You only get one....

[stormblade]

My Retcon? The Space Wolves DO NOT ride giant wolves into battle. They lost all their dignity with that damn Thunderwolf Cavalry.

They don't ride wolves, they ride each other.

there are no wolves on fenris

[Nazguire]

I'm pretty happy with it for the most part. I'd retcon the entire tone shift from super heroes in space to the original 'there is only war, and you will not be remembered' tone. Would save all sorts of hassles. The Grey Knights Codex wouldn't exist for one.


Now that's not fair. I like it...apart from completely undermining the danger that the daemons pose, with Draigo and Mortarion. If Mortarion was defeated by the equivalent force used to knock down Angron on Armageddon, and Draigo survived it, then no worries.

[Abaraxas]

Probably not a popular choice, but I want to retcon out all the Black Library stuff. To me, it's like the EU in Star Wars.

This, exactly this.

[Lord Damocles]

As well as that, I heard that Grey Knight will butcher Sisters of Battle so they can cover themselves in innocent blood (?????), which is also ridiculous, so I really don't want to ever have to read this stuff.

To be fair, we don't know
- How many Sisters were sacrificed
- Whether they actually agreed to it (there's certainly nothing to suggest that the Grey Knights just rocked up and started unloading their Stormbolters into a load of unknowing Sisters during prayertime or something)
- How much blood was used
- That the blood was actually [thought to be] needed for protection. The ingredient's that it was mixed with may have been the active ingredients (Codex: Daemonhunters included several weapons/artefacts which featured sacred oils etc.). The Imperium thinks you need chanting and sacred oils to start an engine, for example.
- That the use of pure bood in protective wards is actually unusual. I've seen it claimed that one of Counter's Grey Knight stories featured coating weapons in blood-mix.

That's not to say that the account of the Bloodtide in Codex: Grey Knights is well written or anything, but from the various recountings of the event(s), you'd think that the Grey Knights turned up, shouted 'Blood For The Blood God', killed a load of Sisters of Battle who were doing fine on their own against the daemons (we're told that they weren't), and then lather themselves in blood just for the sake of it...

[hawo0313]

well the knights were gunna kill them afterwards anyway, so its not as bad as i first thought, but still....

That eldar pheonix lord vs a tyranid splinter fleet was weird and im kinda confused by it it says he triumphed against it yet the fleet continues past that point anyway. Im not sure if its a retcon but it needs to make more sense

otherwise Draigo is obvious

[Lord Damocles]

That eldar pheonix lord vs a tyranid splinter fleet was weird and im kinda confused by it it says he triumphed against it yet the fleet continues past that point anyway. Im not sure if its a retcon but it needs to make more sense

'Stormvald
The Pheonix Lord Maugan-Ra stands alone against the Tyranid swarm, and triumphs.'
Codex: Tyranids (5th ed.), pg.28

That's the full account of the battle in question. Where people got the idea that he defeates an entire splinter fleet from, I have no idea. It only says that he triumphed over a swarm (which is how many exactly?) and gives absolutely no indication of how he achieved it.

[Zenithfleet]

'Stormvald
The Pheonix Lord Maugan-Ra stands alone against the Tyranid swarm, and triumphs.'
Codex: Tyranids (5th ed.), pg.28

That's the full account of the battle in question. Where people got the idea that he defeates an entire splinter fleet from, I have no idea. It only says that he triumphed over a swarm (which is how many exactly?) and gives absolutely no indication of how he achieved it.

Hmm - wasn't there a Maugan Ra article in White Dwarf in late 4th ed (one of the 'Heroes and Villains of the 41st Millennium' series) featuring him and a few Dark Reapers holding out against Tyranids? No idea if it was the same instance though. Just a thought.

[Lord Damocles]

Hmm - wasn't there a Maugan Ra article in White Dwarf in late 4th ed (one of the 'Heroes and Villains of the 41st Millennium' series) featuring him and a few Dark Reapers holding out against Tyranids? No idea if it was the same instance though. Just a thought.

