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Thread: First Impressions of 6th ed. Chaos Space Marine Codex

  1. #521

    Re: First Impressions of 6th ed. Chaos Space Marine Codex

    "This codex is a mockery of justice!

    My <insert army theme> list is useless; I guess I'll have to shelve my <insert army theme> until the next edition comes out. There's no way this list can compete against the <insert Ward codex> armies that everybody plays at the tournaments. And the models are ugly too.

    Fail, GW. Solid fail."

    There you go, guys. Something to copy/paste every time a new codex comes out. Don't say I didn't do anything for you.
    Quote Originally Posted by MajorWesJanson View Post
    And it is spelled Daemons of Chaos, not Deamons. Remember, Tzeentch says "A before E, except after purple".
    Quote Originally Posted by GodlessM View Post
    Well done. You've played Warhammer for 12yrs and yet you are acting like you've only been alive for that long. I mean how dare a business try to make money, and how dare a bunch of writers change the fluff that they own and wrote...

  2. #522
    Chapter Master TheDungen's Avatar
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    Re: First Impressions of 6th ed. Chaos Space Marine Codex

    as soon as one or two armies get good anti air then the necron and IG fliers will be much less usefull.

    and as for codices being written by a team and no one else, there is a position as the warhammer 40k overfiend that is the head of games development for the game system, who is supposed to work with the overarching strategy. This used to be Andy Chambers no idea who does it now.


    Quote Originally Posted by Barghest View Post
    "This codex is a mockery of justice!

    My <insert army theme> list is useless; I guess I'll have to shelve my <insert army theme> until the next edition comes out. There's no way this list can compete against the <insert Ward codex> armies that everybody plays at the tournaments. And the models are ugly too.

    Fail, GW. Solid fail."

    There you go, guys. Something to copy/paste every time a new codex comes out. Don't say I didn't do anything for you.
    and this i why warseer needs a like button.

  3. #523

    Re: First Impressions of 6th ed. Chaos Space Marine Codex

    Quote Originally Posted by Squallish View Post
    "Horde" Marines (4-6 CSM, 3 Havocs, 3 Chosen and 1-3 Bike squads) behind an Aegis Defense Line will be VERY powerful. 3+ Armour is still pretty awesome if you can take 80+ bodies on the table.. and you'll outnumber GK 2:1, and Necrons won't be able to beat you if you rushdown their Troops.

    There's also some strong Armour-centric builds out there using mass Dread-platforms, mass Rhinos and a few Drakes. Sure most lists can take out the 6 Dreads, but they really need to take down the marines in the Rhinos to win. 3 CC Helbrutes, 3 Maulerfiends, 3 Heldrakes comes in at only 1200pts. That's enough for 3-4 Rhino-spam units and an HQ at 1850. 12 Vehicles will be hard to bust.
    Good points, man. I'm thinking about doing something similar to that horde concept for my Traitor Guard's CSM allies. Although I'm divided as to which Fast Attack choice to go with: Raptors or Bikes?
    Quote Originally Posted by MajorWesJanson View Post
    And it is spelled Daemons of Chaos, not Deamons. Remember, Tzeentch says "A before E, except after purple".
    Quote Originally Posted by GodlessM View Post
    Well done. You've played Warhammer for 12yrs and yet you are acting like you've only been alive for that long. I mean how dare a business try to make money, and how dare a bunch of writers change the fluff that they own and wrote...

  4. #524
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    Re: First Impressions of 6th ed. Chaos Space Marine Codex

    So Chaos marines are now the Zerg rush army.

    (Mr Burns voice) Excellent
    "Reason is a thing of God, inasmuch as there is nothing which God the Maker of all has not provided, disposed, ordained by reason - nothing which He has not willed should be handled and understood by reason" Quintus Tertullian

  5. #525
    Chapter Master Squallish's Avatar
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    Re: First Impressions of 6th ed. Chaos Space Marine Codex

    Zerg Rush list, just for you sir:

    Khorne/Slaanesh Lord on Mount
    3 CC Brutes
    140 Cultists
    15 Spawn
    3 Maulerfiends

    Sure your Zerglings are slower than your Roaches (Spawn) and Ultralisks (Maulerfiends), but once they get there they'll tarpit everything!

