Dwarf Rumours

[stortotta]

That would be a real shame as I think the entire Dwarf range needs a reboot. The core plastics are ok, but not great and as for the elites it's kind of sad that they are much worse than the Marauder miniatures range from over 20 years ago. Pretty much only the slayers and half the characters are worth keeping.

But I'll bet we'll get some stupid new unit, looking at the recent Chaos stuff they seem to have to add several new units with every army book. Trouble is we end up with too much choice and silly stuff that alters the race's style.

Too much choice? Wtf?

[Harry]

Don't fool yourself about GW changing the imagery of the Dwarfs - it's won't be a wholesale reboot of the line. At the moment, the Dwarf plastic kits are only 7 years old, or less than that. That's HALF the age of the Dark Eldar kits when they got rebooted. We could easily see the new kits going in a somewhat different direction esthetically, but the existing kits are staying.

Says you.
In the words of our lord 'The Dude' "That's just like your opinion man" But is that informed by some inside source or based on your on previous experience. I'm not saying your wrong ... I'm just asking. Folks might have said the same about DE .... except we had heard it was happening. However .... Just because we have not heard it is happening does not mean that it isn't.

[Luigi]

Why do i have the feeling that we will actually see the unreleased plastic lord finally released and for sale?

[Godswildcard]

But I'll bet we'll get some stupid new unit, looking at the recent Chaos stuff they seem to have to add several new units with every army book. Trouble is we end up with too much choice and silly stuff that alters the race's style.

I actually think I get this statement. The more recent releases (DA, WoC, CSM) and some of the later 8th edition books have all had units that either didn't get the model support they needed with the original release (wtf Maulers lol, TK still missing their must-take hierotitan), have rules that don't make sense based on the background for the model (Nephalim), or are overpowered auto-includes (Mournfang Cav, CSM dragon flyer thingy).

I love dwarfs, and I think that they deserve a D.Eldar style reboot. I'm afraid that instead of concentrating on boosting the units that we all know and love and releasing new models for said units, GW will put in some rediculous giant golem thing that will fall into one the categories above while neglecting some of the other units in the game that would be fine with a little modification. Back in the day, you couldn't have too much choice as everything was released in a timely fashion with good rules and good models. Not so anymore. The question the is: would you rather have new plastic kits for the existing line with good rules to boot, or would you rather gamble than the $85 dual-monster kit that they will inevitably release will have at least one useful variant that won't be stupid broken.

I don't know. Am I making sense?

[theJ]

@Godswildcard:
Technically, yes, you are making sense, the problem is I'm not sure I agree.

You'll have to forgive me if I'm being ignorant, as I wasn't around back in the "good ol' days", but my impression is that the problems you mention have always been there. There have often been entries without models, there have always been stupidly OP units, as well as nigh-useless ones, and while not overly common(thank Khorne), rules not meshing with background is hardly a new phenomena.

As for reboots... most armies "deserve" them. I'd love for my High Elves to get most of their kits redone, because frankly, the ones I really really love can be counted on one hand(plastic lord, phoenix guard, dragon princes and IoB, if you're interested). I doubt WoC would've complained if all their warriors, marauders, and various metals/finecasts were replaced with shiny new plastic kits. As someone who really don't like the direction they've gone with the Slaneeshi and Tzeentch daemons so far, I wouldn't mind seeing those redone, despite their(lack of) age.
Are Dwarfs counted in the list of "armies who'd like a reboot"? Of course they are! Just about all armies want that, even the ones with good support already.
Do Dwarfs have an especially high "need" for a reboot? Not really. They're not worse off than the majority of fantasy armies were prior to their latest releases(significantly worse than most 40K though, I'll give you that). They may not be new and shiny, but they're Dwarfs, damnit! They can handle aged miniatures better than any other army purely by weight of character. Frankly, other than the lack of stylistic consistency, I'm not really sure how to make 'em look better than they already do - minor details aside. Two waves should be plenty for Dwarfs, and I doubt getting stuck with just a single one would be enough to "kill" them - assuming such a wave looked okay, obviously.
If I had to choose an army that actually deserves a remake above the others, I'd choose Bretonnians. They're the only ones without ANY really good models(well, 'cept the Green Knight, anyway), AND have a desperate need for new units on top of it. ...and before you ask, no, I do not play them.