That was the Fields of Sanctuary during the defence of Iyanden ('Heroes and Villains of the 41st Millenium: Maugan Ra, The Harvester of Souls' in White Dwarf 284 (UK), pg.72-3).

[althathir]

I think a popular thing to retcon would be to add a zero to just about every space marine count. Add a zero to the number of marines in a Legion, in a chapter, in a company, the number of chapters... etc.

Makes them slightly closer to whats represented on the tabletop and makes a bit more sense with more marines on a galactic scale.

This, and i'd probably apply it to Eldar as well. That said I'd almost rather have them just be vague about it.

The Battle for the Fang - not so much the events of the battle, but the fact that some clot recorded it as a Wolf victory when it was a crippling defeat for little gain.

For the imperial standpoint it wasn't crippling, and honestly to the wolves that made it, I can't see them feeling it was crippling either. Defensive battles rarely have a gain, unless your rebelling. The fang is still around, and the

attempt to modify the gene seed was kept secret for a reason not all the wolves wanted it and Bjorn would've stopped it (hell Magus almost seems to want them around as the Big E intended more than to kill them)

So I think what you really want is for someone from the chaos perspective to record it as the victory it was for the thousand sons.

Assuming the Draigo stuff is true, that needs to be re-done. I haven't read the book myself, but the idea of a marine, any marine, beating a primarch, a chaos primarch, one who has in fact been a daemon prince for close to 10,000 years, dedicated to Nurgle no less, AND having/taking the time to crack open his chest (through armour, daemonic flesh, primach-class fused ribcage), removing his heart and spending time carving his name there instead of just destroying it and then fleeing is just *********** stupid. As well as that, I heard that Grey Knight will butcher Sisters of Battle so they can cover themselves in innocent blood (?????), which is also ridiculous, so I really don't want to ever have to read this stuff. It sounds like it has been written by some demented Twilight fan-fiction obsessive (sparkle in the sun, my ****. They CRUMBLE TO DUST, YOU *****!). Whoever wrote that crap needs to burn.

Failing the above, reintroducing Ollanius Pius would be very cool, but Dan Abnett seems to have that covered already.

Yep that stuff is in there, I couldn't believe it either from what I read online. That said I think what ward was trying to imply was the GK were right on the edge the whole time (they don't seem to have problems using chaos weapons and the like)

[Inquisitor Engel]

there are no wolves on fenris

I'd get rid of those quote, because it's so ridiculously misinterpreted it's no longer funny. It's referring to the Wolves' savage nature actually being an act.

[stormblade]

I'd get rid of those quote, because it's so ridiculously misinterpreted it's no longer funny. It's referring to the Wolves' savage nature actually being an act.

and not thunderwolves being failed aspirants?

I'm pretty sure that the ending of PB and Magnus i ATS hinted at that.

[TheDungen]

yeha i prefered the fluff of angron on armageddon he died and most of his squad to banish angron. and yet they had achieved nothign they had saved a planet but angron would be back and they were dead. I remeber readin oen fluff piece where the GK leave the chamber where all their honoured fallen lie with the idea that the fallen are in the past and chaos nenver rests so neither must they until they are dead. that was cool. Facing chaos and winning actually winning is just boring.

[Venkh]

Draigo isnt really lost in the warp, the Chaos gods just got him addicted to Diablo.

Now and then he tears himself away to do some work but cant stop talking about the game to anyone who'll listen.

Naturally nobody understands this and they think that his frothing is something to do with fighting chaos in the warp.

[KingDeath]

Then there's stuff like ADB's Helsreach that throws out figures like you wouldn't believe. Initial deployment of 50000 Astartes and 30 times that number in Guardsmen, plus unspecified numbers of Titan Legios tasked with defending a single Hive World. And it's Pyrrhic victory at best, and a defeat narrowly avoided by the enemy losing interest at worst... Yes, the equivalent of fifty bloody chapters can't hold this thing back... This goes to show just how much you're asking for trouble when you name a world Armageddon or something to that effect...

