More Ammo Sir

[ChaplainCharlie]

Well, the models and the fluff, as well as the rules that support the game, are all three different animals. They overlap, for sure, but then again I just finished reading a chapter in Savage Scars where a regular Tactical Marine had three Melta Charges hanging on his belt. Not only that Tac Marines can't get melta bombs rules-wise, but to have three model-wise would be very inconvenient.

So that said, the models we are granted do not represent the actual fighting gear in all its detail. For example in earlier editions of marines, they came with pouches for ammo and such, but these are pretty much gone now. Haven't bought a tactical squad in ages, but a command squad a month back and saw no pouches.
Though "realistic" having a bunch of pouches on Marines really breaks the aesthetic. One or two is fine, but a realistic amount of ammunition would clutter the models.

Bolter mags can't feasibly have any more than 15 or so rounds in a sickle. Being that each round is .75 calibre, a 30cm long magazine can only hold 15 rounds. Maybe a few more if the sickle effect is good. Maximum 30 if one would assume superior double-stacking. But that's it. Physical limitations. You can't have .75 calibre ammo come endlessly out of a single bolter clip. Not even the AdMech can make that happen without warp portals and precision teleportation that the Imperium is not capable of.

And for those saying that marines only fire 14 rounds a battle. Well, do assault cannons really rend battle tanks to pieces with only 4 rounds a burst? Really?
I have not seen any fluff representation where an assault cannon fires a controlled burst of 4 rounds and halts to save ammunition. It's even mentioned in the rulebook that ammunition is scarse for the infantry variant assault cannon, but not so much for the vehicle ones. It's safe to assume that the number of shots weapons fire in the game do not represent the actual numbers of projectiles or beams released by these weapons in "real" combat.

[snottlebocket]

Well, the models and the fluff, as well as the rules that support the game, are all three different animals. They overlap, for sure, but then again I just finished reading a chapter in Savage Scars where a regular Tactical Marine had three Melta Charges hanging on his belt. Not only that Tac Marines can't get melta bombs rules-wise, but to have three model-wise would be very inconvenient.

So that said, the models we are granted do not represent the actual fighting gear in all its detail. For example in earlier editions of marines, they came with pouches for ammo and such, but these are pretty much gone now. Haven't bought a tactical squad in ages, but a command squad a month back and saw no pouches.
Though "realistic" having a bunch of pouches on Marines really breaks the aesthetic. One or two is fine, but a realistic amount of ammunition would clutter the models.

Bolter mags can't feasibly have any more than 15 or so rounds in a sickle. Being that each round is .75 calibre, a 30cm long magazine can only hold 15 rounds. Maybe a few more if the sickle effect is good. Maximum 30 if one would assume superior double-stacking. But that's it. Physical limitations. You can't have .75 calibre ammo come endlessly out of a single bolter clip. Not even the AdMech can make that happen without warp portals and precision teleportation that the Imperium is not capable of.

And for those saying that marines only fire 14 rounds a battle. Well, do assault cannons really rend battle tanks to pieces with only 4 rounds a burst? Really?
I have not seen any fluff representation where an assault cannon fires a controlled burst of 4 rounds and halts to save ammunition. It's even mentioned in the rulebook that ammunition is scarse for the infantry variant assault cannon, but not so much for the vehicle ones. It's safe to assume that the number of shots weapons fire in the game do not represent the actual numbers of projectiles or beams released by these weapons in "real" combat.

Once you get into that you might as well wonder why marines bother with those little button up pouches when their mechanical gloves don't even look like they could operate a pouch.

For that matter marines don't look like they'd fit inside their armor without breaking or amputating a few limps. Nor do they look capable of picking something up of the floor or standing back up after a fall.

[El_Machinae]

Nothing saying you couldn't quadruple-stack a magazine! I'm sure that there's an STC for a neato spring design.

[Denny]

It's one of the bigger head-scratchers. How could Marines storm a facility or Space Hulk, and spend hours in combat, if they needed to reload all the time?

