Concerning a potential Warpath Kickstarter...

[BobtheInquisitor]

Before I begin, let me say that I have no connection to Mantic and have no idea what their plans are for any hypothetical Warpath Kickstarter drive, should they exist. I merely want to discuss some ideas.

First of all, I hope Mantic waits a year or so before starting another Kickstarter. I've pledged a lot to KoW (and to Sedition Wars), leaving me with no more funds until after Christmas. Many others seem to have blown their modelling budgets on KoW as well, so a year will give time to raise more funds. Also, it might be a good idea to let some time pass so that people get to see the results of this KS (and also to grow bored with their SW figures).

Second, I hope Mantic prepares a more thorough range of concept art and even some prototypes to help give a clearer picture of what customers are "buying" with their support. Perhaps Mantic can attach some sculpter's names to specific lines or kits to drum up their fanbases.

Third, Mantic should include at least one "true" plastic goal in their Warpath Kickstarter. There is a lot of demand for "true" plastic out there, but Mantic did not do enough to tap it with the FF and Marauder sprues, which were disappointing (fantasy sprues with Sci Fi bits...sigh). Personally, I find plastic so much easier to work with than restic that I will continue buying DFG and WGF kits over Mantic's Corporation for the foreseeable future. (My experience assembling my corporation troops was very frustrating. And the results were not superior enough to the competition to warrant any more Corp purchases.)

Other than that, I have no qualms about Mantic's Kickstarter performance. They know how to drive a mean bargain.

What do you think they should add or change?

[Sean_OBrien]

First of all, I hope Mantic waits a year or so before starting another Kickstarter. I've pledged a lot to KoW (and to Sedition Wars), leaving me with no more funds until after Christmas. Many others seem to have blown their modelling budgets on KoW as well, so a year will give time to raise more funds. Also, it might be a good idea to let some time pass so that people get to see the results of this KS (and also to grow bored with their SW figures).

Regarding the time frame - I would disagree. Right now, they have a chance to strike while the metal is hot vis-à-vis the 6th edition 40K rules. If they managed to get everything together to push through a kickstarter campaign while people are ho-humming the $75 price tag of a new 40K rulebook and provide something which provides a better value for those hobby dollars, then they could quite likely take a chunk out of GW's pie even more so than they would a year from now.

If I were in the seat over there - I would really take a hard look at being able to launch a Kickstarter campaign that started soon...preferably before the new rulebooks from those other guys started shipping.

Regarding people blowing their hobby budget...I think you have to remember that the customers for the KoW and Sedition Wars will not necessarily overlap that much (some, but not necessarily that much). While Sedition Wars has some interesting figures - I didn't have any actual interest in them. Not a board gamer. KoW got a chunk of my hobby budget, but the $175 pledge amounts to what I normally spend in one weekend on hobby related items. However, with the right items on a Warpath KS campaign - I could see myself potentially spending my annual budget on goodies.

[BobtheInquisitor]

You don't think that the market for cheap, sprueless plastic science fiction miniatures (in a board game) and the market for cheap, sprueless plastic science fiction miniatures (in a tabletop game) overlap?

I don't know about all of your finances, but I certainly wouldn't be able to support another KS right now.

Also, I doubt anyone who is still planning to plunk down some serious gelt for 6th Edition, despite already being aware of Kickstarter and Mantic's existence, will suddenly drop everything and spend that money on a Warpath KS. It does not follow, for me.

[EmperorNorton]

Regarding the time frame - I would disagree. Right now, they have a chance to strike while the metal is hot vis-à-vis the 6th edition 40K rules. If they managed to get everything together to push through a kickstarter campaign while people are ho-humming the $75 price tag of a new 40K rulebook and provide something which provides a better value for those hobby dollars, then they could quite likely take a chunk out of GW's pie even more so than they would a year from now.

If I were in the seat over there - I would really take a hard look at being able to launch a Kickstarter campaign that started soon...preferably before the new rulebooks from those other guys started shipping.

40K will still be expensive a year from now.
I don't think putting up a project for Warpath in the near future is a good idea. Their KoW Kickstarter has resulted in so many things needing to be done I am not sure how Mantic will be able to handle it all. And now adding even more would be truly overwhelming, I'm sure.