1,5 million guardsmen to defend an entire world against a serious threat is like spitting into a forrestfire to quench it, so even Bowden's numbers are quite low.
Even the large number of Astartes and titans can be justified by the size of the Whaagh. GW's usual numbers, wether it comes to guardsmen, astartes or titans,
tend to be laughably low if we apply any form of real world logic to them.

[shadekiller]

I'd retcon the old eye of terror summer campain date so that the story isn't frozen in 999 M41 but just happend somewhere in M41.

[Victrix]

Two random thoughts on fluff conundrums presented here:

The sisters blood used to protect individuals who are already supposed to be nigh incorruptible - we're thinking along the lines of, "They needed the blood to protect themselves from going insane despite already being immune."

Perhaps the threat they were fighting against was like a contagion. The blood may have acted as an aura to root themselves more firmly in realspace - you can't fight, after all, if everything around you is shifting and warping by the second. Or perhaps their "immunity" is like a damn wall, where Chaos attempts to attack Grey Knights in particular so aggressively that finally breaching said wall doesn't corrupt the individual, but wholly annihilates them, soul and all.

Second - Perhaps by "1.5 million guardsman", for instance, that was the number dedicated to the planet. 500,000 die? 500,000 more are requisitioned. The Imperium, having an enormous and constant flow of new recruits might set quotas for soldiers at individual battles, rather than dedicating a certain number and just saying "fu- it" if they dwindle and die.
Lastly,

[SomeRandomEvilGuy]

The sisters blood used to protect individuals who are already supposed to be nigh incorruptible - we're thinking along the lines of, "They needed the blood to protect themselves from going insane despite already being immune."

The Grey Knights may have been immune to being corrupted by the Bloodtide (i.e. they wouldn't go on random killing sprees), but presumably it was still possible for it to cause them to explode in a shower of gore. Grey Knights are much more valuable than Sisters of Battle, after all, and without such protection it may well have been impossible to reach the target with sufficient numbers. As an aside, the blood was used in a ritual; it's not as if the Grey Knights just decided to smear blood all over themselves.

Second - Perhaps by "1.5 million guardsman", for instance, that was the number dedicated to the planet.

Interesting idea there. I'd also point out that that number doesn't appear to include the PDF, who really would be the ones doing most of the fighting until other forces could arrive. The Astartes are in relatively larger numbers because they are the reactionary forces whereas the Guard are slower to get to places. More Guardsmen would later arrive, it would just take longer.

[La'mour Le Breton]

Sure, the GK "smeared" blood all over themselves. They just said that to be nice. Real Talk, Gk comes in, theres a bloodtide going on, its that time of the month. You can't blame a group of women from freaking out and spraying blood everywhere. Its in their nature!

[yabbadabba]

I am not sure what I would retcon. What I would like to have changed is the lack of opportunity for people's creativity on the edges of the Imperium. This is an ideal area to get away from the more monolithic oppositional nature of the mainstream 40K universe and more strongly represent the backwaters and eddies where unholy alliances occur, aliens and humans defend each other with dedication and genuine respect, where the humans are not just PDF or IG.

I think these are the great areas to get away from that stupid "canon" aspect of this hobby and really allow people to explore their own interpretations.

[Narf]

I'd remove thunderwolves as being mounts for Marines, and turn them into horrifcally turned giant space wolves in ragged armour...

You may laugh, but the stats will work better (giant werewolf swinging a hammer, is more realistic that marine on the back of a wolf doing the same) and as i quite like the werewolf aspect of the SW it suits me, but maybe not others.

To be fair i started GW when space wolves were werwolves, blood angels were vampires, Dark angels were unknown, and ultramarines were boring, but this wasnt thrown at our heads like spaghettie is thrown at walls, to see what sticks, but was implied through creative writing, and left open to interpretation.