Can someone point me to the page in the rulebook that says we can swap Eldar powers for ones in the BADAB? Especially where it says we get two powers for each eldar one paid for...
Im also looking at the Divination powers and Im not sure the swap is worth it. I just think that rerolling saves with fortune is just too good to give up.
Last edited by koran; 02-07-2012 at 20:31.
Been awhile since I've played Eldar but I think I may give them another go to see how 6th goes. I'm thinking Eldrad, Karandras, 10 Wraithguard with a Spiritseer, 5 Pathfinders, 7 Pathfinders manning an Quad Gun Aegis, 2x5 Hawks with Skyleap Exarch, and 2x3 Walkers with double ShuriCans looks like it will be pretty good. Vehicles won't last long and as mentioned before, with a spot of Divination mass S6 might be enough to take down all the Termies we are sure to see. And of course then there's the Wraithguard brick of doom; kills all the things, all the time, and lives to tell the tale.
After glancing through the new rules, I'm still standing by the fact that Pathfinders are the new hotness right now. AP1 on a 5+ to hit, AP1 & pick your taget on a 6+ to hit, didn't roll that 5 or 6 to hit? Don't worry. Rolling a 6 to would gives you AP 2.
THESE are the termie killers. They are 16 points cheaper then a terminator, they have scout, and they essentially have shroud. Put 10 of them in cover on an objective and watch them waste anything thats not a vehicle. With the range to stay away from most things, and (if you get lucky) the ability to snap fire at BS (see: moving and shooting sniper rifles), I'm thinking that these guys may make me want to get back into 40K and play Alaitoc.
I'm probably over-reacting a bit, but after looking at what went wrong with the Eldar book, I'm happy that at least something got a boost. Also, I'm thinking I'm going to be a fan of War Walker squadrons as the AT part of the list. New rules for squadrons are nice. WW are still over costed (what isn't?), but I'm pretty sure that they can kill everything short of a LR simply by looking at it long enough.
On another note, I'm not too happy with the Allies table. Not becuase I don't like it, as I actually do, but becuase I'm going to get REAL tired of folks who would never tough out eldar in 5th edition running a farseer in EVER LIST THEY MAKE. *Shudder*. No tournaments for me anymore methinks....
So, whats the thoughts here? War walkers and Pathfinders as bread and butter. I'm thinking a QRF of Dire Avengers in a WS. Fill in holes as needed. Maybe I'll make up a list of that...
yep....how about that....
You think War Walkers are overcosted?
Its in the eldar FAQOriginally Posted by koran
WH40k - 6th edition
Eldar: W:0 - D:0 - L:0
Chaos Blood Angels: W:0 - D:0 - L:0
Grey Knights: W:0 - D:0 - L:0
WHFB - 8th edition
Daemons: W: 17 - L:1 - D:1
Lizarmen: W: 15 - L:3 - D:0
Guys, you just got my feeling for the eldars. I love my tanks, and my bansheed. I definitely love my (whatever the HS new tank is call that tangles enemies, man I love it), but S6 walkers on the flanks destroying most tanks? maybe even fliers with so many shoots? petty the rerolling to hit is only 12".
Maybe instead of karandras in that unit, run the Avatar he can't hide that well, but is still hard to kill.
Shooting and things without cover thanks to the divination spell? or snap firing at BS with wraith guard weapons? bye bye termies, MC, or whatever.
IS shooting at fliers considered snapshooting?
WH40k - 6th edition
Eldar: W:0 - D:0 - L:0
Chaos Blood Angels: W:0 - D:0 - L:0
Grey Knights: W:0 - D:0 - L:0
WHFB - 8th edition
Daemons: W: 17 - L:1 - D:1
Lizarmen: W: 15 - L:3 - D:0
I'm not an expert, and I'm usually wrong, but after purchasing two weapons for them, I still have to wrap my head around the 2 hull points....
But, I have a list!! Appraise it!
HQ:
Farseer, RoW, SS, Doom, Eld. Storm, Guide, Mind War (swap for BRB disciplines)
Farseer, SS, Fortune, Doom
Elite:
7 Harlequins, Troupe Master, Shadowseer, 4x Kisses
Troop:
10 Pathfinders
10 Pathfinders
9 Pathfinders
10 Dire Avengers, Exarch w/ shimmer shield, bladestorm, power wpn, WS w/ TL scatter lasers
Heavy:
3x Warwalkers
- 2 w/ 2x Scatter laser
- 1 w/ 2x Bright Lance
Fire Prism
1800 Points
The idea is to scout the pathfinders up to good firing positions, or to sit them back in defences in my deployment zone. Hide the BRB farseer behind 2 of the squads to do sneaky stuff (and with any luck get the spells I need). The other farseer goes into hiding on the other flank to support the other squad of pahfinders and harlies. The Dire Avengers hide in the WS to try and plug holes in the line with a beefed up bladestorm. War Walkers exist to pop light vehicles and the occasional heavy vehicle flank as its presented. The fire prism drops bombs on parking lots or heavy vehicles and hopes for a lucky punch.
