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Thread: IG 2500pts

  1. #1

    IG 2500pts Nearing the final draft

    40K Army: Imperial Guard
    I've putting together a 2500pt army. My main opponents will be Tau, Tyranids, Necrons and Space Wolfs. I admit have been out of the game a few years but before I make my purchase just wanted a 2nd opinion on my list, am I on the right lines or have I gone off the straight and narrow?

    CCS HQ

    Colonel Iron Straken
    One Master of Ordnance
    X 3 Veterans with Melta Guns
    205pts

    Platoon HQ

    Commissar
    x 4 infantry Plasma Guns
    110pts


    TROOPS

    x3 infantry Veteran Squads each having 1 Guardsman with a Meltagun and 2 Guardsman on a Lascannon. 2 squads will have Grenadiers Doctrine whilst the remaining team will be lead by Gunnery Sergent Harker
    415pts

    x2 Heavy Weapons Squads with all with Lascannons (so 6 Lascannons in total)
    165pts

    Elites

    5 Ogryns + Yarrick in a Chimera
    440pts

    Marbo
    65pts

    x 10 Ratlings
    100pts

    Fast attack

    x3 Vendetta
    390pts

    Heavy support

    x 3 Leman Russ Battle Tanks
    450pts

    x1 Basilisk
    125pts

    TOTAL 2455 Points
    so just 35pts left for something.....

    Thanks for reading.
    Last edited by Masanevre; 18-05-2012 at 19:55.

  2. #2

    Re: IG 2500pts

    well im not guard player, but you cant go wrong with Harker or Strakken
    he who fights but runs away lives to fight another day and run away

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  3. #3
    Chapter Master Bunnahabhain's Avatar
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    Re: IG 2500pts

    Hi, and welcome back to the Guard.

    I'm afraid you've missed rather with this list. There are a couple of things that aren't legal, and many things aren't awfully good.

    Not legal: the heavy weapon squads. You may only take them as part of a platoon, and you don't have a legal platoon -you're missing the standard 10 man infantry squads. You can't use veterans as part of the platoon, they are their own entry.
    My comments on each unit in italics
    Colonel Iron Straken
    One Master of Ordnance
    X 3 Veterans with Melta Guns
    205pts
    This unit is confused. Stakern works to buff surround infantry, of whom you don't have enough for him to work on. Melat guns are very short range weapons you'll need a transport to get you close enough to use, and the master of ordnance can't move and fire, so doesn't fit in this mobile unit...

    Platoon HQ

    Commissar
    x 4 infantry Plasma Guns
    110pts
    Plasma guns are expensive and dangerous. Take them on a BS4 unit- veterans or your CCS- where you get more hits. A commissar does very little good to this unit, as by the time they've failed Ld tests, they're dead. Also, you need to make the platoon legal

    TROOPS

    x3 infantry Veteran Squads each having 1 Guardsman with a Meltagun and 2 Guardsman on a Lascannon. 2 squads will have Grenadiers Doctrine whilst the remaining team will be lead by Gunnery Sergent Harker
    415pts
    veterans should always have all three special weapon. Again confused, with a short range mobile gun and long ranged static one. Harker doesn't really fit here, and the doctrines are overpriced

    x2 Heavy Weapons Squads with all with Lascannons (so 6 Lascannons in total)
    165pts
    These units are very fragile, and don't work that well. the cost you've got here is wrong, and you need to make the platoon legal

    Elites

    5 Ogryns + Yarrick in a Chimera 440pts
    This is a very expensive unit indeed, both in points and /$ terms. You'll probably be better served by something else for the while
    Marbo 65pts
    great unit

    x 10 Ratlings 100pts
    A good little unit, if used carefully

    Fast attack

    x3 Vendetta
    390pts
    Very solid anti tank/ monsterous creature units. DO NOT squadron them!

