Start of a review of the Eldar Corsir List

[TheDoctor]

Hello all!

Now that I have some free time, I thought I would try my hand at writing up a guide to the Eldar corsair army list, then attach it to my sig once I am done. This is my first time writing anything of the sort, so ANY constructive comments and criticisms are welcome, regardless of whether or not you actually play the army, or indeed, even know what the army looks like.

I thought I would start off with the basic Eldar Corsiar squad. However, because they are so versatile, my post became a bit lengthy, so I apologize.

Eldar Corsair Squad
-These guys are you bread and butter, like Tau Fire Warriors, you ALWAYS have to take a squad of these guys. Let’s look at what you get:
-Lasblaster or Shuriken Catapult or Shuriken Pistol
-Close Combat Weapon
-Plasma Grenades
-A modest statline, but with BS4! As well as fleet.

For basic weapons
-Shuriken Pistols: Your dudes have WS, S, and T 3, with a 5+ armor save, and have 1 attack base. You are wannabe storm guardians that shoot better than they assault, and do not have a warlock or doom support. It is a pretty bad option most of the time.
Falcon and Venom mounted squads- Don’t have enough transport capacity to carry enough of these guys.
Jetpack mounted- Generally better off with a gun
Webway portal-This is the option I see that is best for “Storm Corsair Squads” Be sure to hum the Team America theme when they burst from the webway portal, and pump fire and shurikens into the enemy, before charging the (hopefully) weakened enemy.

-Shuriken Catapult: It’s the gun we all know and hate. That being said, I usually stick it on falcon mounted squads, who operate closer to the enemy where the extra point of S matters more than the extra range.

-Lasblasters: Your go-to weapon of choice. 9 points for a slightly weaker BS4 stormbolter? In an Eldar codex?!?!It fits in with pretty much any variant of corsair squad, and the 24” range synergizes nicely with the shuriken cannon.

Special Weapons-Corsair squads have the option to haul around more special and “heavy” weapons then many basic troop choices. 5 man squad gets access to one special and one heavy, while the 10 man squad gets access to 2 specials and 2 heavies. “Their arrogance is matched only by their firepower”
Flamer: It’s a flamer. It’s cheap. Works well with falcon or venom squads in conjunction with a shuriken cannon-helps provide some close-in defense. In storm corsair squads, helps more than a fusion gun in softening up enemies.

Fusion gun: Honestly, I don’t think that fusion guns are that great in corsair squads. In mounted squads, you get 1 shot with your 1 shot weapon. Then you have 5 dudes who are T3 and have 5+ armor. In storm corsair squads, you have very little chance of killing a vehicle in CC if the fusion guns fail (Felarch MAY have haywire grenades, the rest of them get 1 attack at S4 from plasma grenades). Jetpack mounted squads should generally be staying away from the enemy, not trying to get closer to use the fusion gun.

“Heavy” weapons
Shuriken Cannon- I bless Phil Kelly in his infinite wisdom for making shuriken cannons assault weapons. This should be your go-to weapon of choice, and is a bargin at 10 points. It synergizes well with lasblasters, since both have 24” range. Taking a 10 man corsair squad with 2 cannons and lasblasters is a fairly cheap way of getting some more dakka on the field

Missile Launcher- Awesome on jetpack guys, so you can move and fire. If you don’t take the jetpack upgrade, and important thing to note is that you cannot move and fire like the guardian missile launcher. That being said, they can make some cheap, if static, fire support, especially if you only take a 5 man squad (where the jetpack costs are more expensive, relatively speaking).

Transport options
Falcon- It’s a falcon, but now BS 4 and slightly more expensive. It is not reliant on guide to be a decent gunboat anymore, so the falcons and their transports can operate more independently. Key emphasis on “more”, not that “they should”. You can go with the Eldar MSU route, but that leaves you with a shortage of boots on the ground, and unlike marines, once those boots hit the ground, they will not last long. You generally can’t go wrong with 2-3 falcon squads forming a solid firebase.

(Corsair) Venom- 5 points less expensive than a vyper, but with BS 4 and the ability to transport troops? Awesome- it’s a far cheaper ride than a falcon. However, the cost of holo-fields is still the same cost as on the AV12 close-topped tanks, and corsair venoms cannot take flickerfields, so don’t expect them to last long. On the plus side, with all the falcons and warp hunters that should be flying around, a couple of venoms should be a low priority target. The annoying thing is that the chin mounted twin linked shuriken catapults cannot be upgraded to anything useful.

This is just the beginning of the guide, I wanted some feedback on my writing style before I got too in-depth.

