2012 releases

[bobafett_h]

You know, I still don't get why people call it a "mystery image". It's a 12 month process and you can tell from the first two or three what it is.

There is still the "mystery" about what the image actually represents. We don't yet know if it will be for a new Codex, White Dwarf Codex, 6th Edition rulebook, 6th Edition Starter set or something else entirely...

As much as I'd love to see Chaos vs Eldar in the starter set (especially since they are the two armies I collect and I think it would be an excellent example of the contrasting fluff, rules, models and colour schemes available in the 40K universe), the DA VS Chaos rumour is far more likely to be what actually happens. There's always possibilities it might be something else, but the DA vs Chaos rumour has been brought up numerous times by various rumourmongers already. GW has also hinted at it with clues like the new 40k Paint Set and WD spine image which is clearly of a Dark Angel. We also know that GW loves Space Marines and has so far not been able do a starter set without them...

[drbored]

No idea how you come to your conclusions, but this is crazy talk.

The starter set will be Dark Angels vs. Chaos Space Marines. Believe it or leave it.

I'll leave it. People seem to easily forget that everything here is still rumor, not set in stone, not fact. I've expressed the logic behind the starter *not* being DA vs. CSM in other topics too many times to be bothered to post it all again (in before someone decides to be a smart-alek and says GW doesn't always follow logic). I've also got other reasons to suspect that DA players are going to be disappointed in the contents of the starter...

I could be wrong, but I've got a sneaking suspicion that a lot of the rumors people seem to be taking as 'fact' are not going to come to reality. Time will tell.

I don't see how this would preclude them from being in the starter set at all. In Warhammer it's High Elves and Skaven. Neither of those armies have 8th edition army books, in fact, High Elves being from 2007 is the 4th oldest army book currently in use, and Skavens got a new book about 8 months before 8th so are unlikely to see a new book any time soon (maybe not during 8th at all).

By that logic, it could easily be Chaos vs. Eldar, or Tau vs. Space Marines. All 4 of those books haven't been updated for years, just like High Elves.

I'll retract my point about the starter set *having* to be something recently (or soon to be) updated, but I won't settle for DA vs. Chaos until it happens.

[Azzy]

Hey, I hear there's this river in Egypt...

I'll leave it. People seem to easily forget that everything here is still rumor, not set in stone, not fact.

So, I suppose your denial is based upon the "rumor quantum superstate theory". Sorry, but when a rumor comes from a source that's been known to be quite accurate, I'll go with that over some spurious "logic".

I've expressed the logic behind the starter *not* being DA vs. CSM in other topics too many times to be bothered to post it all again (in before someone decides to be a smart-alek and says GW doesn't always follow logic). I've also got other reasons to suspect that DA players are going to be disappointed in the contents of the starter...

You "logic" seems based mostly around the idea that an army in a starter set should have a codex release close by--something that's been refuted. Other parts of your "logic" have been equal'y spurious.

By that logic, it could easily be Chaos vs. Eldar, or Tau vs. Space Marines. All 4 of those books haven't been updated for years, just like High Elves.

Except for the fact that none of the reliable rumormancers have supported any of those combinations. You're grasping at straws.

[MooseOnTheLoose]

That is foolish dude. There is nothing to support your idea only vague suspicions.

HAstings is a respected rumor monger he put forward the idea not us.

Before that particular rumoor came out most DA players myself included expected a 2014 release.

and also what do you think is going too come between those two xenos codicies because if you look at the release history its PA then non so releasing eldar then tau would break that well established chain.

Edit: Darnok beat me to it.

I was actually under the impression Hastings and Harry had mentioned Chaos and Eldar. Not DA, and DA have become wish listed based off of a WD cover spine, as I believe if you look at non wish listing posters CSM, Eldar and Tau are the only armies even being discussed by them.

[althathir]

I was actually under the impression Hastings and Harry had mentioned Chaos and Eldar. Not DA, and DA have become wish listed based off of a WD cover spine, as I believe if you look at non wish listing posters CSM, Eldar and Tau are the only armies even being discussed by them.

