colouration of the old art. You've got to pay the graphic designers, the editor, and so on.

GW makes insane profit, sure. I don't doubt that. But once again, what they're doing is not particularly unreasonable or without precedent.

That's not at all how things work, that's an overly simplistic approach. What's more, it's definitively not how it should work from a consumer's point of view. Some people act as if they were shareholders only and never consumers. I find that rather weird. Do you not see that with a line like that you can "justify" everything? Bread going up 100 %? "No worries, TV sets and airplanes are also getting more expensive, it all evens out!" "The litre of unleaded costs 4 Euros!" "No worries, that was to be expected."

Expected, hmm? What does that even mean? Isn't that just an empty catch phrase? What did you do, collect bullion to compensate?

Last time I checked, bread wasn't a luxury item. And you appear to be ignoring the inflation issue I previously mentioned.
General purchasing power of the pound/euro/whatever has gone down.

€25 from 2001 was worth €30 in 2011.
[http://www.iisg.nl/hpw/calculate2.php]

That's a 20% difference.

Bread has actually gone up by about 20% in the last few years alone here too.
A bottle of cola was once €1 in 2001. Now it's €1.50. It had gone up by 20% in a matter of years.
Even my copy of Canterbury Tales, Penguin Classics edition, has gone up by £1 from 2003 to now RRP.

So expected means expected. Money loses value. Prices go up. More so with luxuries.

[EmperorNorton]

[COLOR="#33ccff"]Last time I checked, bread wasn't a luxury item. And you appear to be ignoring the inflation issue I previously mentioned.
General purchasing power of the pound/euro/whatever has gone down.

€25 from 2001 was worth €30 in 2011.
[http://www.iisg.nl/hpw/calculate2.php]

That's a 20% difference.

Bread has actually gone up by about 20% in the last few years alone here too.
A bottle of cola was once €1 in 2001. Now it's €1.50. It had gone up by 20% in a matter of years.
Even my copy of Canterbury Tales, Penguin Classics edition, has gone up by £1 from 2003 to now RRP.

So expected means expected. Money loses value. Prices go up. More so with luxuries.

Empire Army Book in 2007: 18€
Empire Army Book in 2012: 33€

That's a 83% difference. In half the time of the 20% inflation that had to be expected.
With an average of 2.5% of inflation per anno the book should cost 20€.
That comparison is not completely fair because of the switch to hardcover and full color printing.
Some books are still the same they've been five years ago, the Dwarfs, Wood Elves, Bretonnians. Those books are 26€ now, a 44% increase over five years.

[shelfunit.]

Where where they before the switchover? im talkin in pounds stirling....your dollars confuse me.

I buy the books because i like them, the point im making is that £5 extra hardly makes a difference to me, plus i prefer the new Hard cover books to the old ones, they are prettier

Well in 6th ed (when I re-joined the game) around 2001-2002 the army books were £10, now they are £25 - all in the space of 10 years.

[Damien 1427]

D&D books are full color, and that hardcovers are *roughly* the same price (MSRP) as the new Army Books (D&D is in practice cheaper because WOTC/Hasbro doesn't crack down on discounters.)

Bingo. RRP is anywhere between £20 and £25, depending on the book in question. That they're sold through Amazon certainly helps with the prices, usually shaving £5 or so off the price. So it's not outrageously expensive.

For what it's worth, I quite like the hardback books. I'm looking forward to them making the leap to 40k.

[Adjudicator]

could'nt agree more. to be honest i went to Amazon and picked up the 8th ed orcs and gobbos book new for £18 and i thought that was steep...

[Mr_Foulscumm]

Not everyone complained. More importantly your argument apparently ignores the fact that along with "what we asked for" we also got a 30% price increase.

"Excuse me, my steak is undercooked. Could you please get me another?"
"Certainly sir"
...
"Waiter, there seems to be a problem with my bill. You charged me more for my steak."
"We had to cook it twice."
"I don't understand"
"WE GAVE YOU WHAT YOU WANTED? WTF ARE YOU MAD FOR??!!!"

Unfortunately for our case, there is no steak involved.

Unfortunately there is no steak involved. Unfortunately it's not the only problem with the analogy either. A better why of putting it: you ordered a McDonalds hamburger and had it sent back because it was under cooked and they gave you a steak, and a price increase. Steak is so annoying when all you wanted was a McBurger.
But enough with all this talk of food! I'm getting hungry!

Mmmmm.... army book. For the record, the new books rock. The end.

[Lord Dan]

@ Lord Dan: sweet, I've just been sigged again

I couldn't ignore that kind of awesome.

Unfortunately there is no steak involved. Unfortunately it's not the only problem with the analogy either. A better why of putting it: you ordered a McDonalds hamburger and had it sent back because it was under cooked and they gave you a steak, and a price increase. Steak is so annoying when all you wanted was a McBurger.
But enough with all this talk of food! I'm getting hungry!

Mmmmm.... army book. For the record, the new books rock. The end.

Some of us just want a @#%^& cheeseburger, because we can't afford a steak every time we get hungry.

Also we were already being charged steak prices for the burger, now they're just being mean...

[eron12]

The army books were cheaper before... but they were cheap. Softcover is okay, but monochrome? That's product a B-list company puts out.

PP (Warmahordes) books are full color - mostly softcover with limited numbers of full color. D&D books are full color, and that hardcovers are *roughly* the same price (MSRP) as the new Army Books (D&D is in practice cheaper because WOTC/Hasbro doesn't crack down on discounters.)

The 4th edition Player's Handbook costs, $34.95 new (not from a discounter). That's 85% of a GW army book. I guess that could still fall within some people's definition of "roughly" but not mine. On top of that the Dnd book is 320 pages. So three times the content for 15% less money.

[Mr_Foulscumm]

I couldn't ignore that kind of awesome.



Some of us just want a @#%^& cheeseburger, because we can't afford a steak every time we get hungry.

Also we were already being charged steak prices for the burger, now they're just being mean...

Indeed!

I do understand that people think it's highway robbery.

However, the new books do look great. And I do like a well made book. Totally understand that people don't see it this way. And sadly there really isn't anything either side can do to change the situation. Love it or hate it... we're stuck with it.