I'm not saying I'd be sad if the Dwarfs got rebooted, I'm saying I don't agree that they need said reboot more than most of the other armies out there.

[the anti santa]

I actually think I get this statement. The more recent releases (DA, WoC, CSM) and some of the later 8th edition books have all had units that either didn't get the model support they needed with the original release (wtf Maulers lol, TK still missing their must-take hierotitan), have rules that don't make sense based on the background for the model (Nephalim), or are overpowered auto-includes (Mournfang Cav, CSM dragon flyer thingy).

I love dwarfs, and I think that they deserve a D.Eldar style reboot. I'm afraid that instead of concentrating on boosting the units that we all know and love and releasing new models for said units, GW will put in some rediculous giant golem thing that will fall into one the categories above while neglecting some of the other units in the game that would be fine with a little modification. Back in the day, you couldn't have too much choice as everything was released in a timely fashion with good rules and good models. Not so anymore. The question the is: would you rather have new plastic kits for the existing line with good rules to boot, or would you rather gamble than the $85 dual-monster kit that they will inevitably release will have at least one useful variant that won't be stupid broken.

I don't know. Am I making sense?

You put it better than I did.

I consider the dwarf range to be pretty poor, we have decent characters and the slayers are good but aside from that the model range is not great. I still think the best dwarfs they've done were the old marauder ones. Those hammerers knock the socks off the bland mono-pose ones we have now.

But the trouble is to sell models GW are bringing out new things, if they were to revamp the dwarf warriors then the worry is that many wouldn't bother getting them since they already have plenty of those. Dwarfs have a very distinct character army wise, they lack cavalry, skirmishers, magicians and monsters. So I'd be wary of them introducing that element into the army. There is room for manouver, such as skirmishing slayers or rangers, units of combat gyrocopters or a large warmachine that is similar to a monster. Some of the armies that get the most attention they have clearly run out of ideas for, that's why we end up with daft stuff.

The other option is making up new units, but my worry with that is it will be yet more slow heavy infantry. So that's what I mean by "too much choice", our 3 elite units are already pretty samey. Plus there's not much difference visually between dwarf warriors, longbeards and the rangers in that kit.
So I'd rather they revamp them and give them plastic kits. If we end up with 5 elite units then it's highly likely some will be much better value for others and we'll see little of the weaker units.

[Volt]

Plus there's not much difference visually between dwarf warriors, longbeards and the rangers in that kit..

Well in that instance, that was a case of GW being extremely lazy. How the current warriors can pass as longbeards, by simply glueing on the masks, is beyond me. Same thing with glueing greataxes to the back of quarrlers to pass as rangers.

Seeing the latest Warriors of Chaos release, I can see everything that was released with the last book staying and plenty of new kits, mostly to replace the metal figures. The only thing I can see being redone would be the grudge thrower and bolt thower, as a dual plastic kit could be possible.

[GrottoKnight]

The oldest and really only WHFB/40k books that haven't had an update in order are:

1. Bretonnia February 2004
2. Wood Elves September 2005
3. Black Templars November 2005
4. Dwarfs January 2006
5. Tau March 2006
6. Eldar November 2006
7. High Elves November 2007

Vamps ('12, '08) and WoC ('13,'08) both got two new books now since the Dwarfs had theirs so their is no givens when it comes to trends in army book releases. Dwarf lineup needs and hasn't been given a model re-haul if you look back how far some of the units go when it comes to their sculpts. These models have been talked about plenty here so I won't go into it but they will be addressed. I would guess they are taking their time on all things Dwarf when it comes to rules, story, and sculpts. I would expect the Dwarfs to FINALLY get a nice special character lineup like all the other armies have now which would be fun.

