Which Race Was The Most Technologically Advanced At Their Peak?

[LordLucan]

I'd say Old Ones or Tyranids for genetic engineering technology.

Also with Old One warp science they'd take the prize as most advanced (though the Eldar may have got close at their peak perhaps)

The Necrons and the Eldar were both bloody powerful at their peak, and I do not think there is enough info on the two to adequately answer who was the most advanced at their peak.

I'd say the Golden Age of Tech human empires were not as advanced as the Eldar empire, which ruled the galaxy while humanity was at its peak.

I do wonder what the Krork/Orks would have been like when they still had brain boys. All that instinctive technoloigcal know how and power, but with a greater sense of purpose and intelligence perhaps? I don't know, but considering what the orks can do now seemingly without effort...

Demiurg seem to be quite advanced, and I wonder if they might have had an empire in the past, and what form that might have taken.

Tau at their current 'peak' are the least technologically advanced I'd say, other than the kroot.

[LordLucan]

DAoT humans should also get a honourable mention. They moved the Solar system to the other side of the galaxy,

Since when? I have never seen any lore claiming they moved the entire solar system...

[mdman1]

Look at the warhammer galaxy map. Admittedly I was exaggerating a little, they 'only' moved Sol several thousand light years towards the galactic core. But in RL Sol was more to the edge of the Orion arm. Though this could just be bad writing/illustrating on GW's part than actual intent. Who else but the DAoT humans could have done that? Unless aliens did it, or the DAoT humans decided recreate another Sol system closer to the core.

[stormblade]

Hmm, Perhaps Terra subjugated by the Luna Wolves in HR was the real one after all.

[ManOfRust]

One of the concepts I always thought was most cool about the philosophy of the deep, dark background was the duality between advancement of technology and spiritual strength. Old ones were the embodiment of spiritual strength, channeling the vast powers of the Warp with unimaginable force of will and an alien perception of reality allowing them to bend dimensions at a whim. I doubt that you can really describe what makes up the webway as technology and I would guess that most surviving artifacts of the Old Ones were in the same vein, completely un-knowable to the less-than-puissant Psychic.

C'tan were played as the counter card being ultimate masters of the Physical Universe, repositories of vast, atomic power and an unthinking grasp of the laws of Physics. Once their perception was shifted by the meddling of the Necrontyr there was no physical science beyond them. Downside? Completely a-moral star vampires with no empathy and no qualms in enslaving their allies and turning on one another.

Everyone else falls in between. Humanity stands out as having had tremendous purely scientific advancement and also incredible psychic engineering. Shame it all went down the boop-hole as we enter the End-Times...

[mdman1]

I heard the rumour that humanity was a project of the Old Ones, like a middle road to the Eldar and Kork. Is there any truth to this? It would explain why the three races are physically similar (rather than fiat) but it has holes in that the Old Ones died out 60 million years before humans formed a civilisation.

[Iron_Lord]

Look at the warhammer galaxy map. Admittedly I was exaggerating a little, they 'only' moved Sol several thousand light years towards the galactic core. But in RL Sol was more to the edge of the Orion arm.

I'd go with the "iffy illustrating" explanation. The 40k galaxy was also drawn before the discovery that the real galaxy is a barred spiral, has at least four arms (two major, two minor) and so forth.

On humanity- I wonder if the Triarch Praetorians had been experimenting on them. The webway gate found on Earth in the desert, according to Collected Visions- maybe that was a Dolmen Gate created by the Necrons not the Eldar. The Pariah gene- maybe inserted by the Praetorians back when humans were still proto-primates dwelling in the trees.

[Doppleskanger]

No mention of the Jokaero?
from Lexicanium quoting from RT
"These traits make their understanding beyond that of even the most advanced of the known races with the possible exception of the Great Mages of the Slann"

[Waxfadge]

The Primarch project was after the Dark Age of technology, so that surely wasn't the peak of technology you had been asking for in the first place. What you are talking about in that quote is more social advance than technological. But what is "socially advanced" depends on the society you live in. If you believe the Imperium it always had been xenophobyia. If you believe the old Eldar it had been selfishness and hedonism. If you believe the new Eldar it would be self-control. If you ask the Tau it will be communism or mind-control. If you'd ask the Orks will be strength. Each race and society has its own definition for that. And if you ask me, creating the Primarchs to conquer the galaxy was a megalomaniac intolerance and desire to rule the galaxy in despotism.

