Most Sucsessful Invasion in warhammer

[Drasanil]

You say the Second Daemon Invasion failed, but by what standard? The entire world is doomed, it is only a matter of time.

Only if GW decides to advance the timeline... unless Nagash wins or the Slann's plans come to fruition or something totally out of left field comes along.

[Gromdal]

You say the Second Daemon Invasion failed, but by what standard? The entire world is doomed, it is only a matter of time.

Nah first of all warhammer is all status quo. Second of all the future is always uncertain. Anything can happen. Third the daemons got pwnt so hard by the dwarfs and elves they have been hiding for a few thousand years...

It was a great invasion, HUGE, but it failed big time.

[Fear Ghoul]

Nah first of all warhammer is all status quo. Second of all the future is always uncertain. Anything can happen. Third the daemons got pwnt so hard by the dwarfs and elves they have been hiding for a few thousand years...

It was a great invasion, HUGE, but it failed big time.

Warhammer is changing all the time, but the one constant throughout its history is the inevitable doom of Chaos. It's what makes Warhammer most unique from all its competitors, where the good guys can and often do win.

Also, by what standard do you say that the daemons were "pwnt"? The Second Daemonic Invasion achieved the greatest carnage and destruction of any invasion in Warhammer history and achieved its objective of ensuring the fall of the world into Chaos. The Lizardmen Empire was smashed, the Elven and Dwarven peoples massacred, and the Old Ones destroyed/fled. All subsequent events which weaken the resistance of the world to Chaos can be directly traced to this invasion:

Aenarion draws Widowmaker -> Elven Civil War -> Creation of Dark Elves -> War of Vengeance -> Shattering of Dwarven and Elven Power -> Rise of Greenskins and Skaven -> Rise of Man -> Ascendancy of Chaos

Aenarion draws Widowmaker -> Elven Civil War -> Creation of Dark Elves -> Creation of Necromancy -> Undead Wars (including destruction of Nehekhara) -> Weakening of Man -> Ascendancy of Chaos

The Second Daemonic Invasion also killed off many of those best able to lead the world against Chaos such as Lord Kroak and Aenarion, the vortex which stalls its completion is weakening, the tribes of Men were corrupted leading to the rise of the Everchosen, and the entirety of the Northern and Southern regions was permanently conquered for Chaos. Compared to this, no other invasion has ever been as damaging or consequential.

[warboss6820]

Only if GW decides to advance the timeline... unless Nagash wins or the Slann's plans come to fruition or something totally out of left field comes along.

Unfortunatly games workshop has a better chance of *SPOILER ALERT* killing off gotrek gurirson *SPOILERS END HERE* than it does actully advanceing the timeline. The last thing to happen was the storm of chaos fiasco and all that did was: begin and quickly end a chaos invasion,reveal a chosen of sigmar and then kill him off, and prove that "GRIMGOR IS THE BEST(and stuipedest for not killing the everchosen)"

[Gromdal]

Warhammer is changing all the time, but the one constant throughout its history is the inevitable doom of Chaos. It's what makes Warhammer most unique from all its competitors, where the good guys can and often do win.

Also, by what standard do you say that the daemons were "pwnt"? The Second Daemonic Invasion achieved the greatest carnage and destruction of any invasion in Warhammer history and achieved its objective of ensuring the fall of the world into Chaos. The Lizardmen Empire was smashed, the Elven and Dwarven peoples massacred, and the Old Ones destroyed/fled. All subsequent events which weaken the resistance of the world to Chaos can be directly traced to this invasion:

Aenarion draws Widowmaker -> Elven Civil War -> Creation of Dark Elves -> War of Vengeance -> Shattering of Dwarven and Elven Power -> Rise of Greenskins and Skaven -> Rise of Man -> Ascendancy of Chaos

Aenarion draws Widowmaker -> Elven Civil War -> Creation of Dark Elves -> Creation of Necromancy -> Undead Wars (including destruction of Nehekhara) -> Weakening of Man -> Ascendancy of Chaos

The Second Daemonic Invasion also killed off many of those best able to lead the world against Chaos such as Lord Kroak and Aenarion, the vortex which stalls its completion is weakening, the tribes of Men were corrupted leading to the rise of the Everchosen, and the entirety of the Northern and Southern regions was permanently conquered for Chaos. Compared to this, no other invasion has ever been as damaging or consequential.

