Predator Tank

[Omegon]

I was thinking the other day when making a CSM tournament list that my poor Predator is always ignored and simply gathering dust. I think everyone knows why; it's expensive, has 0 mobility, and can be taken out with on lucky hit (or reduced in firepower), in short, even my Havocs are better (I like my havocs, shame they don't like me and they love the number "2" on their to hit dice... the gits).

Anyways, what you would you do to fix the poor ignored Predator in the upcoming CSM codex? would you give it a points drop? give it a special rule? Or leave it as it is and bring up other units to be in line with it's pricing?

Personally, I think it deserves a price drop and/or a special rule along the lines of it being manueverable, e.g. it can fire all weapons if it moves 6 inch's or 1 if it moves 12.

[Clarkson]

make it fast (fires all weapons 6") and cheaper would be ideal. or allow marks to be given to them... like for nurgle +1av, khornate gives something like daemonic possesion doesnt reduce your bs.., slaanesh make it fast, and tzeentch make the shots -1ap (ie lascan as str9 ap1 etc)

and not just on preds, but all rhino chassis csm stuff and with the vanq tzeentch makes ord always hit full strength even if hole isnt over the line

[Lord Damocles]

Why would it ever be a Fast vehicle?

The Blood Angels barely deserve Fast Predators, and they have an actual reason for them.


A simple points drop in line with Loyalist Marines, and possibly some different weapon options would suffice (not that they're bad as it is).

[Megad00mer]

It's a problem with the vehicle rules themselves and the Predator just suffers the most from it because of it's lack of options/special rules. Most other vehicles have ways around this whether by being Fast, Having Power of the Machine Spirit or only one gun anyway.

It's kinda dumb that a tank built to be a mobile gun platform becomes 66% less effective at that role if it moves the slightest bit.

Hopefully 6th edition changes vehicles in some way so tanks like the Predator actually become useful again.

[Erazmus_M_Wattle]

The best way to get the humble chaos predator back on tables would be to give it some funky chaotic weaponry we haven't seen before and only come on the predator. A kick ass model would do it. The new forgeworld predator executioner does it for me.

[Chapters Unwritten]

Why would it ever be a Fast vehicle?

The Blood Angels barely deserve Fast Predators, and they have an actual reason for them.


A simple points drop in line with Loyalist Marines, and possibly some different weapon options would suffice (not that they're bad as it is).

Autocannon sponsons would make that thing sought after. I wouldn't mind seeing a plasma variant too.

[Friedrich von Offenbach]

(I like my havocs, shame they don't like me and they love the number "2" on their to hit dice... the gits).

In my experience thats just because you started to notice when they rolled 2s and now you notice it even more and ignore all the other times they don't get 2s.
But anyway I think the Predator needs armour 12 sides and to cost less when using lascannons

[Voss]

It's a problem with the vehicle rules themselves and the Predator just suffers the most from it because of it's lack of options/special rules. Most other vehicles have ways around this whether by being Fast, Having Power of the Machine Spirit or only one gun anyway.

Simple fact is it was designed (and assigned a point value) with the idea that the HB sponsons would be defensive weapons. Oops.

Personally I'm resisting the idea of buying anything (except a few odd models for painting projects) until 6th hits and I have an idea of what things actually do again.

[Orthodox]

The Chaos codex has over a dozen units that need special attention. The marked cults have PA and terminator versions, there are four othet non-marked cults if chosen and possessed are included, daemons have enough forms to choose from that they have their own army book, daemon engines barely seem chaotic when there is only one type, and at least nine different legions want special characters or rules of some kind.

The predator itself could benefit from being able to fire its turret while cruising. That would mean nothing to the army as a whole; it's not an army that is even slightly defined by tanks. The only reason the predator exists is that it would be weird if marines couldn't get at tank. By that standard, the platonic ideal of a predator is a box with a gun on it. Luckily, that's what it is. All you have to work with are a box and a gun, and it isn't important enough to get special rules.

So other units have to work around it. When the predator was released, the autocannon was terrifying. Autocannons are used as anti aircraft guns. Everything with ap4 - autocannons, plasma missiles, gryphon mortars, heavy bolters, tau missile pods - are things that should penetrate power armor. If they could do that on the table top, the predator would be exactly what it's supposed to be.

Power armor was invented to that techno barbarians could punch harder, and it allows marines et al to use tank cannons like they were large rifles. Its original rules gave the save of carapace and just didn't weigh models down like carapace. I'm not saying autocannons and plasma missiles should be ap3; all ap4 weapons are weapons that should defeat power armor, so you fix the predator by fixing power armor.

[Tarax]

..., and can be taken out with on lucky hit (or reduced in firepower), ...

In what does that diver from other vehicles (except Superheavies, but I think we're not talking Apocalypse here)?

[Omegon]

In what does that diver from other vehicles (except Superheavies, but I think we're not talking Apocalypse here)?

In most cases it doesn't, save the defiler comes with daemonic possession as standard. I was making a comparison to the likes of devastators and obliterators which arenot affected by such things.

[blackcherry]

Preds got battered a bit by the change in strength of what classified as a defensive weapon back at the start of 5th edition. That and the really expensive sponson weapons dont help things. A reduction in the cost of those with perhaps some funky new weapons or vehicle upgrades would be just right.

Nothing to make them fast though. Thats not what preditors are about.

[Clarkson]

Preds got battered a bit by the change in strength of what classified as a defensive weapon back at the start of 5th edition. That and the really expensive sponson weapons dont help things. A reduction in the cost of those with perhaps some funky new weapons or vehicle upgrades would be just right.

Nothing to make them fast though. Thats not what preditors are about.

the only reason i threw in the fast thing.. is that there are soooo many blood angels chapters... some have fallen to chaos... so why cant they have the blood angel fast rhino chassis? okay you pay alot for the privilege.. say 40-60pts and call it MoS, only thing you can have.. and to make it worthwhile it knocks off 10pts off the lascannon?

[Dreadlordpaul]

Personally i would make them equal to the loyalists version or alot better