    Heavy support

    x 3 Leman Russ Battle Tanks
    Solid choices, but ideally split these up. You really do not want to squadron anything costing over 75 pts.
    450pts
    Basalisk
    OK. they're not the best artillery any more, but are solid enough


    In general, you have too many expensive characters and upgrades, so have far too few units, and many of them have poorly defined roles. You also have a mixed style of list, with a mix of armour and infantry. In this edition and this codex, very few units want any upgrade that isn't a chimera or more guns. You can have all those characters in this list, but they're not going to work at all well without a huge number (120+) more infantry, and much less armour. You can have a mixed list, but it's not going to work with all those characters.

    I'd advise you to come and look at the tactica Imperial Guard thread. A group of us put together a useful PDF ( link on page 1 of thread) and can help you get you head round the basics.
    Occasionally accused of being helpful and constructive.
    One ring Book to rule them all, one ring place to find them, One ring Codex to bring them all, and in the Darkness future bind them. Time for the unified Marine Codex.

  4. #4

    Re: IG 2500pts

    Quote Originally Posted by Bunnahabhain View Post
    Hi, and welcome back to the Guard.

    I'm afraid you've missed rather with this list. There are a couple of things that aren't legal, and many things aren't awfully good.

    Not legal: the heavy weapon squads. You may only take them as part of a platoon, and you don't have a legal platoon -you're missing the standard 10 man infantry squads. You can't use veterans as part of the platoon, they are their own entry.
    My comments on each unit in italics
    Colonel Iron Straken
    One Master of Ordnance
    X 3 Veterans with Melta Guns
    205pts
    This unit is confused. Stakern works to buff surround infantry, of whom you don't have enough for him to work on. Melat guns are very short range weapons you'll need a transport to get you close enough to use, and the master of ordnance can't move and fire, so doesn't fit in this mobile unit...

    Platoon HQ

    Commissar
    x 4 infantry Plasma Guns
    110pts
    Plasma guns are expensive and dangerous. Take them on a BS4 unit- veterans or your CCS- where you get more hits. A commissar does very little good to this unit, as by the time they've failed Ld tests, they're dead. Also, you need to make the platoon legal

    TROOPS

    x3 infantry Veteran Squads each having 1 Guardsman with a Meltagun and 2 Guardsman on a Lascannon. 2 squads will have Grenadiers Doctrine whilst the remaining team will be lead by Gunnery Sergent Harker
    415pts
    veterans should always have all three special weapon. Again confused, with a short range mobile gun and long ranged static one. Harker doesn't really fit here, and the doctrines are overpriced

    x2 Heavy Weapons Squads with all with Lascannons (so 6 Lascannons in total)
    165pts
    These units are very fragile, and don't work that well. the cost you've got here is wrong, and you need to make the platoon legal

    Elites

    5 Ogryns + Yarrick in a Chimera 440pts
    This is a very expensive unit indeed, both in points and /$ terms. You'll probably be better served by something else for the while
    Marbo 65pts
    great unit

    x 10 Ratlings 100pts
    A good little unit, if used carefully

    Fast attack

    x3 Vendetta
    390pts
    Very solid anti tank/ monsterous creature units. DO NOT squadron them!

    Heavy support

    x 3 Leman Russ Battle Tanks
    Solid choices, but ideally split these up. You really do not want to squadron anything costing over 75 pts.
    450pts
    Basalisk
    OK. they're not the best artillery any more, but are solid enough


    In general, you have too many expensive characters and upgrades, so have far too few units, and many of them have poorly defined roles. You also have a mixed style of list, with a mix of armour and infantry. In this edition and this codex, very few units want any upgrade that isn't a chimera or more guns. You can have all those characters in this list, but they're not going to work at all well without a huge number (120+) more infantry, and much less armour. You can have a mixed list, but it's not going to work with all those characters.

