Lizardmen any good?

[Ultimate Life Form]

Hm, seems to be my bad, I must be cursed or something, how come I manage to turn a simple "is this army good" thread into yet another episode of Mathhammer Extraordinaire? Anything I touch is doomed...

But I'm not convinced the advantages are that great. My goblin BSB certainly doesn't die by turn two every game, honestly

But he's also T4. We Lizardmen are in the the odd situation of having some of the strongest characters in the game as well as some of the weakest. Skink Chief is T3 and also can have next to no armor. Basically he's about as durable as any random rank and file model, only slightly more fighty. The only reason why one would ever consider a Skink BSB is either because you run a Skink army (though I've never heard of that before) or to take the Skavenpelt Banner. Which I did before, but in a Slannless list. As I said I like experimenting around, but sometimes you need to get serious, too.

and you can have a scar vet BSB, those are reasonably tough

Yes, but they cost a bucketload of points, and in a Slann list, believe it or not, every single point does count. We're no like you Greenskins blessed with an overabundance of choices. There is a certain staple of things that we must take to be reasonably competitive, and those things are costly. Whenever I write a Slann list I find that 25% of the stuff I wanted doesn't fit into my point allowance. I have certainly no leeway for an extra Scarvet just for the sake of it.

I get all the advantages of course, but you lose a lot in flexibility. And LM strike me as the one army (besides undead and demons obviously) that can get away with a BSB running around. It doesn't need to stand in the same unit as the general, it can be in the unit next to it, making hitting the slann unit not such a no brainer for the opponent. I'm not so convinced a separate BSB is a bad idea, in short. I do think trying something different is always worth a shot.

These are all valid points of course. Well, maybe I'll just go wild and try it out next time (not that this would be anytime soon) just so I can expand my knowledge in the ways of the Old Ones. If I want to call myself a true master of Lizardmen and a loyal servant of the Old Ones I must stay open minded and have faith in the guidance of the gods. Thanks for teaching me this valuable lesson and restoring my idealism. I guess playing against overcompetitive tournament players all the time really does leave you embittered and dull minded after a while.

[Inevitable]

Hm, seems to be my bad, I must be cursed or something, how come I manage to turn a simple "is this army good" thread into yet another episode of Mathhammer Extraordinaire? Anything I touch is doomed...

Some people like explaining how an army is good through mathematical formula's and/or theories. It's just the diversity of the gaming scene that when asking whether something is good or not will get you a variety of answers. I personally love math and thus I often explain things using math in some fashion as a backup.

However, I have also stated that Lizardmen are a great army. If I didn't love my Greenskins as much as I do, I'd play Lizardmen more. That being said (and this is slightly skewed towards region) but I've never seen a lizardmen player rank in the last 25% in Tournaments and are always either Mid-Placement or Top-Placement and usually can squeak out a 3rd place victory. Not sure if the OP cares about Tournament capability but in my personal opinion Lizardmen are as tournament capable as any other army out there while being awesome to look at.

[Soundwave]

I versed lizardmen (again) with my high elves today and just managed to scrape a victory.I find them to be great opponents and incredibly tough,the slann humbled teclis by stealing all his 6"s and dumping his first miscast on him!Saurus warriors rip massive chunks out of everything and stegedons are dangerous as well as tough,and the little cheeky skinks can get up to a hell of alot of mischief.I had aversions to them in there initial release in 5th ed(?maybe) but since then they have blossomed to become quite a characterful and competitive army.I think there a real winner and great choice.

[Urgat]

We're no like you Greenskins blessed with an overabundance of choices.

"fidgety"
I have no idea what you're talking about
"whistles"

[Lingula]

I have only started with warhammer again recently and went with lizardmen. only 1000pts atm at local GW store but loving them

Saurus warrior with scar vet tear everything to bits, skink skirmishers cause all sorts of problems when you set them up in the enemy set up are on their flanks. my stegadon has been good fun, crushing high elves all over.

whatever you do take Cupped hands... one high elf opponent spent two turns trying to kill a skink priest with everything he had because he knew i had that item. in the meantime i got my saurus and steg. into combat and it was lights out. when you have cupped hands you really want to get a miscast off early - so some high rolling casts on big spells like chain lightning early on are good.

so anyway.... i am really enjoying playing with them at the moment.

[warplock]

whatever you do take Cupped hands... one high elf opponent spent two turns trying to kill a skink priest with everything he had because he knew i had that item. in the meantime i got my saurus and steg. into combat and it was lights out. when you have cupped hands you really want to get a miscast off early - so some high rolling casts on big spells like chain lightning early on are good.

I have to comment, you mention rolling high on chain lightning early on - are you giving your Slann the Lore of Heavens? It's fine if you are, interesting choice in fact, but I want to check you aren't trying to make your Skinks miscast so that you can use Cupped Hands - Cupped Hands is a Slann-only item!
Also, just want to check you're aware that the miscast can be fgiven to enemy spellcasters too!

P.S. congrats on playing lizzies, they're an awesome army!

[Soundwave]

Whilst on the topic skink skirmishers "set up on enemy set up flanks" i hope you realize skirmish does not allow one to scout.

[Lingula]

I have to comment, you mention rolling high on chain lightning early on - are you giving your Slann the Lore of Heavens? It's fine if you are, interesting choice in fact, but I want to check you aren't trying to make your Skinks miscast so that you can use Cupped Hands - Cupped Hands is a Slann-only item!

I suddenly got concerned as i have using it on a skink priest (1000pt games atm at the local GW - so checked my army book and there is no mention of it being Slaan only. is it in the errata or something? (yep, i have the latest edition)

[dhagi]

Just looked through it all and Lingula is right. Skinks are allowed to use it, and being 45 points it falls within their magic item allotment.

[warplock]

Oh dear, note to self, make sure to double check in the book first! Skinks can indeed use it, my bad.