If you want kill power go for g.w,durability and holding use shields,you dont have to glue the arms on in your first couple of games till you find out what you like,and feels right, if thats ok by your opponents.Or do 50/50 for interchangeable front ranks unless wsywig is in place with those you play with.
Last edited by Soundwave; 27-06-2012 at 13:27.
Originally Posted by X4600
I don't think there have been any substantial rumours on dwarf models, and WoC are next in line to come out late this year...so it will be a while until new kits.
Plus, new kits will most likely target the current metal range - hammerers, ironbreakers, slayers, grudge & bolt throwers. I don't realistically think any of the battallion contents will change any time soon.
Warriors or Longbeards
I've personally always thought the longbeard upgrade was overcosted; however since you can only have one unit of rangers in an army its worth making them longbeards. In competitive settings, I think warriors are probably the more common pick.
Great Weapon or HW&S
Unfortunately, with the current book, this is a massive no-brainer toward Great Weapons; however I have, on very rare occasions, seen shield dwarfs in small units in competitive lists. Its always GW unless you got some sort of specific reason for shields though.
Quarellers / Thunderers
For quarellers, the GW upgrade is nice, because its cheap-ish and means they can beat up harassers. I've never found shields particularly useful on either unit, and I've not seen them used regularly.
Snake
Thnx buddy,
I enjoy a lord tank, its always good to take on a good army after your artillery and quarrelers/thunderers hav reduced a hoard to 3 ranks or so. Plus his hard to kill especially with a nice series of luck with the dice! I might mix him in a unit of longbeards with great weapons and hav him tearing.
I hav seen a few tactics on utube and hav thought it might be good to hav a dwarf castle set-up. With your flanks set up and your warmachines and shooting units to take down the enemy before they reach your tank units.
I dont see the difference of having no command models compared to having them.
I love your lord set-up and im thinking of using it. Thanks for the help,
X4600
Champions provide an extra attack, as well as protection against heroes via challenges (so the hero only kills the champion and doesn't go to town on the unit).
Standard Bearers provide an extra 1 combat resolution; however they also give points away when the unit is destroyed in combat or ran down. Pretty meh, but its generally good to have one on your main combat block(s). Elite units can put runes on their banners for some interesting effects.
Musicians are awesome under this new edition, in part because they are undercosted (half price) because we are an old book. They don't have as much impact in one specific area as the other two upgrades, but provide a lot of small buffs in many areas - resolving drawn combats and +1 to rally after fleeing are nice, although the latter is unlikely to come into play much with dwarfs. The real bonus of musicians to dawi is the free reform, which immensely helps our hampered movement.
Snake
Right thnx for the advice,
I think i might go towards a hoarde of warriors with some ranger longbeards picking off warmachines and all that it the enemy area while gradually moving my frontline upwards, if the enemy turns to my miners/rangers my units will charge them. (of course this is a more offensive play, but with some experimenting it might work nicely) i could bring on my other units later in the game when my line has moved up.
I will go great weapon when i can, however my BfSP warriors are premade sheild and hand weapon warriors.
I think for quarrelers and thunderers i will chose a larger block of quarrelers with 2 smaller blocks of thunders on the sides picking off enemies. (can quarrelers take the GW option?)
This would probably work and ill c how i go.
Thnx snake,
X4600
PS add me as a friend on warseer
They also allow you not to lose in one turn if you play Blood and Glory.
My printable cardboard terrain blog , and the store (latest product: Orc Idol)
Painting log, last pictures: March, 7th, 2013 -> Goblin BSB
Urgat's Armory v0.3 [Blood in the Badlands Siege options]
Oooo, well spotted, I haven't played scenarios for a whileI'd still only ever place them on combat units though.
You need a certain % of the unit to accurately represent the equipment they have - what I mean is that later on when you have blocks of GW warriors, you can sprinkle the HW+S models here and there for variety - it looks quite nice as it breaks the monotony, and it means you don't waste models!
I'd be wary of putting together more thunderers - I was a big fan initially, and I had 40! I've been slowly phasing them out since, and I've never seen a successful list run more than 10. You can (and should) build your battalion piece by piece, testing, and then deciding how to proceed.
Please keep an eye out on the battalion - it should have 32 warriors and 16 ranged troops. Some older versions only have 24 warriors and come in a different sized box (square).
