GW Store Advice

[Lord Logsdon]

So I'm just getting back into the hobby, but I'm not a dummy per se and I've done my research before hand. I chose Bretonnians because I just plain like the fluff/models/aesthetics.

Anyways we have a new GW store near me and I went in to buy the army book even though I have it on PDF. I then bought some Knights of the Realm.

When I went to pay me and the staffer started some light banter about the escalation league that was starting and that I was going to enter as some motivation to paint and also to network with some other wargamers, etc. The following is the dialogue.

"Make sure you bring your rulebook...do you have a rulebook yet?"
"Not yet, but I'm in the process of getting one."
"Process?" -Inquisitive look of confusion-
"Well...yea...off Ebay."
"Oh man that hurts...Ebay doesn't pay my bills and it doesn't help local stores either..."
-Awkward silence as I hand over my credit card-

He didn't say it in a mean way, but it was one of those passive-aggressive tones you know? Where he's faking a joke but the real meaning is seeping through. Is this kosher? I mean I know he has a job to do and everything, and yea his store is evaluated only on product sold but I just dropped over sixty bucks and half of it was for something I had for free already (which I told him on my previous visit and he covered his ears and said "Ahhh I didn't hear that"). I'm not trying to be the bad guy here, but maybe I am?

Anyways, now I'm worried about bringing in some non GW minis to play with in the store because I'll get similar treatment. It's not my fault that a Dark Sword Cersei makes for a way cooler and way hotter damsel than the GW mini that has 15 pounds of hair.

Am I in the wrong here?

[pointyteeth]

Nothing wrong with going through ebay. I do the same myself all the time. I'd have asked him if he'd rather I'd bought everything on eBay to save the guilt trip.

Also, GW stores usually don't allow non-GW minis to be used in the store. Best to ask before you show up with it.

[TheLionReturns]

No you are doing nothing wrong. There is nothing illegal or indeed immoral about buying off ebay nor is there any moral or legal requirement to buy from your local GW store. It is up to GW to win your custom. Second hand markets can be difficult to compete with but they have their drawbacks. There is the time and effort needed to find the deal as well as the risk of dealing with someone unknown for a product unseen. GW may need to lower its prices to win your custom, or perhaps offer something ebay doesn’t, say a discount on a battalion box with your rulebook purchase, or perhaps a free digital copy that can be updated when faq’s are released. Whatever the case, it is up to GW to find the solution if they are losing a lot of sales this way.

To be honest I think the store manager was a touch out of line in what he said. Trying to guilt trip you into buying is poor form. That said I am sure it was an off the cuff remark born out of frustration at a lot of lost sales in this way combined with pressure from higher ups to meet sales targets. He probably regretted it after saying it but GW store managers are human too.

Regarding the non-GW models I think a lot of GW stores have a policy of only allowing GW products to be used in store. You may have a problem using your alternative damsel but this would have nothing to do with the previous incident. It is a regrettable policy in my opinion but one GW is perfectly entitled to pursue just as you are entitled to look for a better deal elsewhere should GW’s not pass muster.

[SimaoSegunda]

Actually, I tend to think yes, you were/are in the wrong.

Buying off Ebay is perfectly legitimate, and nobody can really have a problem with that. Everybody does it at some time or another - Although when I do, it tends to be for old models or unusual conversions.

PDFs of army books are a whole different kettle of fish. Getting a free PDF of an army book is substantively the same as stealing one. And actually, I know a lot of places that wouldn't let you play if you didn't have a physical army book with you. No printouts allowed!

As for the non-GW minis, they are entirely within their rights to not let you use one. However! If you do a small conversion and use some GW pieces for said conversion, then you should still be allowed to use the model.

Ultimately, everybody is free to enjoy the hobby however they like, BUT, if GW is providing the physical space and tables / scenery to play your games, then you should abide by their rules, I.E. bringing army books with you, and using GW models (or conversions) only. If you don't like those restrictions, then the alternative is to set up your own gaming group.

[Lord Dan]

You're doing nothing wrong.

That said, don't be surprised if the people running the store you're playing at are hurt by the fact that you aren't buying exclusively from them.