They don't; one ultramarine can singlehandedly clear an entire Space Hulk whilst only expending 3.2 bolt rounds.

True story.

[Lord Zarkov]

They don't; one ultramarine can singlehandedly clear an entire Space Hulk whilst only expending 3.2 bolt rounds.

True story.

And three of those were during his heroic pose before he went in.

[AndrewGPaul]

The Space Hulk rules and mission books mention the Terminators returning to the beachhead area to re-arm and repair periodically, and I believe it's also mentioned in the tie-in novella. That's where the two infected Techmarines from mission 4 come from.

[ChaplainCharlie]

Furthermore, it is mentioned in some sources that Storm Bolters, though having a high rate of fire, aren't fired in long bursts because they lack the ammo for it. Both in the clip and on the Terminator wielding it. Surely they can operate buttons though, because I can operate buttons on pouches with winter mittens on and those are more cumbersome than Power Armor gloves.

It's not about why they couldn't have it all with them, rather than the sheer insanity of modelling the damned pouches on every single Marine and thus breaking the pristine surfaces that are reserved for chapter iconography and livery. The only SM models that really have a reasonable amount of equipment on them are Scouts: http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e3...Gallery441.jpg

And even they pack light. Despite their worse skills in combat, I doubt it would be such a radical difference that it would make it logical to have one Marine with one magazine be equal to one Scout with half a dozen spares.

And for quadruple stacking magazines? Those mags would be mechanically extremely unreliable and also very VERY wide. In the BL books, Marines are reloading their weapons from time to time, so obviously they do so in "real combat". Just accept it as a modelling defficiency, because that is all that it is.

For fluff reasons, they would carry at least a half a dozen spare mags for something around 100 bolter rounds per marine. Then the Rhino has some more. Heck, even SM missile launchers only came with 2 Frag and 1 Krak missile back in the day. Why could they fire 6 turns when the maximum ammo was 4?

[snottlebocket]

Furthermore, it is mentioned in some sources that Storm Bolters, though having a high rate of fire, aren't fired in long bursts because they lack the ammo for it. Both in the clip and on the Terminator wielding it. Surely they can operate buttons though, because I can operate buttons on pouches with winter mittens on and those are more cumbersome than Power Armor gloves.

It's not about why they couldn't have it all with them, rather than the sheer insanity of modelling the damned pouches on every single Marine and thus breaking the pristine surfaces that are reserved for chapter iconography and livery. The only SM models that really have a reasonable amount of equipment on them are Scouts: http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e3...Gallery441.jpg

And even they pack light. Despite their worse skills in combat, I doubt it would be such a radical difference that it would make it logical to have one Marine with one magazine be equal to one Scout with half a dozen spares.

And for quadruple stacking magazines? Those mags would be mechanically extremely unreliable and also very VERY wide. In the BL books, Marines are reloading their weapons from time to time, so obviously they do so in "real combat". Just accept it as a modelling defficiency, because that is all that it is.

For fluff reasons, they would carry at least a half a dozen spare mags for something around 100 bolter rounds per marine. Then the Rhino has some more. Heck, even SM missile launchers only came with 2 Frag and 1 Krak missile back in the day. Why could they fire 6 turns when the maximum ammo was 4?

Space Hulk suggests that marines fire (storm) bolters in short controlled bursts to conserve ammo, increase accuracy and the bloody things jam at the drop of a hat if you do any sustained firing.

[Veteran Sergeant]

Assault cannon and heavy flamers are (somehow) reloadable in the field by the wielders in Terminator armour - Space Hulk explicitly allows it. Emperor knows how they do it, though. .

Probably the same way Brits do it with their bullpups. Awkwardly and inefficiently, lol.

But you can probably raise it barrel to the sky which would give access with a (turned off) Power Fist to release the current box and add another one (from somewhere, but hey, Marine models that aren't mine are always under-represented for ammunition on the figures.