  6. #526

    Re: First Impressions of 6th ed. Chaos Space Marine Codex

    I am not so sure about the marine-zerg rush really. "Horde" marines isnt really done THAT well by this codex.
    you get the 20 man units with icons, which are point-efficient, but other than that? What exactly can they do, that loyalist marines cant?
    And with these, the Zerg isnt that high on the scale either.

    I also dont really beleive in the mass-cultist rush.
    Either they are to easy to drive back or kill via moral, or(with typhus) they lack the killing power, as they are armed with only a single closecombat weapon.


    Quote Originally Posted by TheDungen View Post
    ... and this i why warseer needs a like button.
    Or a dislike button.
    I dont really like Smug people who think they are clever by disregarding justified complaints.
    Sure, I admit, that its impossible to please everyone, but this chaoscodex didnt even try. Yes, even if this codex were good, ppl would find something to complain, but this book just isnt very good.

    No Legion-rules, not even a demon weapon for every god, no named upgradecharacters, still no real cult-terminators, no specific buyable mutations, too high point costs on many places, no real answer to flyers, a questionable army-wide special rule ect. are justified complaints.
    If chaos doesnt deserve these, then SW,BA,DA,BT dont even deserve a codex.

  7. #527
    Chapter Master IcedCrow's Avatar
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    Write your own chaos codex :-)
    NOTE: my use of the word "powergamer" is not meant as a derrogatory or inflammatory word used in a negative context. It is used to describe a type of player that uses power builds

  8. #528
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    Re: First Impressions of 6th ed. Chaos Space Marine Codex

    Quote Originally Posted by Depulsor View Post
    I am not so sure about the marine-zerg rush really. "Horde" marines isnt really done THAT well by this codex.
    you get the 20 man units with icons, which are point-efficient, but other than that? What exactly can they do, that loyalist marines cant?
    And with these, the Zerg isnt that high on the scale either.

    I also dont really beleive in the mass-cultist rush.
    Either they are to easy to drive back or kill via moral, or(with typhus) they lack the killing power, as they are armed with only a single closecombat weapon.




    Or a dislike button.
    I dont really like Smug people who think they are clever by disregarding justified complaints.
    Sure, I admit, that its impossible to please everyone, but this chaoscodex didnt even try. Yes, even if this codex were good, ppl would find something to complain, but this book just isnt very good.

    No Legion-rules, not even a demon weapon for every god, no named upgradecharacters, still no real cult-terminators, no specific buyable mutations, too high point costs on many places, no real answer to flyers, a questionable army-wide special rule ect. are justified complaints.
    If chaos doesnt deserve these, then SW,BA,DA,BT dont even deserve a codex.
    The ones in bold seem to be verry legid to me . The rest I think is just well a bit of a wish.
    But those 3 seem to me like core things one would expect considering the subject and the other recent codex releases.

    So that is where I get most of my disappointment from.

    (That and no infiltrate but I admit that's just wistfulness on my part)
    check out my blog on http://bad-dice.blogspot.nl/
    Sometimes I even post stuff on it

  9. #529

    Re: First Impressions of 6th ed. Chaos Space Marine Codex

    I am surprised by the cost on some of the options in the book.

    You could buy a mark of nurgle for your lord, or pay 5 points more and gain a bike.

    Really? I am glad that jump packs went down in cost, but pricing bikes so much lower after the huge boost they received in 6th?

    The price for a ML 3 sorcerer is just absurd.

    However, I am happy about the options the characters can have. Sorcerers with a forceweapon and dualwielding a power weapon in terminator armour is rather cool.

    And at the same time, none of the none-HQ models have more options then what comes in the kit. Massive fail.

    I think it would have been a fun codex to get into, but I am still working on my BA. Will pick up a box Raptors and use their jumppacks and some more bits to extend my Mark V assaultsquad though and my DV chaos gets another squad of chosen.