So, a list from what you currently have and bits from the battalion would be something like this:
Infantry:
10 thunderers (BfSP) - ranged unit
10 quarellers with GW (You have) - ranged + support unit
10 shield warriors (BfSP) - support unit
20 GW warriors (Battalion) - main combat block
10 rangers (Battalion) - support unit
10 miners (You have) - support unit
5 miners (BfSP) - support unit
Artillery:
1 Cannon
1 Organ Gun
Characters (this is subject to change, desires, and converting):
1 Dragon Slayer (BfSP)
1 Thane (BfSP) - general
1 Thane BSB (Battalion - conversion)
1 Runesmith (Battalion - conversion)
This list is around 1500 points, provides a reasonably flexible if slightly underpowered army (as it isn't optimzed but more random units hanging together - whoever you are elarning against shouldn't have much better), and it means you don't have to assemble the 16 ranged troops and warmachine from the battalion until you decide what to do with them. Warriors and Longbeards look more or less the same - difference comes from decorations and painting - so are reasonably interchangable, especially if you use them unpainted in test games.
Snake
The Warriors from BfSP can make convincing Iron Breakers in a pinch ...
ALWAYS, *always* take Rangers, of the flavour you want (Warriors with GWs, Longbeards with GWs [both of those with Throwing Axes, especially the Longbeards, S5 Stand a Shoot hurts] or Quarrelers with GWs) ... the simple fact that they can deploy anywhere on the battlefield (but more than 12 inches away from an enemy unit) is invaluable : with Crossbows, they'll be at Short Range of most of the enemy army, and even without Crossbows, a single March Move and they will force the enemy to take Leadership tests if they want to make March Moves of their own (Enemy Sighted rule).
In fact, take as much Great Weapons as possible !
What You See Is What You Get (WYSIWYG) isn't really a rule in Warhammer Battle, you'd need at least the front rank to be clearly representative of what the unit is "on paper", and then you can fill back ranks with aestheticaly pleasing models ...
Regarding Command Groups, I'd say to always take a full command, because it looks good, but also because you never know when you'll need that +1 to combat resolution, or that Champion (Veteran) to block a challenge, or that nifty Musician for quick reforms and drawn combat (or even after a tactical retreat, for the +1 to rally), but that's just my point of view ...
Oh, from my experience, units of 32 Thunderers in two ranks of 16 absolutely murder anything in their range, +1 to hit, S4 and Armour Piercing make even Chaos Knights think twice ...
Quarrelers can indeed take Great Weapons (pre-requisite to make them Rangers), but the Thunderers cannot ... I usually take Shields on my Thunderers (I have a 1000 points seldom-used Dwarf army), with Full Command and a pair of pistols (for free!) on the Veteran ...
Hmm, do you have the "basic" rules of 8th edition ? There's lots of little combos to know to play effectively ...
Finally, there are rumours of a new Dwarf book (sometimes next year), but I haven't heard or read anything about new models ... the Warriors and Quarrellers kits are relatively new (and nice and modulable), same thing for the Canon/Organ Gun kit, the Gyrocopter, Bolt Thrower, Grudge Thrower, Battle Standard Bearer, some Lords and Heroes and a couple of Special Characters were "recently" remade in FineCast, so I wouldn't worry about models getting remade soon (except perhaps Hammerers [that you can make with a bit of convertion from the Warrior kit [Great Weapon arms, cut the axe-head, replace it with hammer-head from the Hand Weapon arms] and Ironbreakers [that are basically Hand Weapon and Shield Dwarves with a metallic paint job]).
As others have said, if your finances don't allow for a Bataillon right now, wait and save ... with said Bataillon, you basically get the Canon/Organ Gun kit for free with 2 Warriors kits and 1 Quarrelers kit.
Ok First off i have 16 quarrelers and 8 and 10 miners.
This woulds be a nice setup in a 1500 point game, i could hav 3 units (miners and rangers) spawning fairly close to the enemy (when rangers are closy to the enemy i could bring on my miners) this would be a great offensive setup and would be good if i could spees up some troops with some runes. Giving quarrelers shields allows them to be extra killy so if i could spend the first few turns picking off the enemy untill they come in range then charge. My tank lord could be in the warriors with GW's unit. This would be more of an offensive tactic but ill c how it goes.
Thnx for the tips againg Snake,
X4600
Does anyone have any good tactics or playstyles with dwarves?
Here are some battleblogs from Bugman's Brewery.
A tournament report from #1 Dwarf in the world Aaron Chapman: - http://www.bugmansbrewery.com/topic/...ge__hl__furgil
Andy Spiers' Dwarf Battleblog (top UK, #3 overall) - http://www.bugmansbrewery.com/topic/...e-report-pg-4/
Very good very recent battle reports from the ETC Warmup this year: - http://www.bugmansbrewery.com/topic/...he-etc-warmup/ by a Dutch player Halbrad.