The world is by no means certain to fall to chaos, its just fluff to make the world seem more grim. If you read the skaven for instance their victory is also inevitable. Same for the greenskins etc...

Its just designed to make the dangers extreme.

But the fact of the world is that a divided humanity, that even has civil wars and bloody power struggles can hold back all these threats even when at its weakest (Magnus the pious?). Not only that chaos has had a few millenia and cant get nothing done. The status quo wont change.

[Arnizipal]

The world is by no means certain to fall to chaos, its just fluff to make the world seem more grim. If you read the skaven for instance their victory is also inevitable. Same for the greenskins etc...

Its just designed to make the dangers extreme.

Not really the same though. For greenskins there's always the huge disclaimer "should all tribes unite" or something like that.
Never going to happen unfortunately. It's just not the greenskin way.

Same for Skaven. They fight among themselves so much that even when they somehow unite, they're still secretly plotting the downfall of their "allied" clans.


The number of Chaos Daemons is literally endless, and they unite under once Chosen once every so often.
The timespan between each Everchosen (and subsequent invasion) becomes shorter and shorter, meaning that (in a theoretical future that will never happen) most nations on the Warhammer World will live in a stage of nearly constant siege.

But the fact of the world is that a divided humanity, that even has civil wars and bloody power struggles can hold back all these threats even when at its weakest (Magnus the pious?). Not only that chaos has had a few millenia and cant get nothing done. The status quo wont change.

During each invasion the Chaos Wastes expand, and they never retreat as far as they expanded afterwards. The Wastes are (slowly) growing in size.
Unless the gates at the poles can be closed, there can be no lasting victory agains Chaos.

[grumbaki]

All we need to do is release Malal from his prison so he can eat the four. There, problem solved!

[Arnizipal]

Arianka is the imprisoned one. Malal is free (yet AWOL)

[grumbaki]

That's what Arianka wants you to think...

[kramplarv]

those fan.boy gods are quite boring in my opinion. malal and whatnot. bleh

[Drasanil]

Pfft! Only the wretched followers of the so-called 'big four' try to muddy the waters with words such as 'fanboy gods'... makes you wonder what they're hiding. Maybe their 'gods' are not as invincible as they would have us believe

[stormblade]

Warhammer is changing all the time, but the one constant throughout its history is the inevitable doom of Chaos. It's what makes Warhammer most unique from all its competitors, where the good guys can and often do win.

Also, by what standard do you say that the daemons were "pwnt"? The Second Daemonic Invasion achieved the greatest carnage and destruction of any invasion in Warhammer history and achieved its objective of ensuring the fall of the world into Chaos. The Lizardmen Empire was smashed, the Elven and Dwarven peoples massacred, and the Old Ones destroyed/fled. All subsequent events which weaken the resistance of the world to Chaos can be directly traced to this invasion:

Aenarion draws Widowmaker -> Elven Civil War -> Creation of Dark Elves -> War of Vengeance -> Shattering of Dwarven and Elven Power -> Rise of Greenskins and Skaven -> Rise of Man -> Ascendancy of Chaos

Aenarion draws Widowmaker -> Elven Civil War -> Creation of Dark Elves -> Creation of Necromancy -> Undead Wars (including destruction of Nehekhara) -> Weakening of Man -> Ascendancy of Chaos

The Second Daemonic Invasion also killed off many of those best able to lead the world against Chaos such as Lord Kroak and Aenarion, the vortex which stalls its completion is weakening, the tribes of Men were corrupted leading to the rise of the Everchosen, and the entirety of the Northern and Southern regions was permanently conquered for Chaos. Compared to this, no other invasion has ever been as damaging or consequential.

Bah, It's more like- Old Ones muck up -> Ascendency of Chaos

And how can Rise of Man and Weakening of Man both imply the same thing.
Shattering of dwarfen power was a bit more due to earthquakes and grobi.

[Gromdal]

Not really the same though. For greenskins there's always the huge disclaimer "should all tribes unite" or something like that.
Never going to happen unfortunately. It's just not the greenskin way.

Same for Skaven. They fight among themselves so much that even when they somehow unite, they're still secretly plotting the downfall of their "allied" clans.


The number of Chaos Daemons is literally endless, and they unite under once Chosen once every so often.
The timespan between each Everchosen (and subsequent invasion) becomes shorter and shorter, meaning that (in a theoretical future that will never happen) most nations on the Warhammer World will live in a stage of nearly constant siege.