I had the pleasure of running a B&M store for several years, during which time we had customers come in with whole armies that they recently purchased off of eBay. One guy even brought in 3 unopened Tyranid battleforces that he got off of some online reseller and assembled them in the back of the store. As a retailer, the only thing that hurts your bottom line more than people who don't buy anything are people who frequent the store and don't buy anything. For this reason I make it a policy to pick up something from my LGS whenever I go every other week (even if it's only $5) so that I'm not just mooching space.

In summation it's best to find a way to support the store that provides a place for you to play and manage your finances in the best way possible to allow for you to continue to play your games. It sounds like you're already doing this, so don't worry about it.

[woodster17]

Games Workshop staff- like most retail employees on high street shops- don't get paid on commission. They get paid per hour. So guilt tripping you was slightly misleading and probably a little bit annoying; of course they want to sell their stuff and do their job well but unless the staff have been brainwashed, all realise that we live in austere times and the prices continue to rise a an exponential rate in GW stores. Don't feel guilty at all.

It's the only thing that annoys me about GW staffers, I go in often to ask about painting advice as well as to discuss this and that. The staff know who I am and what armies I play and yet whenever a new WD is released or an army re-done they try the hard sale on me. I'm a student, how much money do they think I have? I spend enough in GW and love the service, have got many great painting tips and tactics discussions. I appreciate they get new gamers that they can sell the products to and push things but most of us who go in are experienced or on the way to experienced gamers who have armies being built and know what we want. So having previously discussed my VC, OK AND Wood Elves models over the past couple of months on a few occasions it bugs me to be told that it would be a really good idea to start daemons and buy the new chariot models without me asking about them. Sometimes customer service just becomes interference!

[mostlyharmless]

Most of the staff at my GW in Seattle are nice enough folk. They know I'll purchase stuff in my own time and that I have tons of stuff in the works, so it's no good trying to sell me on new stuff when I'm still working on my old stuff. That said, there is one staffer who tries to sell me stuff all the time. I know he's just doing his job, but I don't know if he knows that I like to speculate and that I plan armies well in advance to actually working on them. That space wolf army I've got in the back of my mind is 1-2 years down the line. It's just one of those things.

I think that this manager you've got here was a tad out of line. The manager at my GW doesn't seem to mind when I walk in with a bunch of stuff I bought elsewhere because he knows how much I've purchased in his store. The stuff I get from outside sources is a drop in the bucket compared to what I buy in store.

[AngelofSorrow]

Just don't advertise that you get stuff second hand.
GW employees don't have commission per se but the amount their store earns can effect their pay. If you're getting it second hand just don't say anything.
It's not wrong to buy second hand mind you. My Soul grinder just arrived from eBay. (got 50% off) but I didn't say anything to the store operator. Who is a nice guy. Just be more sensitive. That's how I roll.


Ready for eternal war!

[cornixt]

My local GW just shut down due to lack of sales, so maybe they are all getting it in the neck right now (despite some pretty awesome profits this year which gave all the staff a bonus of a few hundred extra bucks). They generally don't care too much when I walked in with stuff that is nearly 20 years old since I do still buy new stuff too every now and then (not that I go in all that often these days)

[-Totenkopf-]

the best you can do is take control and set the precedent for your sales there.. Let them know, and be vocal about the fact that they exist for occasional gaming and the rare model or box set that you just "have" to have right away and can't wait for online.. Fact is, a lot of sites sell GW for around 30% off and its just plain old common sense to order for the best price.. local stores be damned..

When they are cheeky or passive aggressive, make sure they feel silly for expecting you to pay more than you need to... That is just the nature of the modern economy and informed consumers. It affects every industry..

As a business owner, I can feel there pain. I am constantly being "shopped" online.. It's my job to convince people why they need to spend a little more on me.. there are many good reasons for it and my livelyhood depends on my ability to show them. Same goes for GW. Among other things, They offer a place to play and and get into the hobby and they have models in your hand at the moment.. Never let them guilt you into anything though.. Spend your dollars wisely

[Metacarpi]

You're doing nothing wrong.

That said, don't be surprised if the people running the store you're playing at are hurt by the fact that you aren't buying exclusively from them.

*snip*

I make it a policy to pick up something from my LGS whenever I go every other week (even if it's only $5) so that I'm not just mooching space.