    I'd advise you to come and look at the tactica Imperial Guard thread. A group of us put together a useful PDF ( link on page 1 of thread) and can help you get you head round the basics.
    Thank you for the feedback, just what I'm looking for. I assume should I split up the 3 Leman Russ tanks that would be all my 3 choices taken? and the same would apply if I was to split up all the Vendetta's? I'll have to rethink and perhaps drop the heavy weapons squads and have several squads of 10 with lasguns. And change both the HQ's

  5. #5

    Re: IG 2500pts

    Updated please dissect it


    CCS HQ

    Colonel Iron Straken
    x 2 plasma
    Heavy Flamer
    Vox Caster
    140 pts

    Troops

    Veteran Squad
    Gunnery Sergent Harker
    x 2 grenade launchers
    Heavy Flamer
    Chimera
    210 pts

    Veteran Sergeant w. Plasma Pistol
    X 3 Plasma Gun
    125 pts

    Veteran Sergeant w. Plasma Pistol
    X 3 Plasma Gun
    125 pts

    Veteran Sergeant w. Plasma Pistol
    X 3 Meltagun
    110 pts

    Veteran Sergeant w. Plasma Pistol
    X 3 Meltagun
    110 pts

    Elites

    5 Ogryns + Yarrick in a Chimera
    440pts

    Marbo
    65pts

    x 10 Ratlings
    100pts

    Fast attack

    Squad 1
    1Vendetta
    130pts

    Squad 2
    1 Vendetta
    130pts

    Squad 3
    1 Vendetta
    130pts
    Should I remove 1 more a squad of rough riders?

    Heavy support

    Squad 1
    x1 Leman Russ Battle Tanks
    150pts

    Squad 1
    x1 Leman Russ Battle Tanks
    150pts


    Squad 1
    x1 Leman Russ Battle Tanks
    150pts

    Should I remove one for a long range weapon, if so what would be best?


    Now only at 2265 Add more chimera's?
    Last edited by Masanevre; 11-05-2012 at 22:51.

  6. #6
    Veteran Sergeant Scibadi's Avatar
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    Re: IG 2500pts

    I would replace the heavy flamer in the ccs for a medic as you have plasma, also to help protect the expensive straken.

    Also I wouldnt give a veteran squad both harker and a chimera as it negates some of his bonuses.
    A thousand pigeons, each with a two ounce explosive capsule, landed at intervals on a specific target might be a seriously inconvenient surprise.

  7. #7
    Chapter Master Gaargod's Avatar
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    Re: IG 2500pts

    Command squad is better, but still... perhaps not great. Straken is great - in an infantry blob list. Otherwise, kinda meh. Also, go for either all plasma or all flamers - I tend towards all flamers, as you can take 3x flamers and 1x heavy flamer in a CCS. Anti-horde goodness. They also don't need a vox really (unless you're going for lots of infantry platoons).

    I'd personally lose Harker's squad - give them 3x plasma or melta, to taste. Keep the chimera, with its heavy flamer/multi laser.

    Give the footslogging squads chimeras. I'm assuming 3 of the vets ride in the vendettas, but that still leaves your CCS and one squad of vets walking. Don't have anyone walking, if avoidable (except ratlings etc, obviously).

    Similarly, rough riders are fun, but vendettas are ridiculously better.


    If you're looking at long range stuff, think about manticores. Fun things, great against hordes (or vehicles, with direct hits). If you're short on points, know that your ratlings and ogryns+yarrick are technically not very points efficient, compared to the spammed stuff. Depends if you want to go totally maxed out.
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  8. #8

    Re: IG 2500pts

    CCS HQ

    x 3 Flamer
    Heavy Flamer

    Currently 85pts

    Who should I have lead now I've dropped Straken?