Kind of rough. It only took a few minutes to come up with, but I think its the basis that I'm going to work around. Thoughts?
yep....how about that....
A couple things I thought about as I was trying to build a 1500 point list with the new rules using no vehicles.
First, Runes of Warding are awesome. Plus we still get Deny the Witch rolls if they target us, which is double awesome. And those rolls are better if you have a Psyker, so I built a list using a ton.
Second, I think Warp Spiders got a lot better, because they can now shred tanks with glances with no AP- penalty. Combine with an Autarch for the reserves bonus, and they come in 2+ second turn on Deep Strike.
Third, Rangers, not Pathfinders, are the New Awesome. Why are they better than Pathfinders? Because their only bonus, the AP1 on a 6, is on an allocatable shot. You don't waste the 5+ Pathfinders get. Also, when assaulted, and they will be, you snap shot your sniper rifles and hope for 6s, which is what you need anyway to get all your awesome AP1 and allocatable awesomeness!
Fourth, Harlequins, while much worse, are our only answer to terminators in close combat, and there will be lots of terminators in this edition.
Fifth, Assaulting Wraithguard used to be the only way to get rid of them, and now we get to Overwatch, which could help a lot.
Sixth, Guardians actually aren't that bad anymore if you get a warlock for them. The warlock can challenge the person who is generally the most dangerous in the assault to soak up wounds, and models with crap ballistic skill are best to just stand and take charges cause they are penalized the least. The warlock also gets to overwatch the Destructor. Plus the scatterlase is cheap, and awesome against vehicles now.
So my list I built uses all of that as my exposition
HQ:
Farseer, Guide, Mind War, RoWard, Spirit Stones (Sub Out Powers, That's why I bought the Cheapest)
Autarch, Warp Jump Generator, madiblasters, Fusion Gun, Power Sword
Troops:
10 Wraithguard, Spiritseer, Conceal
5 Rangers
10 Guardians Warlock, Destructor, Scatter Laser
Elites:
6 Harlequins, Shadowseer (You can throw Plasma Grenades, Finally The Rule Does Something!)
Fast Attack:
5 Warp Spiders, Exarch, Double Spinner, Power Blades, Withdraw
Heavy Support
2 Wraithlords, EML, Bright Lance, Double Flamers
Total: 1500 (If my math is correct)
I love all the Psykers from the Shadowseer, Farseer, and Two Warlocks to use improved Deny the Witch.
Anyway, those are some of my thoughts. I will be interested to see if Eldar on Foot get a boost in this edition, which is why I put this list together, to give it a whirl.
You forget the Pathfinders also get Scout and an extra cover save, the latter of which is very important given the general reduction of the cover values in 6th.
A couple of thoughts on the OP:
Maugan Ra: his gun is nasty with directed hits. Depending on how it works, he could have a nice power weapon in that executioner, and he's among the cheaper PLs. Might be worth taking.
Striking scorpions got a relative boost in on-table speed. Their charge range was 12" before, now, it is 18". Combined with good armor, move through cover, infiltrate, etc, they might be worth a second look.
Rangers: Back in the old tactica, pretty sure someone did the mathhammer and found that point-for-point, rangers outshot pathfinders. The fact that pathfinders AP1-on-a-5 doesn't synergize with the sniper USR means that Pathfinders are even more of diminishing returns. Balance this with the pathfinders much improved defense. This increases the disparity between the two units: rangers are better, point for point, on offense, but pathfinders are the clear winners on defense. Are you holding an objective, or trying to snipe those flamers/meltas/MLs?
Harlies : even after the rightly expected 1.1 nerf to their rules, they still will gain 2+ cover from any 5+ cover granting object. This makes them the toughest CC unit at range we have. Just don't get them flamer'd.
Wraithguard: Foreboding literally blunts the crap out of their achilles heel - being charged by terminators before firing. Terminators will not enjoy foreboding'd-overwatch with 10 wraithcannons. The fact that you need two farseers to both forebode, and fortune a wraithguard block, and that precludes the avatar joining the army below 2000 points, may be totally blunted by the fact that the wraithguard can volley into an assaulting unit. Combine this with a Harlequin unit getting a 2+ cover save by being obscured by the wraithguard... this combination is even more difficult to shift than it was last edition.
Warp Spiders: The only place I see an autarch working at all. melta gun + warlord's personal abilities could make it a great, durable (eldar durable), fast, all-around unit.
Wraithlord: Cheapy-lord (sword+scatter) got a buff in both their offensive modes - they get an extra free re-rollable attack on the charge, and their scatter laser can glance down tanks. Also: MCs and Tanks now get cover saves if they are 25% obscured by cover/other models. Fun fact: Wraithguard obscure 25% of a wraithlord.
In terms of list building, do not discount the fact that 2 FOCs are available at 2k+ points. Really helps with our dilemma about psyker powers, and about our HS over-crowding.