[Kelanen]

Longtime Eldar (and many other armies) player. I don't have a Corsair army, but I do have IA11...

-Lasblasters: Your go-to weapon of choice. 9 points for a slightly weaker BS4 stormbolter?

A stormbolter is 50% more effective - that's a *lot* more than a 'slight' difference.

That said I agree it's the default choice, and the right one for most usage.

[TheDoctor]

Thanks Kelanen!

And that's kindof the stuff I'm talking about, things where my personal bias gets in the way of facts. (I still smile a little when I get to measure 24" range for my guns, instead of pistol range). Will go back and edit that.
Although, as an aside, would a stormbolter only be 16% more effective than a lasblaster?
Lasblaster: T4, 33% chance to wound
Storm bolter: T4, 50 % chance to wound
Also, storm bolters usually come on terminators, and you can get 4.5 corsairs for every terminator.

[purge the daemon]

In apace marines grey knights everyone has a storm bolter (I know not henchmen but acolytes can still take it)

[Kelanen]

Although, as an aside, would a stormbolter only be 16% more effective than a lasblaster?
Lasblaster: T4, 33% chance to wound
Storm bolter: T4, 50 % chance to wound

You are talking in absolutes, whereas I am talking comparitively. 16% IS 50% of 33% hence a Storm Bolter is 50% better...

Absolutes only make sense if you are talking in hard figures, not percentage chances of one part of the equation (you've not taken into account To Hit or Armour, although both weapons are affected equally.

At BS4 a Lasblaster gets 0.15 MEQ kills a round, whereas a StormBolter gets 0.22. As such a Stormbolter is 50% more effective than a LasBlaster...

Also, storm bolters usually come on terminators, and you can get 4.5 corsairs for every terminator.

Actually lots of things get Stormbolters - Termies, Command Squads, Honour Guard, Sternguard, most characters, all flavours of Dreadnought and every vehicle - and that's just the SM codex! Having said that you shouldn't see Stormbolters on any of those, it's a bad armament for the good units, and teh others are bad.

The other 6 loyalist codexes get them scattered around too, but the only place you should really see Stormbolters is GK. Every non-Inquisition GK unit starts with a Stormbolter as standard and even the Inquisitorial Henchmen can take them if you wish.

The fact is GK only take them because they are free (and are often S5 for them), but whilst Stormbolters are better than most basic weapons, they are still not all that. A squad of 10 still only nets you two kills!

Comparing Lasblasters to Stormbolters only matters if there is some internal resonance to you, but honestly comparing Corsairs to Terminators is utterly irrelevant. Different units from different FOC in different codexes that perform different roles. Not to mention Tactical Terminators being unplayed competitively anyway, so the benchmark is a very low bar...

[TheDoctor]

Alright, so I have done wasps, corsair jetbikes, and hornets. As always, comments and criticisms are always welcome, even if you do not play Corsairs.

Wasp Assault Walker Squadron
-The Corsair version of the War Walker. It is 25 points more expensive than the war walker, but this includes the standard +15 pts to upgrade the BS from 3 to 4. The craftworld version of the Wasp is 10 points more than the war walker, so you are paying 10 points for its special abilities. The Wasp exchanges Scouts for the ability to move as jetpack infantry, the ability to deep strike, and the once per game ability to move 12” and get a 5+ cover save. Note that the rules says you count as jetpack infantry for the purposes of moving, so you can still fire both guns. You can only have a max of 3 squads, and that is if you do not take corsair jetbikes, and take 3 regular corsair squads.

Shuriken Cannon- short range for the jetpack. You should always be pulling a Tau, and getting a cover save against any return fire. The short range of the shuriken cannon means that it might be difficult to do this. However, it is the cheapest option, and I tend to deepstrike them when I run them with cannons. The jetpack move means that I can usually deepstrike them on a flank, and then hopefully hide afterwards.

Scatter Laser-Good range means that it can be easier to hide it behind terrain. Apart from that, this version isn’t that subtle. Hide behind terrain, jump out, shoot, jump back behind terrain. However, at 85 points a pop for dual scatter lasers, I would recommend against putting them in reserve, especially if you pay for a decent sized squad.