During each invasion the Chaos Wastes expand, and they never retreat as far as they expanded afterwards. The Wastes are (slowly) growing in size.
Unless the gates at the poles can be closed, there can be no lasting victory agains Chaos.

The gates wont close because the status quo dont change. Likewise the Empire will never fall. Chaos fight amongst themselves and even when they unite they fail to burn the Empire.

Undead are also endless in number.

Chaos just like greenskins, skaven, undead in their own fluff all will one day rule world. But it will never happen.

Just like elven swordmasters are the best there ever was or will be in their book.

As is the grail knights for brets, chaos knights etc...

Chaos fluff that says we will pwnzor the world soon should be taken with a huge grain of salt, just as skavens inevitable world victory...

Alot of talk, not so much ending to civilisations or even a nations...

[Fear Ghoul]

Bah, It's more like- Old Ones muck up -> Ascendency of Chaos

And how can Rise of Man and Weakening of Man both imply the same thing.
Shattering of dwarfen power was a bit more due to earthquakes and grobi.

The ascendancy of Man in the world is directly linked to the ascendancy of Chaos as humans are simply more easily corrupted than Elves and Dwarves, and in a most obvious display of this, the hordes of Chaos count far many more humans in their ranks than any other race (save perhaps Daemons). That is not even counting of course all those cultists and champions hidden throughout the lands of Men.

The gates wont close because the status quo dont change. Likewise the Empire will never fall. Chaos fight amongst themselves and even when they unite they fail to burn the Empire.

Undead are also endless in number.

Chaos just like greenskins, skaven, undead in their own fluff all will one day rule world. But it will never happen.

Just like elven swordmasters are the best there ever was or will be in their book.

As is the grail knights for brets, chaos knights etc...

Chaos fluff that says we will pwnzor the world soon should be taken with a huge grain of salt, just as skavens inevitable world victory...

Alot of talk, not so much ending to civilisations or even a nations...

The Chaos Gates won't close because nobody knows how to close them, not because things don't change. The only part of the Warhammer mythology that hasn't changed is the certain doom of Chaos. The Lizardmen no longer rule a worldwide Empire, the Elves are no longer a unified people, the Dwarves are on the decline, the Empire of Sigmar was forged, the Kingdom of Nehekhara was destroyed, the Sky Titans annihilated, etc, but Chaos will still doom them all. I don't know where you get this idea from that races and factions in Warhammer never undergo change throughout Warhammer history.

I also think you're confusing army-specific subjectivism with background-centric thematic objectivism. As Arnizipal pointed out, the so-called certain victories of the various factions are nearly always written from a subjective perspective or have stipulations provided that preclude their coming to pass, such as all the Greenskins uniting etc. On the other hand the omnipresent threat of Chaos has been an undeniable centre of the background from the beginning, and has been written as such using both subjective and objective terminology in army books and rulebooks.

Additionally, several of the counter-claims you make are definitively untrue. The Undead may be endless in number, but Vampires and Necromancers are theoretically limited in number. The number of Master Vampires dwindles with no way to recreate the Elixir of Life. Necromancers must rely on Vampires, other Necromancers, or Necromantic texts to learn Necromancy, all of which can definitely be destroyed. The Undead as a faction have no doom prophecy surrounding them.

Several civilizations have also already been ended, and many of the rest are in permanent decline.

[Urgat]

What he said. If we fast forwarded 100 years in the future, I think things would be bad. Dwarfs are probably the next contenders for extinction, and the trigger for the end of things, what with being in the path of all the major invasions, chaos from the north, greenskins from south and east and, probably even worse, the ever expanding ogres from the east. Not mentionning the night goblins and skavens, ever present. I'm not too good on WE fluff, but isn't the current book insisting at some place that a good chunk of Athel Loren is very hostile to them, and that very powerful creatures, including old treeman and darker things, are gathering in the oldest parts of the forest to overthrow them? Can't be good for elves if their very environment is after them in the long run. Now high elves seem to be doing ok, for now. But... If the dwarfs fall, what of the Empire? They're next on the lines, and if they barely hold their own against the vampires and Chaos, what if the World Edge Mountains are not a (leaky) shield anymore, but an endless source of invading greenskins and ogres, running unchecked since the dwarfs are all gone? Assaulted from the east and the north by invaders, and from the inside by undead, beastmen and skavens, their prospects are bleak. And then if the Empire falls, next is Bretonnia. If the WE are overthrown, Loren becomes a completely hostile neighbour. The WE book makes it clear, even with the elves, the forest can't really stop great invasions, the orcs and Kemmler have proved it. Anyway, it'd be a rinse and repeat of the Empire. Estalia and Tilea are inconsquential, if both Bretonnia and the Empire are gone, they're gone too in the following years.
Now there's the dwindling Lizardmen, who do nothing but protect their cities and are slowly disappearing, and the HE who would find themselves alone comes the next demon incursion. We don't know how Cathay would fare on the other side of the world, but no matter: if the vortex fails, it's over.
The future is bleak, if you ask me