I was asking who the most advanced is and when they peaked and in my opinion humans peaked with the primarch project. I know this was after the dark age of technology but i think it was more impressive than anything I have heard about that was done during the dark age of technology so in my opinion this was humanities peak and not the dark age of technology. Like i said this is just my opinion though.

[El_Machinae]

I used to think that the Necrons represented the peak technological ability possible. In the 'real world' there are going to be some types of technology that just cannot get any better due to various fundamental hard limits in the laws of physics. But I don't think the Necrons represent the peak any longer (since the new technologies). There seem to be technologies available to other races that are just as 'compact' or 'efficient' as Necron technology, but still being better in some way.

[Iron_Lord]

5e has tended to give the Necrons various "extradimensional" technologies- tesseract labyrinths and the like. Doomsday Arks which when interfered with by Orks destroyed the planet they were on. Etc.

[Lord Damocles]

I heard the rumour that humanity was a project of the Old Ones, like a middle road to the Eldar and Kork. Is there any truth to this? It would explain why the three races are physically similar (rather than fiat) but it has holes in that the Old Ones died out 60 million years before humans formed a civilisation.

Farseer Alladrios believes [/believed] humans to be one of the 'lesser creations of the Old Ones', who were 'comical tree-beasts / with no greater role defined for them by the Old Ones'. However, 'raw elemental evolution took a hold, turning these noisey but harmless beasts into the life form that now infested a million worlds' (Codex: Necrons (3rd ed.), pg.9).

There are, of course also suggestions that humanity was interfered with by the C'tan/Necrons as well (Alladrios again on pg.9, the presence of the pariah gene, and Battle Missions, pg.48).

On humanity- I wonder if the Triarch Praetorians had been experimenting on them. The webway gate found on Earth in the desert, according to Collected Visions- maybe that was a Dolmen Gate created by the Necrons not the Eldar. The Pariah gene- maybe inserted by the Praetorians back when humans were still proto-primates dwelling in the trees.

Collected Visions doesn't say that the Terran webway gate was found - in fact the Emperor explicitly states that he created it ('The warpgate I have constructed and the short section of passage beyond...' (pg.324)). The section of tunnel beyond is also of human creation ('The warpgate in the Imperial Dungeon led to a short section of human-built warp-tunnel. Beyond this lay the vast interlocking maze of tunnels, passageways and conduits that was the alien webway' (pg.326)).

In addition to this, the Terran gate looks nothing at all like the only description of a Dolmen Gate which we have access to ('The entire construct was fabricated of metal, gold in colour, and gigantic mechanised doors of the same golden metal blocked the portal shut' (pg.322) - the various pictures make it look like a stargate VS 'The architecture of the construction was like everything else inside the Obsidion Moon, all time-soiled metals surrounding carved rectilinear ribs of heavy stone - but where those shapes seemed to at least adhere to some rational, if alien, design ethos, this thing was an impossibility. / Like an optical illusion, lines seemed to begin and end on themselves, hard-cut corners forming into angles that collapsed upon one another. / An inverted tetrahedral surround of old iron, it stood bigger than the central donjon of the Sanctuary convent, glinting with flickers of power. Dull, unearthly, light gathered in the open framework of the thing, the same brilliant green hue they had witnessed elsewhere' (Hammer and Anvil, pg.200).

Might you be thinking of the Golden Throne? ('The Golden Throne was the key. Unearthed from forgotten ruins sunken deep beneath the driest desert, [doesn't specify Earth] it was the lodestone that would have unlocked the secrets of the alien lattice' (A Thousand Sons, pg.445)).

[bobafett_h]

My vote would be the Eldar, however their peak was obviously long ago before The Fall, while the Necrons were sleeping...