    Oh, and whoever said that terminators could ride on mounts: You are forever dead to me.
    Alas, my dream of making a centaur from the bloodchrusher/terminator set was not meant to be.

  10. #530
    Chapter Master Squallish's Avatar
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    Re: First Impressions of 6th ed. Chaos Space Marine Codex

    Quote Originally Posted by Depulsor View Post
    I am not so sure about the marine-zerg rush really. "Horde" marines isnt really done THAT well by this codex.
    you get the 20 man units with icons, which are point-efficient, but other than that? What exactly can they do, that loyalist marines cant?
    And with these, the Zerg isnt that high on the scale either.
    They're 2-3pts cheaper and can take larger squad sizes.
    - 15 CSM, 2 Meltas, Mark of Khorne with CCW is only 255pts
    - 15 CSM, 2 Plasmaguns, Mark of Nurgle is 280
    - 15 Havocs with Autocannons is 345
    - 15 Chosen with Meltas is 420
    - Huron to Infiltrate Chosen
    90 Marines at 2000pts.. 2 scoring unit are T5, and so much Melta/Autocannons they won't know what to shoot first.

  11. #531
    Chapter Master IcedCrow's Avatar
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    What would a real answer to flyers be specifically?
    NOTE: my use of the word "powergamer" is not meant as a derrogatory or inflammatory word used in a negative context. It is used to describe a type of player that uses power builds

  12. #532
    Chapter Master Squallish's Avatar
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    Re: First Impressions of 6th ed. Chaos Space Marine Codex

    Vs AV11:
    12 Autocannons = 4 hits = 1.3 Pen
    12 Flakk Missile = 8 hits = 2.6 Pen
    Forgefiend = 1.33 hits = 0.89 Pen
    Sergeant manning a Quad Gun = 3.33 hits = 1 Pen
    Heldrake = 0.66 Pen on the fly-by, 1 Pen from shots
    5 Rapid Firing Plasma Chosen = ~2 hits, ~0.5 Pen

    Plenty of options.

  13. #533
    Veteran Sergeant HereComesTomorrow's Avatar
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    Re: First Impressions of 6th ed. Chaos Space Marine Codex

    Quote Originally Posted by IcedCrow View Post
    What would a real answer to flyers be specifically?
    Other flyers, flying MCs and flakk missiles but the Chaos book doesn't...

    Oh. Oh...

  14. #534
    Chapter Master IcedCrow's Avatar
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    Exactly. Im not seeing a lack of ability to deal with flyers. Ive seen this several times though so id like to know exactly why those are not valid...
    NOTE: my use of the word "powergamer" is not meant as a derrogatory or inflammatory word used in a negative context. It is used to describe a type of player that uses power builds

  15. #535
    Chapter Master Kiro's Avatar
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    Re: First Impressions of 6th ed. Chaos Space Marine Codex

    Some questions, for those who have a copy:

    Do sorcerers get any new toys to play with?
    Canthey stand up to Librarians now?
    Was the rumour about a Chaos psychic hood true?

    As a Thousand Sons player, can I make a 'sorcerer-lord' or do I still have to choose between a Lord and a 2-wound sorcerer?
    MiyamatoMusashi on the timeline mistake in The Outcast Dead:

    Quote Originally Posted by MiyamatoMusashi View Post
    Magnus' actions in wiping out most of the Astropaths on Terra when it was already too late just makes him look like a bumbling buffoon. He might as well finish up by saying "Uh-oh, spaghettios!" with a canned laughter track appended, then slipping over on a banana skin accompanied by a comedy whistle sound.

  16. #536

    Re: First Impressions of 6th ed. Chaos Space Marine Codex

    Quote Originally Posted by MagicHat View Post
    I am surprised by the cost on some of the options in the book.
    You could buy a mark of nurgle for your lord, or pay 5 points more and gain a bike.
    And this is an issue why? Bikers can't take terminator armor and that still puts a nurgle lord biker above the other lords.