Eldar Missile Launcher, Starcannon, and Brightlance- These have basically the same problems as regular war walkers. They are too many points in an AV 10 platform, especially when run in a squadron (even with the 4+ cover that you should be getting). However, with BS 4, the Eldar Missile Launcher is potentially a better option than regular war walkers. Again, do not rely on reserve rolls, but instead stay at extreme range.
*You can also get cover by using your falcon chassis. If I remember the rules correctly, if running 2 wasps, only one of them needs to be obscured to claim a cover save for the unit. The 4” coherency for walkers should also help with this*


Corsair Jetbike Squadrons
These are made of magic and win. 3 points more than guardian jetbikes, and you get scouts, a pistol and close combat weapon, BS4, and the same ability to buy shuriken cannons at 10 points and for every 3 models. They combine well with hornets, as you can form a hard hitting scouting wing, which can be on the flanks of the enemy turn 1.

Even with a shuriken pistol and CCW, don’t kid yourself- you are only S3 with WS3. Shooting is the corsair jetbikes forte, with close combat being either backup, or to finish off a weakened enemy. Other than that, standard elder jetbikes tactics apply- jump shoot jump. With the scout moves, you should be getting side armor.

The main weakness of corsair jetbikes is the lack of access to warlocks. I did not realize how much I take warlocks for granted until after a couple of games. The corsair jetbikes do not have any way to damage vehicles in Close Combat, even with the felarch. Also, they are only Ld 8, so the felarch should be basically mandatory, since 10 points nets you Ld 9. The upgrade I recommend for the felarch is the fusion pistol, with the power weapon upgrade being if you have the points. The fusion pistol gives you another chance to kill tanks at range, which you need if you take them tank hunting.
I would recommend squad sizes of either 6 or 9. Minimum squads of jetbikes should not be necessary, since compared with regular Eldar, Corsair troop slots are really good. To back this up, I would recommend 4 hornets, in squads of 2. A solid choice for the hornets would be either shuricannons or scatter lasers.



Fast Attack
Hornet
These are essentially what Vypers SHOULD be. 15 points more than a Vyper, and you get star engines (which is a 15 pt upgrade in and of itself), Scouts, BS4, aerial assault, 2 built in Shuriken Cannons, AV 11/11/10, and close-topped. There are two main ways to run them:

Dual Shuriken Cannons/Scatter Lasers: These synergize well with jetbikes to form a hard hitting flanking force. They are cheap enough to run them in squadrons. Just remember that they are AV11, compared with holo-fielded AV12 falcons, so if you are not careful, the enemy can throw more anti-tank their way then you would like. The hornet has access to holo-fields, and if kept cheap like this, the price is not too bad.

Dual Pulse Lasers: Falcon guns on something other than a falcon? I like it. This option should usually be in your back line, and acts very much like a slightly more expensive (upgrades dependent), but more durable, Dark Eldar Ravager. You should try to be getting cover, either from your other tanks or from terrain. At 125 pts a pop, running squadrons of them can get expensive quickly. Holo-Fields are optional, but make your AV 11 vehicle cost 160 pts. If trying to shave points, getting rid of the Holo-Fields and going for relying on cover isn’t a bad choice.

Eldar Missile Launcher, Starcannon, and Bright Lance: The Eldar missile launcher is the most attractive of these choices, but all three of these have the same problem. Why take these 3 options, when, for just a few points more, you can get Pulse Lasers, which are better in 80 percent of the time.
-Pulse Laser has more shots and better AP at the same range as missile Launchers
-Pulse Laser outranges the starcannon, can ID T4, and are extremely better against tanks.
-Pulse Laser outranges the bright lance, and pumps out more shots. The lance special rule only comes into effect on AV13 and 14. I do not know the math, but I would rather have more shots against AV 13 then 2 with the lance effect. AV14 is where the lance is better, but that is what you have fusion guns and warp hunters for. But seriously, the pulse laser is 5 points more than the bright lance. So take the pulse laser.

[Clarkson]

Thanks Kelanen!

And that's kindof the stuff I'm talking about, things where my personal bias gets in the way of facts. (I still smile a little when I get to measure 24" range for my guns, instead of pistol range). Will go back and edit that.
Although, as an aside, would a stormbolter only be 16% more effective than a lasblaster?
Lasblaster: T4, 33% chance to wound
Storm bolter: T4, 50 % chance to wound
Also, storm bolters usually come on terminators, and you can get 4.5 corsairs for every terminator.

but only get 1 lasblaster for every 5 corsairs.. meaning that the terminator is already statistically better.

[TheDoctor]

but only get 1 lasblaster for every 5 corsairs.. meaning that the terminator is already statistically better.

Um, what? All corsairs can get lasblasters.

[Kelanen]

but only get 1 lasblaster for every 5 corsairs.. meaning that the terminator is already statistically better.

Umm.. No...