Even though the Necrontyr were highly advanced, they weren't a real threat to the Old Ones until they gained the help of the C'Tan and became Necrons. Even then, the C'Tans and Necrons were eventually forced into their Tomb Worlds to sleep for millions of years by the forces of the Warp. Other advanced psychic races that the Old Ones had created such as the Slann, Eldar, Krork and Jokaero all managed to survive and evolve (or devolve in the case of the Krork who became the Orks) to some extent over millions of years. The Eldar in particular ended up ruling most of the galaxy and things like the Webway that the Old Ones had created was extended and perfected by the Eldar during this time. They would have had to have advanced greatly to reach the level they achieved.

The peak of human tech was during the Age of Technology, with the Primarch Project being another peak in technology. However, mankind's rule was never as great at either time than what was achieved by other races. Tau have great potential because of how quickly they have reached the level they are at now, but my belief is that they have had help from advanced races or beings over the millenia to get to where they are. Ork technology continues to advance, and they may some day evolve back to a level similar to that of the Brainboyz (Krork).

[LordLucan]

Look at the warhammer galaxy map. Admittedly I was exaggerating a little, they 'only' moved Sol several thousand light years towards the galactic core. But in RL Sol was more to the edge of the Orion arm. Though this could just be bad writing/illustrating on GW's part than actual intent. Who else but the DAoT humans could have done that? Unless aliens did it, or the DAoT humans decided recreate another Sol system closer to the core.

I suspect the bolded part. The lore has never suggested they moved the solar system, so it does not make sense to assume that, and then further assume Dark Age of Tech humans did it. That's two assumptions in one!

[Lothlanathorian]

On top of the fact that nothing in space is sitting still. So, 38,000 years from now, our solar system isn't going to be where it is right now.

[Xisor]

I'm reluctant to say "C'tan" or "Old Ones" as we really know so little of them, save that they're altogether beyond mere mortal concerns. (Even if the Necrons tricked the C'tan into being destroyed? Is it worse than the Eldar 'tricking' most of their gods into being defeated/consumed/sundered by Slaanesh?)

Anyway, after that, you've got the Eldar and the Necrons. Discriminating them is difficult. The Eldar captured stars. The Necrons are custodians of the Orrery - did they build it? Can it be counted as theirs? Same with things like the Golden Throne for Mankind, the Webway for the Eldar... is it really fair to say it belongs to them?

I'm very interested in seeing folks musings on the end-of-the-War-in-Heaven/just-before-Great-Sleep Necrons & Eldar. The Necrons were battered, but what was the difference in their technologies? The Eldar must've ascended higher up the tech-tree in the millions of years since... but how far? Enough to push past the Necrons? Had they already managed it?

Very interesting, IMO.

[Hrw-Amen]

It is going to be difficult to answer this until all of those races have had their day and are extinct as for all we know the Eldar, Necrons, Humans or whoever may not yet have peaked and may go onto better things. Just because at the moment it looks as if the Eldar are on their way out, that does not mean in a few centuries time they will not have a resurgence, the same for humanity or any of the others.

[El_Machinae]

If the Eldar passed the Necrons, you'd think they'd have been able to wipe them out in millions of years. Millions of years is a long time to systematically go through any galaxy, if the Eldar were significantly more advanced than now.

[Iron_Lord]

Might you be thinking of the Golden Throne? ('The Golden Throne was the key. Unearthed from forgotten ruins sunken deep beneath the driest desert, [doesn't specify Earth] it was the lodestone that would have unlocked the secrets of the alien lattice' (A Thousand Sons, pg.445)).

That's what I was thinking of.

On top of the fact that nothing in space is sitting still. So, 38,000 years from now, our solar system isn't going to be where it is right now.

About 39000 years from now as of the start of M42 (since we're still near the start of M3).

The sun orbits the galaxy at a speed of 1/1300 the speed of light- in 39000 years it will be roughly 30 light years from where it is now. Of course, many of the other stars in its vicinity will also have moved roughly the same direction and speed.

30 light years is a tiny distance on the scale of a galaxy 100,000 light years in diameter.

[Lupe]

Eldar have nothing on the Necrons, in my opinion.

Where one race struggles to foresee the future, through half glimpsed dreams and careful interpretation, the other can bend time itself to its will...

Where one race sacrifices one of their own to awaken a sliver of a god, the other built living metal bodies for a pahtheon they discovered on their own...

Where one race stores their dead in fragile soulstones, the other encased their living in the same nigh-indestructible living metal bodies...