In summation it's best to find a way to support the store that provides a place for you to play and manage your finances in the best way possible to allow for you to continue to play your games. It sounds like you're already doing this, so don't worry about it.

Well said.

I tend to frequent my local GW for items that are around £20 or less. Yeah, I can get them at 30% under RRP, but factoring in the P&P, and the time it takes for the items to arrive, I don't find that it's really worth it unless I'm spending a decent chunk of cash (case in point, buying a new Daemons battallion online allowed me to get an extra box of Bloodletters "free" compared to the store price of the battallion). My local GW know this (they talk to me a lot about what I'm doing, so surely they know I'm buying elsewhere), but they don't mind because I'm regularly popping in to get bits and bobs, and don't mooch around hogging up all the space.

[Scammel]

I'll echo what others have said and say that you're not in the wrong, but sometimes discretion is the better part of valor when it comes to juggling your own money and supporting a store. Whilst I'll make the odd, small/medium purchase from a GW to let them know I care and that I appreciate the tables/events they sometimes provide, I'll buy the big stuff off online retailers and if a GW employee asks it was actually from the GW webstore.

[shelfunit.]

If you regularly (at least once a week) game there, then I would (personally) buy at least some of the models in store - certainly the FC ones, although that would be less to show "support" and more to make sure I didn't a poor cast. Basically, never feel "obligated" to buy from a GW shop (or any other shop), do so because you actually want to.

[spikedog]

You are not doing anything wrong but personally when I am playing in a store I make sure that if I am buying anything I get it from that store.

Think of it this way, GW don't charge you to play in their store, they also don't charge you to use their paints, get advice or to take part in their events. If you want the store to stay open then the least you can do is pay the extra few quid and buy your stuff from them. If you don't play at a GW store like me, then buy from an indie retailer. You will get discounted products, support a local shop and still give GW some cash to continue making the games that we all love. In the end buying second hand will only result in the death of more companies.

It is exactly the same as the second hand video games market, they are doing everything they can to stop people buying second-hand because it helps no one but the sellers. The games companies see no money from that sale and in fact it takes away another sale from the game company. If you want to support a company then you should put your money where your mouth is.

[Scammel]

They have to offer advice/painting tips/tables out the back or front for you to play on otherwise the entire hobby would crumble.

Regardless, it's a service they do for free and takes up quite a bit of their time and effort. If you're making use of them, it might be nice once in a while to make the odd small purchase and keep quiet about buying from elsewhere.

[Ponge]

I can understand why a store owner isn't happy when you blatantly say you are going to buy things off ebay.
I understand why you do buy them off ebay and don't think theres anything wrong with it, but it doesn't mean the store owner should be happy about it.

[theunwantedbeing]

Am I in the wrong here?

Yes, sorry to say this but yes, you are.

Firstly, there was zero need to say you were buying the rulebook from a non-GW source.

Secondly, you can't expect a model company to allow you to use models they don't sell in their store.

[Lord Logsdon]

Thanks for everyone's comments. I agree with the sentiment that having the PDF army book was wrong. You will note the past tense usage in the previous statement as an indicator that I own the hard copy version currently as was stated in the original post.

I do want to make one clarification. I'm not trying to shove this Ebay thing in the store's face. I didn't go in and start bragging about deals. I went in to make a purchase...was asked if I had a rulebook, and replied that I didn't but was going to get one soon. I was asked for clarification of my response and I gave it. I think some readers missed that in the OP and are assuming that I am blatantly and proactively flaunting my purchasing habits to the store.

I also definitely can see where they are coming from regarding non-GW minis. I never plan to have a whole regiment of them, they just make for interested single pieces and the such.

I guess overall I just wanted to feel like the store manager could acknowledge that: 1) I'm going to be a customer and I'm trying to proactively be involved in both my purchases and through store events. 2) I'm not always going to buy through the store but that's okay.

[Lord Dan]

I missed the part about the PDF rulebook, though you've remedied that so no worries.

[The bearded one]

non-GW mini's also depends a bit on the manager. The previous one of my local GW didn't mind if there were a few tucked in a unit or whatever, just as long as it wasn't a big large centerpiece model, or an entire unit, which really flaunts to other customers to ask its owner "where did you get that mini?"