[loveless]

Mantic's going to be busy actually making all of the things they promised for KoW. Starting a Kickstarter for WP before all of the goals on the KoW Kickstarter are shipped would be in bad taste, IMO.

Get this Kickstarter finished before you go after another one.

[Sean_OBrien]

You don't think that the market for cheap, sprueless plastic science fiction miniatures (in a board game) and the market for cheap, sprueless plastic science fiction miniatures (in a tabletop game) overlap?

Not so much. Sedition Wars didn't really provide much in terms of units. A lot of interesting singles - that would appeal more to collectors and RPG players more so than wargamers. Granted, there are wargamers who are collectors and RPG players (as well as board game players) - but just because both projects feature miniatures, doesn't mean that both projects actually are targeting the same people (or would even be interesting to the same people).

40K will still be expensive a year from now.

40K will be expensive a year from now - but a goodly sized chunk of people will have already committed themselves psychologically by investing $75 in a new core book and $30+ into additional army books...not to mention any miniature purchases which are needed to make the new rules work with the old armies.

I don't think putting up a project for Warpath in the near future is a good idea. Their KoW Kickstarter has resulted in so many things needing to be done I am not sure how Mantic will be able to handle it all. And now adding even more would be truly overwhelming, I'm sure.

I don't think it would be all that overwhelming. The time frame is actually pretty loose even with all the additional items in the KoW stretch goals. As I understand it - the rules are basically done. The miniatures need sculpting to be certain - but they have 6+ months on the vast majority of those, and most professional sculptors I know finish a miniature in a bit over a day of straight work (granted...with cure times, straight work). Tooling/mold making as it applies is relatively straight forward. Even my clumsy hands can do master's and production molds in an afternoon...I am pretty sure that the professionals that Mantic are using are more capable than I. So, overall...the KoW release schedule isn't too bad - even with all the new stuff.

The upside is that all the new stuff will mean that they will likely be taking on one or two new people to deal with logistics and the like, possibly looking at a project manager type which will actually follow up on all the new stuff (miniatures being sculpted, molds being made, production casting being done...China IIRC, wholesale and direct retail shipments). Ronnie will find himself looking for something to do before he realizes what happened.

On the other hand - if people see a lot of new stuff for one system (which KoW will be getting a lot of) and not much new stuff for the other system - they might assume that the other system is the red headed stepchild of the company or worse, abandoned (happens all the time with miniature companies). But, a KS campaign and the releases that will come from it can be worked into the release calender. Rulebook for a Christmas release and the new miniatures for spring of 2013. Not really all that tight of a schedule. But, it gets into the heads of people now.

[Max Jet]

Whatever happens, I really hope an additional full time sculpting artist is going to join Mantics ranks soon! =) And please, someone bring Bob Naismith to revisit the Warzone Range in his free time! XD (yes I know.. in my dreams)

[imm0rtal reaper]

The warpath KS will be next year, to go along with the release of the hardback book, during warpath's 3rd year. The exact pattern kings of war followed.

[Amorphous]

Good I have a year to relieve some of the stress on my credit card

[darkPrince010]

While I'm glad to see that they're planning a WP kickstarter, I reeeally hope for their sake that it's as early as possible (Looking at first week of January if possible). This is because unfortunately I believe 6th will get people buying it and not changing their mind to WP at the last minute. Plus, unless GW pulls a miracle from the heavens, there will likely be a portion of gamers dissatisfied with 6th's ruleset, so it's better to let the gaming public see and judge GW and it's game, and then be offered a cheaper (and imo better) alternative, rather then jumping in with 6th's release and banking on it being successful enough to carry their product and kickstarter as well.

Related directly to the WP-KS offerings, I will personally be the happiest camper if they push to make a release of on-sprue plastic stormrage vets, as those are probably the most appealing model from any fantasy range I've seen in years.

Tl;dr/Rambling summary: Better to have it later and stand alone on their own work then try and fit it in with 6th and fail if GW's product is less well received than expected. Also, yay for on-sprue stormrage vets.