    Troops

    Veteran Squad
    Gunnery Sergent Harker
    x 3 grenade launchers
    Heavy Flamer

    140 pts
    Dropped Chimera now

    Veteran Sergeant w. Plasma Pistol
    X 3 Plasma Gun
    125 pts

    Veteran Sergeant w. Plasma Pistol
    X 3 Plasma Gun
    125 pts

    Veteran Sergeant w. Plasma Pistol
    X 3 Meltagun
    110 pts

    Veteran Sergeant w. Plasma Pistol
    X 3 Meltagun
    110 pts


    Elites

    5 Ogryns + Yarrick in a Chimera
    440pts

    Marbo
    65pts

    x 10 Ratlings
    100pts

    Fast attack

    Squad 1

    1Vendetta
    130pts

    Squad 2

    1 Vendetta
    130pts

    Squad 3

    1 Vendetta
    130pts

    Heavy support

    Squad 1
    x1 Leman Russ Battle Tanks
    150pts

    Squad 1
    x1 Leman Russ Battle Tanks
    150pts


    Squad 1
    x1 Leman Russ Battle Tanks (possibly swap for a manticore which is 10pts more)
    150pts



    Now Currently at 2140, So thats 360 pts to spend, of course need someone in charge of CSS
    Last edited by Masanevre; 13-05-2012 at 18:46.

  9. #9
    Chapter Master Bunnahabhain's Avatar
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    Re: IG 2500pts

    The Guard functions perfectly well with faceless masses with many, many big guns. You don't need a single special character. The CCS has a normal officer in charge already.
    Besides, you have Commissar Yarrick, hero of Armageddon, in the list. How many leaders do you need?

    Where to spend points....
    275 on 5 x chimeras for the CCS and 4 veteran squads without Harker for a start.
    Occasionally accused of being helpful and constructive.
    One ring Book to rule them all, one ring place to find them, One ring Codex to bring them all, and in the Darkness future bind them. Time for the unified Marine Codex.

  10. #10

    Re: IG 2500pts

    So Harker is Gone, Chimeras are in. Now just 90pts spare


    CCS HQ
    Company Commander
    x 2 Flamer
    Heavy Flamer
    Chimera
    135pts


    Troops

    Veteran Squad
    x 3 grenade launchers
    Heavy Flamer
    Chimera
    140 pts

    Veteran Sergeant w. Plasma Pistol
    X 3 Plasma Gun
    Chimera
    180 pts


    Veteran Sergeant w. Plasma Pistol
    X 3 Plasma Gun
    Chimera
    180 pts

    Veteran Sergeant w. Plasma Pistol
    X 3 Meltagun
    Chimera
    165 pts

    Veteran Sergeant w. Plasma Pistol
    X 3 Meltagun
    Chimera
    165 pts


    Elites

    5 Ogryns + Yarrick in a Chimera
    440pts

    Marbo
    65pts

    x 10 Ratlings
    100pts

    Fast attack

    Squad 1
    1Vendetta
    130pts

    Squad 2
    1 Vendetta
    130pts

    Squad 3
    1 Vendetta
    130pts

    Heavy support

    Squad 1
    x1 Leman Russ Battle Tanks
    150pts

    Squad 1
    x1 Leman Russ Battle Tanks
    150pts


    Squad 1
    x1 Leman Russ Battle Tanks (possibly swap for a manticore which is 10pts more)
    150pts



    Now Currently at 2410 pts
    Last edited by Masanevre; 13-05-2012 at 21:31.

  11. #11

    Re: IG 2500pts

    Is that a competitive army I have there, strong enough to take on Tau, Tyranids, Necrons and Space Wolfs? What could I spend the last 90pts on? Any vital ingrediant not there? And Chimeras heavy flamers or heavy bolters?

  12. #12
    Chapter Master Bunnahabhain's Avatar
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    Re: IG 2500pts

    You're almost there...
    Avoid the infantry heavy flamers. You don't need them, and you certainly don't need to use BS4 units to wield expensive ones, when your BS3 vehicles get them much more cheaply.