In keeping trends with the recent launches I have no doubt there will be some major changes to the Dwarfs that will have the 'ol grumblers mouthing expletives in their frothy mugs......time change old dogs. Heck, with the current edition of fantasy Dwarfs get around the board much more now LOL. I expect a monterous based unit and a monster based model and either one of these could be a dual kit that could be two different selections. I say gyro/mini tanks and then airship. I also think the rune/steam powered metal warriors could be a possibility. More special character would be a huge change for the dwarfs as most armies have had about 6-7 for some time and dwarfs have had only 3. Engineer character would be fun and maybe one that drives something

FINALLY
IF THE STINKING GYRO STAYS THE SAME SCULPT (see bottom of model) IT BETTER BE ABLE TO DROP BOMBS. Been like this for two books now GRRRRR

[VenomBlood]

Says you.
In the words of our lord 'The Dude' "That's just like your opinion man" But is that informed by some inside source or based on your on previous experience. I'm not saying your wrong ... I'm just asking. Folks might have said the same about DE .... except we had heard it was happening. However .... Just because we have not heard it is happening does not mean that it isn't.

After that I have a strong feeling that Jes doing Dwarfs in the proper Dark Eldar fashion at the moment.

[yabbadabba]

Well in that instance, that was a case of GW being extremely lazy. How the current warriors can pass as longbeards, by simply glueing on the masks, is beyond me. Same thing with glueing greataxes to the back of quarrlers to pass as rangers.

Because it worked? Its not being lazy at all - in fact it makes good business sense. Just because some people didn't like it aesthetically doesn't make it a bad idea. It also made getting a dwarf army cheaper if you wanted to go that route.

GW was lazy when it had the idea of not making models from army lists "to give customers conversion opportunities"

[Harry]

After that I have a strong feeling that Jes doing Dwarfs in the proper Dark Eldar fashion at the moment.

Well he did a lot of the concept work for the re-design of the last fantasy army to get a big overhaul ... the Skaven.
So I wouldn't bet against it.

[75hastings69]

Well he did a lot of the concept work for the re-design of the last fantasy army to get a big overhaul ... the Skaven.
So I wouldn't bet against it.

Weren't the Skaven mostly seb perbet?

[Miredorf]

You guys posted one right after the other ''without'' a single stuntie snipet to bite... Unforgiveable!

Well he did a lot of the concept work for the re-design of the last fantasy army to get a big overhaul ... the Skaven.
So I wouldn't bet against it.

I bet the only thing he didnt design was the catapult/warp cannon kit. Umm those glorious days where almost every new release was better than the previous one

[lbecks]

Weren't the Skaven mostly seb perbet?

Yeah, Seb Perbet did a lot of it.

I'm going to guess Aly Morrisson is being put on the Dwarves.

[Schmapdi]

Says you.
In the words of our lord 'The Dude' "That's just like your opinion man" But is that informed by some inside source or based on your on previous experience. I'm not saying your wrong ... I'm just asking. Folks might have said the same about DE .... except we had heard it was happening. However .... Just because we have not heard it is happening does not mean that it isn't.

Not that I'm doubting you - but we have seen a few of the dwarves from the FW book, and, aside from the slayer being a little more hunched over, they don't look radically different to me. Surely if the GW dwarves were getting a massive overhaul soon-ish FW wouldn't be getting ready to spit out dwarves that look like the current dwarves?

[VenomBlood]

Weren't the Skaven mostly seb perbet?

Yeah, Seb Perbet did a lot of it.

Under the guidance of John too, IIRC Seb mentioned this in Hell Pit Abom design overview.
Still have a bunch of question to Jes regards to new Chaos design.

[Darnok]

With no real rumours for well over half a year, and this thread now being a general dwarf discussion: thread closed.

If and only if new rumours surface: feel free to start a new one.


Darnok [=I=]
The WarSeer Inquisition