[Llew]

I think logistically they'll need to let it sit for at least 6 months. Getting caught up on their production from the Kickstarter for KoW, plus trying to plan even better for a Warpath KS will take some time. I suspect they'll be equipped for stretch goals far in excess of the $20k they had prepared for this one.

And from an issue of sound business practice, you have to leave some time. You can't be hitting up your customer base for a large flock of pre-orders every few months. You've got to let it rest, and then start teasing the upcoming Kickstarter to build interest.

In reality, waiting to start a Kickstarter until the annual GW price increase is a great idea -- let's you capitalize on the wave of fresh disenchantment and gives you a chance to reach some more new fans.

[imm0rtal reaper]

If they do one, it won't be in january, I'll put money on that. The kings of war stuff won't have been finished by then.

Also, the whole point of these kickstarters is to celebrate the release of the hardback rules. Which we don't have the second version of warpath yet, we get it (next?) month I think so they'll leave it a year for that to be tested and broken before the do a kickstarter.

I would however, Like them to do it one month earlier so that they can be running the KS during salute and adeptacon, that way there are a lot of people who will see the deals, go home and pledge.

[scarletsquig]

Better to wait until next year, after all the stuff from the current Kickstarter is sculpted. There's only so much that can be done, and the Warpath rules *really* need some work before people will want to buy into the game on the same level as KoW.

It'll be huge when it does happen, though!

[Robert]

A fifth army release and a few more Warpath releases would help as well. We all know the negativity surrounding the initial Forge Father and Maurder releases... So a good new army, plus things like the Iron Ancestor and Commandos will give Mantic some momentum going into any KS campaign.

[strewart]

Yeah I agree that Mantic will be quite busy pushing out all the new models from the KoW kickstarter for a while, so any WP at all will probably be a while away, let alone a whole kickstarter campaign.

The thing that turned me off the KoW kickstarter was that I didn't really know what it was funding, especially early on. There was the rulebook coming out, but aside from that... Most of the pledges were just for an army of already made models. They should define real goals and ambitions with a project from the start and outline exactly what they want to achieve as a minimum. Of course this will be easier the second time around after getting a bit of a guage on how much money people were willing to give them. From the initial $5k (?) goal, who knew whether it would get to $20k or a million?

Also, fantasy in general is usually quite generic. WHFB has its own flavour in some ways as does KoW, but it really all boils down to fantasy with a twist. Sci-fi has the opportunity to be much more unique, and WH40k really has an extremely rich and deep universe not just captivated by a very extensive and strong range of miniatures, but also mountains of artwork, stories, books and even games and a crappy movie. A big appeal of 40k is the strong universe, WP really is nowhere near competing on that level yet and I think it will take a lot more imagination to convert people from 40k than to get players from WHFB to KoW. I think it would be well worth strengthening WP's background before attempting a KS project.

[Gunless Ganger]

Regarding the time frame - I would disagree. Right now, they have a chance to strike while the metal is hot vis-à-vis the 6th edition 40K rules. If they managed to get everything together to push through a kickstarter campaign while people are ho-humming the $75 price tag of a new 40K rulebook and provide something which provides a better value for those hobby dollars, then they could quite likely take a chunk out of GW's pie even more so than they would a year from now.

I'd disagree with that slightly. I'd say they should aim somewhere between your suggestion and the OPs 1 year date.

If they push it through too early a lot of people will hesitate because they're just about to buy and start 6th edition. They should wait a couple of months and catch that inevitable wave of people who have tried the game and not liked the changes. The changes to 6th ed sound a lot like the changes made to 8th ed Fantasy - there were a lot of people who were excited about the new edition at launch but who soured on it a few months later. A big Warpath Kickstarter timed to match is going to attract attention from both the people who like the changes and are thinking about starting a new army to exploit the changes and see the affordable Mantic stuff, and the attention of the people who didn't like the changes and see - wow free rules and quality affordable minis!

That also gives them time to deal with all the Warpath order and get a good stack of concept art ready for the ever-hungry ravening hordes of Kickstarter. ;-)