    The price for a ML 3 sorcerer is just absurd.
    However, I am happy about the options the characters can have. Sorcerers with a forceweapon and dualwielding a power weapon in terminator armour is rather cool.
    Compare the cost to the last book...

    And at the same time, none of the none-HQ models have more options then what comes in the kit. Massive fail.
    k

  17. #537
    Chapter Master Squallish's Avatar
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    Re: First Impressions of 6th ed. Chaos Space Marine Codex

    Sorcerors got a lot cheaper, and a higher mastery level than their Vanilla counterparts. They're more psychic-heavy. They have a lot of options for wargear (like Termi Armour + Force Sword + Chainfist + AP3 Torrent Flamer).

    Since they will be higher than almost every normal psyker, they will get a 4+ Deny the Witch for their unit, but otherwise no Hood.

    No Sorceror-Lord.. stuck with 2 Wounds. You could counts as Huron if you like his Wargear, since he gets a random power.

  18. #538

    Re: First Impressions of 6th ed. Chaos Space Marine Codex

    Quote Originally Posted by Kiro View Post
    Do sorcerers get any new toys to play with?
    Not much that's sorcerer specific.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kiro View Post
    Canthey stand up to Librarians now?
    They always could, couldn't they? They now have the same profile as a Librarian, but can be (MUCH) better psykers than Librarians, and can get a 4+ or 5+ Invulnerable save from the wargear list without Terminator armour. 3+ with Mark of Tzeentch, and it doesn't take up a hand like a storm shield does. So I would say they could more than stand up to Librarians, yes. The Tzeentch psychic powers are of dubious usefulness but you're only obliged to take one of them, and now get Biomancy instead of Telekinesis from the rulebook, which is a big step up.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kiro View Post
    Was the rumour about a Chaos psychic hood true?
    No. Your psychic defense is a Mastery Level 3 psyker who is probably going to get a 4+ Deny the Witch. That's it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kiro View Post
    As a Thousand Sons player, can I make a 'sorcerer-lord' or do I still have to choose between a Lord and a 2-wound sorcerer?
    No psychic Chaos Lords.
    Last edited by Bubble Ghost; 08-10-2012 at 00:33.
    Idiots... nothing can live forever.

  19. #539
    Chapter Master Kiro's Avatar
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    Re: First Impressions of 6th ed. Chaos Space Marine Codex

    Quote Originally Posted by Bubble Ghost View Post


    They always could, couldn't they? They now have the same profile as a Librarian, but can be (MUCH) better psykers than Librarians, and can get a 4+ or 5+ Invulnerable save from the wargear list without Terminator armour. 3+ with Mark of Tzeentch, and it doesn't take up a hand like a storm shield does. So I would say they could more than stand up to Librarians, yes. The Tzeentch psychic powers are of dubious usefulness but you're only obliged to take one of them, and now get Biomancy instead of Telekinesis from the rulebook, which is a big step up
    I was referring to the lack of psychic defence, but I guess Deny The Witch Evens the odds for everyone. 4+ psychic hood equivalent is good enough for me, 3+ inv save...even better!

    Could you elaborate on the lukewarm description of Tzeentch powers? I was never a fan of Bolt of Change (preferred wind of change) anyway.
    MiyamatoMusashi on the timeline mistake in The Outcast Dead:

    Quote Originally Posted by MiyamatoMusashi View Post
    Magnus' actions in wiping out most of the Astropaths on Terra when it was already too late just makes him look like a bumbling buffoon. He might as well finish up by saying "Uh-oh, spaghettios!" with a canned laughter track appended, then slipping over on a banana skin accompanied by a comedy whistle sound.

  20. #540
    Chapter Master Squallish's Avatar
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    Re: First Impressions of 6th ed. Chaos Space Marine Codex

    The Primaris Power is a randomish anti-horde power.

    #1 - Gives a boon roll to a nearby character (including self), but they may take a wound from it.
    #2 - 18" Beam S8 AP1, 2d6" explosions from vehicles
    #3 - Wind of Chaos, but it's Warp Charge 2

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