Quote Originally Posted by Dazza612 View Post
I don't disagree with you that grey knights are an excellent shooting army, I disagree with you however it's the best codex. In fact the top ranking army at Adepticon 2012 was Necrons not grey knights and if more people were willing to paint up an entire guard army and all the vehicles you'd see guard at the top of the list and not grey knights.

http://bloodofkittens.com/blog/2012/...lts-and-lists/

Also grey knights would have to get to mid-field first, that's 2-3 turns off being shot at before you get to mid-field and then even when they did get to mid-field, hammerheads, devilfish and gunships if you're a smart player would have pulled out of that 24-30 inch range. Plus the suits get a jump back move and the range on the broadsides is 48 inches (actually may even be more). In fact I had a friend who took Tau to a tournament and he had all wins and one draw in Australia. Tau are lacking a lot compared to the new codexes (you can never compare an old codex to a recent codex - nids aside which was just an aberration) and if the rumours about the new codex come true Tau will be a very very good shotting army maybe even better than Guard.

Also funny how space wolves never seem to get mentioned as a good shooting army and you only mentioned IG, GK, DE and Necrons, a potential 25 str 8 missiles shooting at8 different targets a turn isn't anything to sneeze at.
Thats the seeding for the final 16, GK won it (the wolf player who won it last year was the runner up). If you look you'll notice that GK make up about 40 percent of the 16 armies that played in the second series of games (IIRC GK made up over 20 percent of the field). Pretty sure crons made it too the final four so they had a good showing.

As far as wolves are concerned, I don't think they're quite to level of guard, crons, and GK at shooting. They've become a bit more of a hybrid army, mainly because their great at getting rid of transports, but they don't have quite as much anti-infantry firepower as the other armies I mentioned.

Quote Originally Posted by Charistoph View Post
Not quite. 4 effective shots against a single vehicle is great. 4 effective shots against a horde is not even standard business when you should be plugging it with a lot more.



Sorry, I meant in Assault. But you also should consider that they will probably be outnumbering the Grey Knights, as you're looking at 2-3 Fire Warriors per Grey Knight on the field?

But that still doesn't counter the fact that Grey Knights would be a far less scary army to face if they hit like little children in Assault. The reason Grey Knights are scary is they bring the pain with their shooting AND in close combat. That fact also applies to Space Wolves, too.
I should have explained that better. Volume fire isn't only for use againist infantry, its really what made mech eldar work in 4th because it gets rid of armour. Its fairly important with the cover system in place because more shots gives more opportunties for your opponent to fail a cover save on a vehicle. Those 4 shots are worth less on infantry but the same can be said for pulse rifles and str 5 stormbolters againist vehicles.

Depends on the army build. If the GK player is running termies or purifiers then the tau will have numbers (I think purifiers are actually a decent matchup for tau tbh cause they are an assault unit). But regular strike squads would be looking at close to a 2 to 1 ratio without psy ammo. Depending on the situation firewarriors could hold their own (mainly if their in cover), but in the open GK shooting combined with their durability make for an easy time of it. What hurts tau is no specials in their squads, and expensive transports.

For Wolves I think the assault aspect is more important than it is for knights depending on the build. I think to get the most out of wolves they have to take advantage of the ccw & bp, GK just have so many shots within 24 inches that I think they're willing to keep it shooting match unless they feel CC is even more advantageous.