IA11 (p.165) - any Corsair may exchange their weapon for a lasblaster for free.

Flamers and Fusion guns are 1/5, but the other options aren't.

[Kelanen]

*You can also get cover by using your falcon chassis. If I remember the rules correctly, if running 2 wasps, only one of them needs to be obscured to claim a cover save for the unit. The 4” coherency for walkers should also help with this*

Quite correct.

Corsair Jetbike Squadrons
These are made of magic and win.

Even with a shuriken pistol and CCW, don’t kid yourself- you are only S3 with WS3.

The main weakness of corsair jetbikes is the lack of access to warlocks. Also, they are only Ld 8, so the felarch should be basically mandatory, since 10 points nets you Ld 9. The upgrade I recommend for the felarch is the fusion pistol, with the power weapon upgrade being if you have the points. The fusion pistol gives you another chance to kill tanks at range, which you need if you take them tank hunting.
I would recommend squad sizes of either 6 or 9. Minimum squads of jetbikes should not be necessary, since compared with regular Eldar, Corsair troop slots are really good. To back this up, I would recommend 4 hornets, in squads of 2. A solid choice for the hornets would be either shuricannons or scatter lasers.

I concur on all points here, except the fusion pistol, which I'm unconvinced by.

Hornet
These are essentially what Vypers SHOULD be.

Agreed.

There are two main ways to run them:

Dual Shuriken Cannons/Scatter Lasers:
Dual Pulse Lasers:

Dual ShuriCannons or dual Pulse Lasers are the two loadouts I endorse also.

-Pulse Laser outranges the bright lance, and pumps out more shots. The lance special rule only comes into effect on AV13 and 14. I do not know the math, but I would rather have more shots against AV 13 then 2 with the lance effect.

Against AV13 it's a wash, the two weapons are identical. The Pulse does have a longer range though, and is literally twice as good against every non-vehicle, and every AV up to 12. It's only AV14 where the lance wins, which is why lance is not a very powerful ability, coupled with the fact that even against AV14, lance is still not good enough to be able to not take melta/CC solutions for the most part. I'm with you on the Pulse laser everytime...

[TheDoctor]

Thanks kelanen, I was unsure of the exact math between the two, I have gone back and edited my original Word document.

Next up is the Nightspinner, Warp Hunter, and I have rolled the Nightwing, Phoenix Bomber, and Firestorm into one. I will revisit those three whenever 6th rolls around. As always, comments and criticisms are extremely welcome. As much as I appreciate Kelanen's effort's in helping, with 388 veiws, I know people other than him have seen this thread.

Nightspinner
-Exactly what you get from the Craftworld version, only 15 points more expensive and in the Fast Attack slot. Ironically, the Eldar Corsair army list has a competitive fast attack slot, much like the Craftworld Heavy Support.

-If you are going full mech or heavy on jetpack infantry, the Nightspinner is really good. Full mech means you have very little in the way of infantry models, so getting out of your tanks is an extremely dangerous proposition. Messing with your opponent’s movement can be gold for making it less dangerous. Also, watching your opponent’s meltagunner trip and fall on his face is always a hilarious sight (make sure your opponent rolls his dangerous terrain checks according to wound allocation groups, I’ve seen too many marine players quickly roll the dangerous terrain checks all together, then try to remove bolter goons instead of special weapons/the sarge).

-The uses of the Nightspinner in a jetpack heavy army are obvious. Since your guys are allergic to CC, and don’t have metal boxes to hide in, anything that messes with your opponent’s movement and lets you retain movement superiority is worth its weight in gold. Since the nightspinner should be hiding in a corner and/or have holo-fields, having a couple of tanks in an infantry-heavy army should not be as terrible as with other armies.


Nightwing Interceptor, Phoenix Bomber, and Fire Storm

I am not going to go into much detail for these 3, since with the current rules, their pricing makes no sense at all.

Nightwing Interceptor (Fast Attack)- decent enough. A really expensive landspeeder, However AV 10, and a 4+ invulnerable ONLY if you moved in the previous turn do it in. A single stunned or immobilized result, and you can be sure your opponent will kill it the next turn. If going second, place it in reserve.

Phoenix bomber (Heavy support)- bad to average (in the right circumstances). 80 points more expensive then the nightwing, and literally, the ONLY differences are:
-minor gun changes, arguably the nightwing is better.
-6 S5 AP3 shots. So 80 points is apparently worth ~2 dead marines a turn (out of cover, and without access to Feel No Pain
I say it can be average in the right circumstances, since you can upgrade the reaper launcher guns into 6 S4 AP5 ignores cover small blast. Good if you are facing hordes, but with the 70% of marine players out there, good luck.