    I'd change the Company command squad to 4 plasmas- (the ability to issue orders to yourself means you can get round overheats) and change one of the plasma vets to grenade launchers.
    For chimeras, the standard layout( which works) is magnetise, but your default is Heavy bolters of squads with 24"+ weapons, and heavy flamers on those with meltas and other short ranged stuff.

    I would have two russes and a manticore

    The main non competitive element now is the massive points sink of Yarrick and the Ogryns. It's not they won't do stuff, but they cost alot of points for what they do do.
    It doesn't help that you have a very limited number of elements on foot, so they'll eat alot of fire.

    For the spare points, I'd get advisors for the command squad, and autocannons for the plasma and grenade launcher squads.
    Occasionally accused of being helpful and constructive.
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  13. #13
    Chapter Master hazmiter's Avatar
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    Re: IG 2500pts

    Maybe it might be worthwhile taking some storm troopers in a chimera with yarrik, cheaper than ogryns, bs4 str 3 ap3, even marines are sorta wary of those, or another unit of veterens.
    Originally Posted by Grand Master Raziel
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  14. #14

    Re: IG 2500pts

    Quote Originally Posted by Bunnahabhain View Post
    You're almost there...
    Avoid the infantry heavy flamers. You don't need them, and you certainly don't need to use BS4 units to wield expensive ones, when your BS3 vehicles get them much more cheaply.

    I'd change the Company command squad to 4 plasmas- (the ability to issue orders to yourself means you can get round overheats) and change one of the plasma vets to grenade launchers.
    For chimeras, the standard layout( which works) is magnetise, but your default is Heavy bolters of squads with 24"+ weapons, and heavy flamers on those with meltas and other short ranged stuff.

    I would have two russes and a manticore

    The main non competitive element now is the massive points sink of Yarrick and the Ogryns. It's not they won't do stuff, but they cost alot of points for what they do do.
    It doesn't help that you have a very limited number of elements on foot, so they'll eat alot of fire.

    For the spare points, I'd get advisors for the command squad, and autocannons for the plasma and grenade launcher squads.


    Which advisors should I take?
    Last edited by Masanevre; 16-05-2012 at 19:29.

  15. #15
    Chapter Master Bunnahabhain's Avatar
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    Re: IG 2500pts

    All of them have value....

    If you're going reserve heavy ( probably not from this list) then the astropath is very useful.

    If you envisage reserve heavy enemy lists (quite common), the officer of the fleet to break up their arrival, and render them more vulnerable to your firepower is useful.

    If you have a mainly static command squad, then a Master of Ordnance is very useful. If you don't, then avoid.
    Occasionally accused of being helpful and constructive.
    One ring Book to rule them all, one ring place to find them, One ring Codex to bring them all, and in the Darkness future bind them. Time for the unified Marine Codex.

  16. #16

    Re: IG 2500pts

    And are you saying drop the multi laser on the chimeras so both main turrent and sponsor have the same weapon either HB or HF? or you just meaning change the sponsor to either HF or HB depending on troops inside?
    Last edited by Masanevre; 16-05-2012 at 19:43. Reason: Formmating

  17. #17
    Chapter Master Bunnahabhain's Avatar
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    Re: IG 2500pts

    No,no, no!
    Multi-lasers are great weapons, and you want to keep them on your chimeras, (unless you have easy access to the FW ones anyway...) You just change the hull weapon
    Occasionally accused of being helpful and constructive.
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  18. #18

    Re: IG 2500pts

    Should I putting Krak or Frag in the grenade launchers?
    Total points now stands at 2450 pts anything worth getting for 50 points?