Harry did mention eldar and CSM, but changed his mind because hastings said it was DA vs. CSM.

[MooseOnTheLoose]

Harry did mention eldar and CSM, but changed his mind because hastings said it was DA vs. CSM.

Reverse to my knowledge and to his latest post:
http://www.warseer.com/forums/showth...65#post6217465

[Orphic]

Not quite. Harry suggested Eldar and Chaos until Hastings said it was DA vs Chaos. Harry said not to bet against Hastings and backed what he said. CSM, Eldar and Tau are the only rumoured codices at the moment, with DA even having Stickmonkey saying they won't be redone for a long time.

[MooseOnTheLoose]

Lol damn rumourmongers need to create a ritual circle and move forward summoning together... unless, they are already trying to channel the power of Nagash!

[Scribe of Khorne]

Not quite. Harry suggested Eldar and Chaos until Hastings said it was DA vs Chaos. Harry said not to bet against Hastings and backed what he said. CSM, Eldar and Tau are the only rumoured codices at the moment, with DA even having Stickmonkey saying they won't be redone for a long time.

I wish we could somehow gamble on it. Everyone put up some cash winners split the pot. That would be an interesting way to do rumour threads.

[Voss]

Reverse to my knowledge and to his latest post:
http://www.warseer.com/forums/showth...65#post6217465

Nope. Its slightly unclear there, but Harry is quoting his original post (which has Eldar vs. Chaos) but saying swap DA and Eldar. He's just presenting the swap before he presents his original post, so it comes across as slightly muddled.

[Starchild]

Not quite. Harry suggested Eldar and Chaos until Hastings said it was DA vs Chaos. Harry said not to bet against Hastings and backed what he said. CSM, Eldar and Tau are the only rumoured codices at the moment, with DA even having Stickmonkey saying they won't be redone for a long time.

I could have sworn that Harry said that two codices will be out before Dark Angels. So Chaos Space Marines, Tau, Dark Angels -or- Chaos Space Marines, Eldar, Dark Angels. Current data says Eldar won't be ready until late 2013 so it looks like Tau might be first next year.

[Darnok]

Harry did mention eldar and CSM, but changed his mind because hastings said it was DA vs. CSM.

This, a hundred times, and then some. I can't believe that we're still discussing the contents of a box that have been confirmed by the rumour guy (Hastings, for those wondering).

[Tymell]

There is still the "mystery" about what the image actually represents. We don't yet know if it will be for a new Codex, White Dwarf Codex, 6th Edition rulebook, 6th Edition Starter set or something else entirely...

Could be, or it could just be a picture on the spine. There might be something meaningful about it, but we don't know there is, so any mystery is for the time being whatever someone chooses to read into it.

[RandomThoughts]

This, a hundred times, and then some. I can't believe that we're still discussing the contents of a box that have been confirmed by the rumour guy (Hastings, for those wondering).

It was either Hastings or Harry, but one of the "big" guys started a whole thread a while back just to remind as how much all of their rumors are still guesswork.

Therefore, and because I trusted other rumors in the past and got burned, I don't take any rumors as truth anymore. Will the starter contain Chaos (cultists) and Dark Angels? Probably. But I wouldn't say it is confirmed until we get to actually see it.

Just my two cent.

.........

Now, regarding the release order, I think the current favorite is Chaos shortly after 6th, then Tau in January/February 2013, possibly knightly Marines (Dark Angels or Black Templar) in mid 2013, and then Eldar towards the end of 2013.

Chaos was first put forward a long time ago by Harry as first 6th edition codex. I think someone recently leaked that the codex was already at the printers. Others might have spoken out in support as well, but I don't follow Chaos that closely.

The Tau codex was also penciled in by Harry for early 2013. A while back, during late 2011, a few of us actually believed Tau to be an early 2012 Codex. I had just started to take interest in rumors, and some of the same rumors (if I remember correctly) that had been true about the Necron book predicted Tau to be next. We all know this didn't turn out, but the Tau rumor threat still seems to be going strongly (I seldom venture there), and Harry's Jan/Feb 2013 prediction seems to be the best call we have at the moment.