Firestorm (Heavy Support)- terrible. I like to think I am a good Eldar player, having played them for 5 years (it was my first 40k army). I cannot think of a good reason to run this thing. It should be AT LEAST 40 points cheaper. A theoretical mind exercise:

-Wave serpent with scatter lasers and (theoretical) standard 15 points to upgrade to BS4. 130 pts.
--So apparently, an extra 2 feet of range and extra 2 shots are worth 50 points, not to mention the fact that it loses half the transport capacity, the inbuilt wave serpent energy field (which makes the firestorm seem to cost even more), and it takes up a valuable heavy support slot. Also, with the amount of access to 12/12/10 flyers that the Imperium is getting, S6 is AWESOME!!!!!1!!11!

--Even as the corsair version of DAVU doesn’t work, since corsairs already have access to falcons as dedicated transports
*My only conclusion: these three options were hopefully written with 6th edition in mind.*

Warp Hunter (Heavy Support)
-This thing IS your heavy support slot. To simply say that it is the Eldar version of the Vindicator would be a gross injustice. The Warp Hunter is primarily an anti-infantry tank, with vehicle hunting being it’s secondary role.

-I say it is primarily anti-infantry, because against vehicles, most likely you will only suppress them, with only a 1/3 chance of getting a penetrating hit. However, if your opponent is dumb enough to clump his vehicles together, then shoot the warp hunter at those vehicles- the large blast only needs to touch an enemy tank to roll on the special armor penetration chart. Also remember that the template, which can be thrown, negates cover saves (like that pesky smoke or flat-out. Need that vendetta surpressed? Toss the flamer template at it), and again, only needs to touch a vehicle for you to roll on it.

-The anti-infantry role works best at short ranges, so you can toss the flamer template, kill stuff on a 2+, and negate their cover. Apart from that, feel free to sit back and toss the barrage large blasts around.

-Holo-Fields are mandatory on this tank. With a range of only 36”, and the best ability (the thrown flamer template) being at short ranges, this thing will take A LOT of fire. Also, most opponents, when they hear that it wounds stuff on a 2+ and can ignore cover, will make warp hunters public enemy #1. Be sure to back up warp hunters with your other stuff, since you can be sure that the enemy will remove their special weapons (meltaguns) last. Meltaguns have a 25% chance to outright kill a holo-fielded vehicle on a penetrating hit, and will more often than not, get a permanent damage result.

-Shuriken Cannons are pretty good. I consider them a mandatory buy, you may not. Normal tanks with only 1 big gun get 1 weapon destroyed result and then are useless. With the Holo-Fields, it is a safe bet that the enemy will get a gun destroyed before they get a wrecked. Once that happens, you can sit back and throw 3 S6 shots with BS4, or you can turn your warp hunter into a cruise missile, and rely on holo-fields to protect you.

-Spirit Stones-If I am trying to shave points, I usually do not take these, and rely on holo-fields and backing up my warp hunters with other stuff to protect me. However, with the shorter range of the warp hunters, spirit stones are a good buy. Getting a stunned result while the enemy is in potential charge range is bad (rather obviously).

[Aryllon]

Totally agree re: Wasps, Jetbikes, Hornets, Nightspinner & Warp Hunter (although needed some guidance on weapon loadouts, much appreciated!).
Phoenix Bomber again, totally agree it's rubbish for the points & compared to the Nightwing. Shame it's a nice model (especially the Void Dragons version), would be a great centrepiece... yeah will reserve judgement until 6th.
Nightwing though, totally forgot about stunned / immobilised on the first turn!! D'oh. Assumed it'd be moving every turn for invulnerable save...

[nigelovich]

I'm putting together a Corsairs army right now. I'm really interested to know what people think in light of the new 6th edition rules. Suddenly the flyers look a lot more attractive and I'm itching to see how they get FAQed. Do you think FW will include rules for allies?

[TheDoctor]

I'm putting together a Corsairs army right now. I'm really interested to know what people think in light of the new 6th edition rules. Suddenly the flyers look a lot more attractive and I'm itching to see how they get FAQed. Do you think FW will include rules for allies?

I'm withholding doing the rest of the guide until 6th edition hits. It may explain the pricing on the Phoenix and Firestorm.

I'm hoping Forgeworld does rules for allies, or FAQ's how the Void Dreamer psychic powers work with BRB stuff. Until then, I'm gonna use however GW rules Eldar as my guide for ruling Corsairs.