Rambo-tep Tomb Kings Army (2500 All-comers List)

[anyone4tea?]

Fantasy Army: TK

Liche Priest - 210
Level 4 (Lore of Nehekara)


Tomb Prince - 156
Great Weapon, Armour of Destiny


Liche Priest – 130
Level 2 (Lore of Light), Dispel Scroll


Ramhotep - 110


15 Archers - 90 (2 ranks of 8)


15 Archers - 90 (2 ranks of 8)


4 Chariots - 240
Musician, Standard Bearer


4 Chariots - 240
Musician, Standard Bearer


26 Tomb Guard - 366 (4 ranks of 7)
Full Command Standard of the Undying Legion


4 Nec Knights – 280
Entombed


4 Nec Knights – 280
Entombed


Catapult - 90


Catapult - 90


Casket of Souls – 135

2505 pts.

It's all quite self explanatory really.... I'm tempted to drop 2 archers from each unit in exchange for skulls of the foe for my catapults and I'm a little worried about taking a level 4 with no anti-miscast equipment, or protective save for that matter. Overall though, I think the list packs a punch in every phase of the game with the 2 units of entombed knights adding the real scare factor.


The chariots advance alongside the tomb guard whilst the shooting, magic and the narrow advancing battleline will hopefully encourage the opponent to come forward with a general envelopment strategy.Rather than enveloping a small battleline they are actually just giving my necro knights plenty of space to deploy behind them. Even though they will know something is in reserve, they will not know what (we always play closed lists to add realism) and very few armies/players are content to sit back to wait and see. They want the excitement to begin!

Another build I was thinking of involves using one unit of Necro Knights but this time giving them a standard bearer with the undying legion banner... A unit of six necro knights with a 3+ re-rollable save that regenerates d6+2 wounds? Ouch. Having that unit appear behind your army? ARGHH! swapping the two units of 4 for that deathstar unit of 6 would leave me with 150pts too... I would use those to get the banner of swiftness for my tombguard in addition to an extra 10 models for them. I think the 2 units of 4 build is superior due to the possibility of losing the deathstar unit to the misfire roll.... but it might be a nice option for a tournament where gambles add to the excitement! (and those 5pts will matter).

[Mozzamanx]

Sees like a good basis. However, there are definitely some improvements that can be made.

- Necro-Knights do not need to be Entombed. They will be in range to hit on turn 3 regardless, and are good enough that they don't require a flank to kill things. All Entombing does is raise the cost and introduce the risk of turning up late, or Misfiring. Instead, I would buy them a Champion. The rules for resurrection mean that if he dies, it only takes a single spell to bring him back and thus gain an extra 6 attacks for that round. He also serves as a fantastic duellist and will earn the Underdog bonus fairly reliably.
Similarly, one of Ramhoteps greatest strengths is allowing his constructs to reroll their saves. By combining the Necro-Knights into a single unit, they all benefit from the rerolls and are also guaranteed to benefit from it. I would definitely run them as a single unit of 6+.

I would also try working in a Banner of Eternal Flame into a unit of Chariots. Flaming Impact hits offer a great way to remove Regenerate for everyone involved in a combat.
'Skulls of the Foe' can be great but really need the Lore of Death to be worth the pricetag. Conversely, Necro-Knights get a lot of love from the Lore of Light, so we have conflicting interests here.

Finally, reconsider the Princes gear. While I appreciate a 4++ sounds lovely, consider how beefy he is already. Also remember that he is in the same unit as Ramhotep- given the choice, I guarantee that all the Assassins / Stalkers / Witch Hunters will be going for Rammy and so the Prince will be perfectly safe on his standard gear. If you put Ramhotep on one corner of the unit and the Prince on the other, he cannot kill both of them with his assassins. Roll him with the Dragonhelm and I would call him safe personally.


Therefore, I would consider:
High Liche- L3/4 to flavour, ideally with the Earthing Rod
Liche- L2, Light or Death. Light favours the Knights, Death favours the Archers and Catapults. Personal preference here
Prince- Light Armour, Dragonhelm, Shield or Great Weapon
Ramhotep

Archers- Whatever takes your fancy in terms of number of units, size and ranks.
Chariots- 2 units of 4, bung the Banner of Eternal Flame on one of them

Necroknights- A single unit of 6-8 with a unit Champion
Tomb Guard- Beefy, Full Command and Undying Standard
2 Catapults
Casket

Any remaining points are best invested into the unit of Tomb Guard. I wouldn't really want to run anything less than 30 of them. Also consider bumping your L2 Liche Priest into a High Priest if you can afford it, and perhaps some Carrion or Horsemen to support your infantry blocks.

[anyone4tea?]