Then there is the Codex Knightly Marines. This one is actually interesting. If I remember correctly, a lot of people were talking about Black Templars, then a few new models leaked, and all of a sudden voices arose that said: Wait a second, why would Black Templars need an inner circle, isn't that a Dark Angels thing?! Then people theorized that all previous Black Templar rumors had actually been about Dark Angels, and the whole rumor community did a 180° turn on the Codex Knightly Marines pretty much overnight. Then came the Dark Angels in the starter revelation and the new paint set, and all of a sudden everyone is talking about a Dark Angels codex all the time. The only kind of "hard" confirmation I remember is when a while back somebody claimed his brother who works as a printer had seen the Codex Dark Angels running through their press. ...if I remember correctly, please correct me if I'm wrong.

Then a few weeks ago the Early Eldar Rumors thread popped up. This one I'm following more closely, as I exclusively play Eldar at the moment. It pretty much claims that work on the Eldar Codex has just begun, and that we're about 18-24 months from a release.

Beyond that, there lies only darkness (and the wasteland of Mordor).

Regards
RT

[NixonAsADaemonPrince]

Exactly. I've never seen you get your facts absolutely wrong Hastings (As in the contents of a starter set wrong, I did see you get a date for a release wrong by a month once, the heinous crime ).

Thus I firmly believe that the starter set will contain Chaos vs Dark Angels, as that is what Hastings has set in stone. Now I'm not asking anyone else to agree with this, people are entitled to come to their own conclusions from the information they are given, and are also entitled to express their opinion on the matter. It just gets tiring when people constantly reiterate their opinion, without bringing forward any new evidence to support it, even though others have politely disagreed and provided compelling counter evidence to the assumptions being made.

Just my thoughts, please let the good rumourmancers continue with their enlightening predictions and thus amiable discussion blossom from that most bountiful of fruit!

[Captain Collius]

If you look one of the other signs pointing to a greater DA presence in sales is the fact that the new paint set has Dark Angels marines on it.

I know in an ideal world when a GW employee sells the starter set they will also sell the purchaser the starter paint set hence why people have done of the deep end on the DA rumors.

[The French Guy]

@ RandomThoughts:
Thanks, that's quite good summary. Should help some people! ^^

[prowla]

You "logic" seems based mostly around the idea that an army in a starter set should have a codex release close by--something that's been refuted. Other parts of your "logic" have been equal'y spurious.

Except that there is some kind of business logic behind GW's decisions what to put in which box. Personally, my logic says we won't see a DA vs CSM starter. Here's some of the reasons:

-Starter boxes are black and white "good humies vs. bad xenos" deals to cater to the kids.
-Starters have one xenos army, to look more interesting.
-Starter armies have relatively recently upgraded ranges, so the kids have the temptation to expand the army.
-Starter boxes tend to have models with simple rules and even those are stupidified - Chaos sorcerer has been suggested, but I don't see psykers probable.

Hence, my guess is we'll see DA vs. Necrons in the box. Nidz would be the second.

[Theocracity]

Except that there is some kind of business logic behind GW's decisions what to put in which box. Personally, my logic says we won't see a DA vs CSM starter. Here's some of the reasons:

I think you're confusing 'business logic' with 'gamer logic.' There might be plenty of metrics we don't have access to that will effect their logic.

Edit: For example, they might think the market for Ultramarines is tapped out at the moment, and they'd like to run through some stock of older DA stuff in preparation for a new release next year (plus tie them into the 25th). Meanwhile, Chaos is an iconic villain and they can use the kit to introduce new models that will exist with the codex, thus getting sales from vets, while building interest with new players that can be rewarded with the new codex.

[Scribe of Khorne]

You also have to consider that we are not getting marines vs marines potentially. If the Chaos army shifts away from CSM into Cultists or a more 'horde' feel, then visually it could be quite diverse, at least a lot more then marine vs spiky marine, would make you think.