Simple Flier rules

[MajorWesJanson]

I was thinking about what I would like to see for fliers in 6th, and came up with this:

Fliers are a type of vehicle.
Fliers are any model which uses the large oval base and flying stem, or classified as a Vehicle-flier in its rules
All measuring of movement, embarkation/disembarkation, assaults, and whether a flier is on the table is done by the base.

Fliers and moving-
Fliers may move at the following speeds-
Combat speed 0 - 12"
Cruising speed 12+ - 24"
Flat out 24+ - 36"
Fliers ignore all terrain and may not take cover from terrain.
Fliers may move other other models, but not end its move with its base overlapping other models.

Fliers and shooting-
Fliers moving at combat speed may fire all weapons. Ordinance weapons with the one-shot rule do not prevent the firing of other weapons.
Fliers moving at cruising speed may fire one weapon
Fliers moving flat out may not fire weapons

Shooting at fliers-
Shooting distance to and from fliers is measured from the weapon barrel of the shooter to the hull, wings, or tail of the flier (weapon barrels and missiles/bombs on the flier are ignored, as well as decorative elements like antennae)
Fliers may not gain a cover save from buildings, but do have a cover save based on their speed in the previous movement phase:
Stationary 6+
Combat Speed 5+
Cruising Speed 4+
Flat Out 3+
Fliers may not be hit by blast or template weapons
Fliers count immobilized results as "wrecked" results
If a flier is wrecked, remove it from its base. If the physical model of the flier would be on top of another model, that model takes a strength 4 hit and is moved the minimum distance to not be under the flier
If a flier explodes, no crater is generated

Assaulting fliers-
Fliers may be assaulted, but do not follow the normal rules to hit a flier. The to hit roll to hit a flier is based on the speed it moved in its last movement phase:
Stationary 4+ to hit
Combat Speed 5+ to hit
Cruising speed 6+ to hit
Flat out 7+ to hit
Jump and jet infantry, jetbikes, and units that move like jump and jet infantry or jetbikes may add 2 to their rolls when assaulting a flier.

Fliers and transporting troops-
Fliers do not have fire points
Embarkation and disembarkation- models may disembark anywhere within 2 inches horizontally of a fliers base (including any level of a ruin or other terrain) or embark if they are within the same distance.
Drop troops- units may disembark at any point during a flier's movement on a line drawn between the fliers starting and final positions, using the deep strike rules, but take a dangerous terrain test based on the speed of flier. Combat speed:
Combat speed- 1s rolled are failures
Cruising speed- 1s and 2s are failures
Flat out- 1s, 2s, and 3s, are failures

If there are passengers on flier that suffers a wrecked or explodes, instead of emergency disembarkation, choose any point within 6" of where the fliers base was, deploy the unit so that all models in the unit are in base to base contact, and then roll dangerous terrain checks as follows: Wrecked result, 1s and 2s are failures. Explodes result, 1,s, 2s, and 3s are failures

Ramming fliers- fliers may not be rammed. If a tank shock move would end with any part of the vehicle overlapping the fliers base, the move ends when the tank would touch the base (this does allow the tank to move within 1 inch of an enemy model, but does not count as an assault)

[theunwantedbeing]

Aren't these rules supposed to be simple?

[MajorWesJanson]

Aren't these rules supposed to be simple?

Looks like a lot, but it is mostly based on the speed the flier moved. You could pretty much render it into a single chart and some extra sentences. I sort of followed the format of the vehicle section in the rulebook though.

[lanrak]

Its not realy the OPs fault the extra rules look complicated.
Look how over complicated the current 40k rule are!

The core rules JUST cover standard infantry!
The other 13 types of unit have to use USR /special rules!

And from a game mechanic point of view , 40k only has 2 types of unit.WHY artificualy seperate them into 14 seperate types?

Because WHFB game mechanics DO NOT fit that well with 40ks game play thats why! (The stat line is for large blocks of troops armed with primative hand weapons and armour.)

IF you covered mobility in the characteristics , (how and how far units move.)Flyers could be intergrated alot easier.

But then a unified characteristic set and resolution methods would reduce 40k rule set to about 40 pages, that cover everything!
(Inlcuding supression, improved morale ,C&C and intergated air and artilery missions....)

[Haravikk]

I kind of like the Flyer rules in Apocalypse personally and they could be simplified fairly easily:
Starts in Reserve, can act normally once it enters the battlefield.
Can move up to 36", has to move at least 24". If it goes off the table then it goes back it goes back into reserve but can re-enter when the player chooses.
Ignores terrain and units for movement and shooting. Can stop over terrain if it fits. Never receives cover bonuses or counts intervening units when being shot at.
Max range of a weapon is reduced by 12" when firing at a flyer, only hits on 6's. Flyers cannot be assaulted. They can be rammed by other flyers, but have a 3+ save to avoid.

A flyer that is also a skimmer may change type at the start of its Movement phase (allowing it to hover and fire, but losing flyer bonuses).


This all seems simple enough to me? Flyers end up best for strafing runs every turn or two, which may be fine as enemy anti-vehicle weapons are thinned out, then it can become a skimmer if desired in the later game when it should be safer to do-so.

[Cthell]

I'd be inclined to give flyers a minimum move of 12" to help differentiate them from skimmers; whilst some skimmers are held aloft by anti-grav, there are things like the Ork flyers that (in theory, at least) rely on aerodynamic lift to stay in the air. Skimmer/flyer hybrids (such as the Valkyrie and Storm Raven) could have the option to switch to moving as a "Skimmer" to enable embarkation/disembarkation of passengers - perhaps they could not be "fast skimmers" to represent the difficulties of manuevering the larger vehicle in close proximity to the ground (and again differentiate them from fast skimmers)

Flyers should definitely not be able to claim/contest objectives

The other thing I'd like to see is some sort of counter to the "flyer armour creep"; if marines have to leave the AV12 off the Rhinos to reduce weight and improve mobility, why can they fit it to Storm Ravens?

I'd suggest "All flyers are treated as having AV 10 10 10 to represent the extra damage caused by taking fire at high speed" (or perhaps 11 11 11 if massed bolters prove too effective); This should be offset to some extent by the automatic cover save, so the best counter to flyers would be high RoF/medium strength weapons (heavy bolters, anyone?).

The extra armour would still be useful when operating in hover mode, but this would let things like the Eldar Firestorm actually provide air defence.

[Son of Sanguinius]

I like your rules, Wes. I'd recommend a few modifications though.

Make it harder for flies to be assaulted. No assault by infantry or vehicles unless the flier had models embark or disembark in that turn. Jump infantry and jetbikes can assault fliers, but only if they move at combat speed or remain stationary. Use normal vehicle hit rolls.

Allow blast and template weapons to hit the flier, but not ordnance weapons and grant a cover save bonus against blast and template weapons.