Snake
These are excellent battle reports. Let me give you the advice I got from lessons learned when starting my own dwarf force.
1) Focus on Great Weapons. They really do outperform our HW and Shield guys, even the longbeards with shields (although, not by a ton).
2) You really need to field at least a single horde of hammerers.
3) Our ballistic shooting is not as strong as our war machine shooting. However, our Quarrelers can take Great Weapons which makes them pretty useful throughout the game.
Easy(ish) steps to a (relatively) low cost dwarf army using GW models -
1) Buy 3 Batallion sets. This works out to a little more than 300 USD, but it's actually pretty cheap for a start up.
2) Each box comes with 32 warriors and 16 Thunderers/Quarrelers, and the parts to make either an Organ Gun or a Cannon. They also come with the weapon bits to make HW and Shield warriors, gw warriors, and the different ranged models.
3) Take all the hammers (they are on the warrior sprues) and carefully snip the hammer heads off. Then, look at all the banner tops and clip off any of the anvil shaped ones. These make really good hammer heads as well.
4) Clip off the axe heads from the great weapons. Glue the hammer heads in place. Make 38 of them. Voila! You have 38 hammers for a Hammerer horde. You can use the face masks on the warrior sprues in order to make them look a little different. I painted mine in a purple and gold theme to make them look royal. Here, you need to be careful to use the Warrior bodies, as the Thunderer bodies are not the right size for the great weapon bits. For those bodies, if you need to glean them, there is a long handled axe found on the warrior sprues. There are plenty of left arms you can use in combination.
5) Make two hordes of Great Weapon warriors. You *should* have enough Great Weapons left.
6) This should leave you with 18 unused bodies. You can convert one of these to be your Thane Battle Standard bearer. Be creative! It's fun. You can convert the other to be your Runelord General. Give him a hand weapon and a shield. (trust me).
7) Build two Cannons and an Organ gun. You can convert a second Organ Gun using the Pony model from the BFSP set that you have. Simply remove the carriage and set the barrel in the gap with glue. Works like a charm. Might take some fiddling though.
Now, all you need is a Grudge Thrower and you have a very powerful 2500 point army on your hands.
This feels excessive for a start up, even if he didn't have models already - 2 battalion boxes is enough to make an army of near 3000 pts with on top of what he's got. I'd start off with 1 and build from there so you can test things you are putting together.
The rest of the post is pretty solid advice. Obviously since you already have 1 cannon and 1 organ gun, you'd be looking to make a second of each (or a GT conversion - keep in mind from a $$$ perspective cannons are the lowest priority, since you can get the starter set ones for about 1/5th the price).
Snake
Hey guys,
Im going shopping 4 a birthday present 2morrow. Besides the battalion what else would i need for my army?
I'd say a Gyrocopter ... that little thing can be a right pain for your opponent, nipping around the back of his units, forcing him to take Leadership tests to make March Moves (thus getting you more time to pound him with guns), and the steam gun with the big flame template is only S3, but armour piercing ... with the size of that template, you should be able to cover most of a standard ranked unit, and even Chaos Warriors will take a couple of casualties (to say nothing of my poor Night Goblins that have been fryed by the dozen).
I think he meant more gaming aids...you need rulebook, army book, dice (incl, scatter), templates, tape measure.
I would also strongly recommend getting movement trays immediately with the army. Moving units separately is a pain.
The rest are modelling & painting tools which vary wildly by person.
I'd recommend not to buy anything beyond the battalion at this stage - its not like you get a bulk discount, and once you get some games in you will make better ifnormed choices about what you want.
I personally don't rate the gyrocopter that much, because it doesn't really do either of the things you mentioned above very well (Ld tests are rarely failed in this edition of reroll bubbles, and the template still has partials), but thats more relevant to personal preference.
Snake
Yer i might pick one of those up, i was thinking it would be a good artilllery hunter and be fun for frying weaker units (eg night goblins, clanrats, ect.) its also not a bad paint.
Yer i did mean actual units, but ill take a look into the movement trays.
Btw what do u mean not buying beond the battalion?
U hav got a point with leadership there tho.
I mean don't buy a ton of stuff at the same time, because at this point you don't know exactly what you would want. But yeh, get movement trays. I think a pack costs roughlyhalf of the organ gun kit, and should cover your entire army if you use it wisely.
Snake
Hmm i am obviously missing something here,When i borrowed my mates dwarf army my 40 strong bus of dwarven warriors with sheild and hand weapon held my flank against a horde of chaos warriors ,whilst my horde of hammerers went on the rampage?But no are G.W the way to go?
Posting Permissions
Reply With Quote