Thanks for the feedback, really good stuff. I think I might keep entombed on one unit of 3 and then run a unit of 4 with a champion. This leaves me with 2425pts. If I were to take your advice on the prince and remove his 4+ ward I think the least amount of protection I could leave him with would be the glittering scales? -1 to hit and T5 is all good in my book, might even be better value than the ward to be honest. Especially as I might be casting a 5+ ward save on them all anyway.

That would leave me with a straight 100 points to invest. hmmm I'm tempted to go with a unit of skeleton horse archers but the idea of spending 14pts a pop on a T3 6+ save unit really irks me.

After reviewing the lore attributes I've decided to go with Lore of Nehekhara on both my priests, it will increase my chances of being able to get the spells I want and ensure plenty of resurrection if needed. (Who am I kidding? It's always needed)

What do you think about these 100pts? Upgrade the Level 2 to a Level 3? skulls of the foe + 6 horse archers? skulls of the foe + more tomb guard? It's a toughie...

In terms of the priests would two level 3's be preferable to a level 4 and a level 2 if I'm taking the same spell lore?

[Morax]

You seem to be missing Mozz's point about the Necroknights. A unit of 3 with a 3+ save doesn't last long against stiff opposition. A unit of 4 with a 3+ with a reroll does better but still has a tendancy to die by game's end. Worse yet is that when you include 2 units of them in your list you must randomize which one gets the reroll and that will leave you with the smaller unit getting the reroll half the time. A unit of 6-8 with a 3+ and a reroll is extremely hard to kill and is one of the best units you can field. This would be a main line unit rolling up right next to the tomb guard, not relying on tricks or flanks to try to get wins because it doesn't need them. By all means, try out your list with two units of Necro knights, but give the combined unit a go a time or two and I think you will see that they will out perform two smaller units almost everytime.

[anyone4tea?]

I didn't miss the point my friend, I was just reticent to fully embrace it, actually I realised today I should stick with two units of 4, no champion.

It gives the army more versatility in terms of the ebb and flow of the game, something I think is more important than sheer strength. One of the units will have a 3+ rerollable, that's still great. They will only have to take one round of shooting before they charge. The tactical scope of having two units is better to my mind, especially if I can use the positioning to to ensure they will be making charges that really count.

Entombed is not a trick, it's an attribute of Tomb Kings designed to make up for our slow movement. I think it's awesome.

All in all, having a big "grindstar" tomb guard unit is enough points-sink for one army, adding another huge pointed unit in the form of a large necro knight unit just seems too clunky... too "obvious" to me. Maybe this is a hang up from my Wood Elves days, worry not, I shall play test both approaches and report back. Thanks.

[Mozzamanx]

Versatility is obviously a good thing to have, but you already have 2 units of Chariots, an extremely solid block of Tomb Guard and at least 1 unit of Knights. How much versatility do you honestly think you'll need?
While having multiple units is obviously a good thing, sometimes you don't need that. Sometimes you'll have to fight something which simply demands a proper fighting unit to take it on. Something like a Chosenstar, or Gutstar. Marauder Hordes, Savage Orcs, Phoenix Guard...
These units will simply blow apart a unit of 4 Chariots, and cut the Tomb Guard apart in 2-3 turns. We only have 2 real options to deal with this sort of unit: Avoid it (Curse, Carrion, Horsemen) or field Ramhoteps Knights. You already have all the individual components but they won't be enough unless fielded in strength.

Entombed is very hit-or-miss. Some units make great benefit out of it, such as Stalkers or Scorpions. Stalkers allow us to get a reasonably shooty unit into a really awkward position, which demands attention lest they blast apart something vital like a Cannon or entire Lizardmen army. Scorpions use it to get a beefy unit into a rear charge for an existing fight, swinging the combat by 4-5 resolution in our favour and hopefully breaking a non-Steadfast enemy. However, it does not work for everyone.
Knights simply do not need it. Even ignoring the fact that it costs 5pts, it means they are not on the table turn 1. They are not necessarily on the table turn 2, or 3. Even if they do turn up, they won't be in combat til turn 3. Furthermore, they don't need the flexibility it offers. They are a grinding unit and will be winning combat against Stubborn enemies 9 times out of 10. The flank means *nothing*. You will still laugh off most of the damage, and the resolution is irrelevant because they are still Stubborn. To polish off an already mediocre option, there is a 1/6 chance of a Misfire, which in turn leads to a 1/9 chance of being useless. (Coming in from a bad corner or simply exploding)

I appreciate people like to experiment, and if you prefer your method then all power to you. But there are very valid reasons behind my arguments and I'm fairly certain that in game-terms, you'll be worse off. That said its all a game and so if you really prefer to do it your way then go for it, and maybe even tell us about it later.

[anyone4tea?]

Nope, you've reasoned the argument well... I shall go with a death unit. It's the preponderance of deathstar type units that swung it, I want to take the army to some tourneys and although people in my area play pretty level I know I'm going to need to be able to deal with some thooper-therious units one day.

Thanks for your time mate.