[Drasanil]

The future is bleak, if you ask me

If we fast forward a hundred years you might find that Khorne, Nurgle and Slaanesh were eaten by a loosed Malal. Tzeentch, who barely managed to weasel his way out, Sigmar and the Horned Rat now for the 'Big Three'. The northern tribes are shattered, turning their faith to these stronger gods, the wastes have receded to levels previously unseen and the north is fertile. A New Age has dawned, the empire is reeling from the horrors of 'mass literacy'. The Skaven are locked in a bitter civil war as a new cult of the Horned Rat who rejects the thirteen has gained prominence claiming credit for Horned Rat's rise. Betrayed by the Heirs of Sigmar the dwarves have looked outwards renewing trade with Ulthuan and the taking the first steps towards rebuilding the ancient alliance, in the North they have reclaimed lost holds and forged with ties with Kislev who now fights to keep the Cult of Sigmar's thirst for innocent souls at bay... but that's crazy right...or is it

[Urgat]

If we fast forward a hundred years you might find that Khorne, Nurgle and Slaanesh were eaten by a loosed Malal.

Didn't you hear? Malal was slain by a lawyer.
Anyway, jokes aside, I know I'm right, because fluff aside, Jervis has said it himself. Shame, I do like your version, with the Empire becoming the bad guys

[Drasanil]

Didn't you hear? Malal was slain by a lawyer.
Anyway, jokes aside, I know I'm right, because fluff aside, Jervis has said it himself. Shame, I do like your version, with the Empire becoming the bad guys

Eheh, no worries it was an inside joke for those who might be familiar with the progress of certain campaigns having something to do with Animosity

[Gromdal]

Hehe big three...

The ascendancy of Man in the world is directly linked to the ascendancy of Chaos as humans are simply more easily corrupted than Elves and Dwarves, and in a most obvious display of this, the hordes of Chaos count far many more humans in their ranks than any other race (save perhaps Daemons). That is not even counting of course all those cultists and champions hidden throughout the lands of Men.



The Chaos Gates won't close because nobody knows how to close them, not because things don't change. The only part of the Warhammer mythology that hasn't changed is the certain doom of Chaos. The Lizardmen no longer rule a worldwide Empire, the Elves are no longer a unified people, the Dwarves are on the decline, the Empire of Sigmar was forged, the Kingdom of Nehekhara was destroyed, the Sky Titans annihilated, etc, but Chaos will still doom them all. I don't know where you get this idea from that races and factions in Warhammer never undergo change throughout Warhammer history.

I also think you're confusing army-specific subjectivism with background-centric thematic objectivism. As Arnizipal pointed out, the so-called certain victories of the various factions are nearly always written from a subjective perspective or have stipulations provided that preclude their coming to pass, such as all the Greenskins uniting etc. On the other hand the omnipresent threat of Chaos has been an undeniable centre of the background from the beginning, and has been written as such using both subjective and objective terminology in army books and rulebooks.

Additionally, several of the counter-claims you make are definitively untrue. The Undead may be endless in number, but Vampires and Necromancers are theoretically limited in number. The number of Master Vampires dwindles with no way to recreate the Elixir of Life. Necromancers must rely on Vampires, other Necromancers, or Necromantic texts to learn Necromancy, all of which can definitely be destroyed. The Undead as a faction have no doom prophecy surrounding them.

Several civilizations have also already been ended, and many of the rest are in permanent decline.

You can repeat that chaos will win all you want. It will never happen.

They will always fail.

[Urgat]

Now that's an argument. You forgot to say "because I say so" at the end of your post