Outstanding issues:
We need an assessment of how viable our ranged anti-tank is. Can we take an EML/Pulse Laser Falcon and have it be effective against AV13? Are people going to take enough land raiders (due to decreased rhino durability and increased Termy efficiency) to make the BL a worthwhile weapon?
Are Dark Reapers going to be worth taking, now that it is easier to get marine bodies onto the tabletop in a 5+ cover world?
I won't get games until this weekend, but insight from the tabletop would be good.
Last edited by Gwyidion; 03-07-2012 at 00:50.
My thoughts exactly. Both for an extra 5 points. Seems worth it enough for me. Easy enough with scout to put pathfinders in area terrain to give them that nice 3+ cover. At least, that was my thinking.
yep....how about that....
FAQ
We don't get 2 per every eldar one, only one.
Last edited by Frgt/10; 03-07-2012 at 01:30.
I came up with a pretty sick Deathstar unit. 10 Warlocks. Enhance. Embolden. Conceal. Destructor x 7. Farseer with Fortune. Eldrad Ulthran. Swap out Eldrad's powers for Telepathy in hopes of getting "Invisibility," which grants stealth and shrouded.
Essentially you would have a unit that has a 2+ rerollable cover save in the open, a 4+ invul rerollable, and 7D3 auto hits at Str 5 AP 4 if they overwatch (which should average 14 hits).
Last edited by Fable; 03-07-2012 at 13:21. Reason: corrected typo to number of hits
Fantasy Novels:www.TheEverWar.com
Are you perchance a salt salesman, or do you derive income from salt sales related activities?
See My Ulthwe Plog Now Including a Phantom Titan and Dark Eldar
How To Build A Phantom Titan pdf
My Most Recent Battle Report January 6th 2013
thats impressive.... nice
After playing some games it becomes apparent how good the psychic powers are pretty much across the board. Some of them are very situational, but in those situations they're mammothly powerful. Outside of a Farseer I want to have intentionally babysit a unit I can't think of a time I'd not want to take the rulebook powers. If these are any indication of the future psychic powers then bring them on.
I think people who want to keep farseers cheap should consider purchasing a spirit stone and one power. For less than 100 pts you have a psyker that can use any single power, so if you get one of the WC2 powers you can use it.
Also, the skylanding platform is stupidly good. I have a Web Way Gate piece of terrain that I made for my table and I used it as the platform (it's slightly smaller than the actual platform) and the 4++ bubble is spectacular. Since it's a "unique" piece of terrain and not a building it can't be destroyed (similar to battlefield debris). Until GW crack up some interesting rules for a Web way Gate it gives you a reason to craft your own. Especially if you use a lot of squishy bodies.
Last edited by Fable; 03-07-2012 at 13:21.
Fantasy Novels:www.TheEverWar.com
Are you perchance a salt salesman, or do you derive income from salt sales related activities?
See My Ulthwe Plog Now Including a Phantom Titan and Dark Eldar
How To Build A Phantom Titan pdf
My Most Recent Battle Report January 6th 2013
How does it average 26 hits?
Yeah but that's like 600+ points for a slow unit with 12" range that doesn't score. If I was your opponent I would ignore that unit and slaughter the rest of your team.
I think he's calculated that off 7D6 instead of 7D3, which should only average 14 hits...
Swap Eldrad for a regular farseer and stick them on jetbikes then you don't need the conceal as you have a 5+ jink save. So you can fit in an extra destructor. Makes the unit very very fast. I would take Doom as well as Fortune. Thats 8 twin linked heavy flamers in a unit that can move 12"
and then retreat 2D6".
Nice idea anyway. I may try it. Question in what warlord power do you take? I would go for personal myself in the hope of making the unit score or getting outflank or feel no pain.
Last edited by Frimbleglim; 03-07-2012 at 12:58.
Gods in 3.0 D&D play dice with the universe, sometimes throw the dice behind the DM's screen where they cannot be seen and then count as getting the best possible result.
"Absolute precision buys the freedom to dream meaningfully." -Donnal O'Shea The Poincare Conjecture.
A lot of it depends on the mission and who I'm giving Warlord to. For instance, Furious Charge doesn't do much if a Farseer is my warlord. But being able to extend his LD 10 bubble would be very handy. And it's the exact opposite for an Avatar. Try to look at each game individually and figure which command set has the largest chance to help you in the mission you rolled up. My current sense is that no one set of powers is better than the other overall.
It doesn't. I apparently duffed my typing roll. I have corrected it to 14 hits.
Last edited by Fable; 03-07-2012 at 13:22.
Fantasy Novels:www.TheEverWar.com
Are you perchance a salt salesman, or do you derive income from salt sales related activities?
See My Ulthwe Plog Now Including a Phantom Titan and Dark Eldar
How To Build A Phantom Titan pdf
My Most Recent Battle Report January 6th 2013
Posting Permissions
Reply With Quote