    CCS HQ

    Company Commander w Plasma pistol
    X 3 Plasma
    The officer of the fleet
    Chimera

    190pts


    Troops

    Veteran Squad
    x 3 grenade launchers
    x 1 Auto Cannon
    Chimera (Sponsor Heavy bolter)
    160 pts

    Veteran Sergeant w. Plasma Pistol
    X 3 grenade launchers
    x 1 Auto Cannon
    Chimera (Sponsor Heavy bolter)
    160 pts

    Veteran Sergeant w. Plasma Pistol
    X 3 Plasma Gun
    x 1 Auto Cannon
    Chimera (Sponsor Heavy bolter)
    190 pts

    Veteran Sergeant w. Plasma Pistol
    X 3 Meltagun
    Chimera (Sponsor Heavy Flamer)
    165 pts

    Veteran Sergeant w. Plasma Pistol
    X 3 Meltagun (Sponsor Heavy Flamer)
    Chimera
    165 pts


    Elites

    Storm Troopers Led by Yarrick in a Chimera
    405 Points

    Marbo
    65pts

    x 10 Ratlings
    100pts

    Fast attack

    Squad 1
    1Vendetta
    130pts

    Squad 2
    1 Vendetta
    130pts

    Squad 3
    1 Vendetta
    130pts

    Heavy support

    Squad 1
    x1 Leman Russ Battle Tanks
    150pts

    Squad 2
    x1 Leman Russ Battle Tanks
    150pts

    Squad 3
    x1 manticore 160pts
    Last edited by Masanevre; 16-05-2012 at 20:00.

  19. #19
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    Re: IG 2500pts

    Quote Originally Posted by Masanevre View Post
    Should I putting Krak or Frag in the grenade launchers?
    Total points now stands at 2450 pts anything worth getting for 50 points?

    CCS HQ

    Company Commander w Plasma pistol
    X 3 Plasma
    The officer of the fleet
    Chimera

    190pts


    Troops

    Veteran Squad
    x 3 grenade launchers
    x 1 Auto Cannon
    Chimera (Sponsor Heavy bolter)
    160 pts

    Veteran Sergeant w. Plasma Pistol
    X 3 grenade launchers
    x 1 Auto Cannon
    Chimera (Sponsor Heavy bolter)
    160 pts

    Veteran Sergeant w. Plasma Pistol
    X 3 Plasma Gun
    x 1 Auto Cannon
    Chimera (Sponsor Heavy bolter)
    190 pts

    Veteran Sergeant w. Plasma Pistol
    X 3 Meltagun
    Chimera (Sponsor Heavy Flamer)
    165 pts

    Veteran Sergeant w. Plasma Pistol
    X 3 Meltagun (Sponsor Heavy Flamer)
    Chimera
    165 pts


    Elites

    Storm Troopers Led by Yarrick in a Chimera
    405 Points

    Marbo
    65pts

    x 10 Ratlings
    100pts

    Fast attack

    Squad 1
    1Vendetta
    130pts

    Squad 2
    1 Vendetta
    130pts

    Squad 3
    1 Vendetta
    130pts

    Heavy support

    Squad 1
    x1 Leman Russ Battle Tanks
    150pts

    Squad 2
    x1 Leman Russ Battle Tanks
    150pts

    Squad 3
    x1 manticore 160pts

    Looking very very nice! Personally I don't like the manticore, probably because I don't own one and have never used one but I much prefer to get all up in their face, I either play a firing line or an all out offensive, and I find with objective based games I just mech is up and unleash 24" range weaponary like Leman Russ Demolishers and Plasma Guns (not a fan of melta guns). For 50 points you could give one of your CCS a medi pack maybe to keep your plasma gunners alive? Or possibly switch some grenade launchers for some plasma guns.

    Grenade launchers by the way you can choose each time you fire which round you use.

    And can you use Yarrick if you already have a HQ choice? Not sure what the rules are, but I thought you were only allowed one HQ?

  20. #20
    Chapter Master hazmiter's Avatar
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    Re: IG 2500pts

    2 hq per list, he has a legal list.
    Originally Posted by Grand Master Raziel
    Thou art a jerk, Brother Dark Angel.
    DAKKADAKKADAKKA(reroll)DAKKA
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