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Thread: Warhammer 40k 8th Edition formally announced

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  1. #11
    Chapter Master
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    Apr 2010

    Re: Warhammer 40k 8th Edition formally announced

    Quote Originally Posted by Voss View Post
    Maybe- haven't seen anything to indicate that models don't attack with both weapons. It seems puzzling right now, since we don't know a lot of equipment loadouts (Primaris intercessors stand out as not having chainswords). But consider that pistols also get a shot. Are Pistol/Chainsword units getting a shot, 2 chainsword attacks and a pistol attack, or is the pistol attack gone?
    Consider the freaking striking scorpions. Pistol shot, mortal wound attack mandiblasters and 2 chainsword strikes and maybe a pistol strike. Seems... strong.
    I'd guess shooting in CC REPLACES the extra attack; not only does it make more logical sense(that's what the extra attack was always supposed to represent), but it also keeps things from getting completely out of hand... while also stealth-nerfing previous special CCWs, as those no longer get the "free" extra power weapon attack from wielding a dinky little pistol in their offhand.
    Also? Gives you an actual reason to upgrade your pistols.

    Quote Originally Posted by Voss View Post
    Eh. It isn't all that diffferent. Mace and sword seem best to me. Axe is going half-heartedly in both directions.
    Funny... I was thinking the opposite.
    Axe gives you +1 to wound against your fellow marines(which is basically 50% of the units in the game), but also against most big things(T8 seems more or less standard for everything from heavy tanks through knights), while still keeping a respectable amount of AP. The maces' S6 meanwhile would help against T5,6 & 10+... none of which seems overly common, and sacrifices your precious AP to do it... the sword is a strong contender due to AP being awesome, but wounding MEQ(your most common target) on a 4+ leaves it at second place.
    Regardless, I'd much prefer going back to ye olde' singular profile for ALL power weapons, as I'd prefer choosing the types for their fluff and looks rather than their battlefield effectiviness... and also because there's no rules for Power Shanks.
    Which is a terrible oversight, if you ask me.

    Quote Originally Posted by Voss View Post
    Don't like the fist at all. d3 wounds seems an unpleasant trade for -1 to hit, for same AP as swords. Certainly bad for guard models with fists.
    You forget the 2x strength. Assuming marine on marine action, that's a +2 to wound most targets, already more than making up for the -1 to hit, even before considering the 3+ vs vehicles and 4+ against supersize(or whatever we end up calling the unified heavy tank/really monstrous creature/mini-titan class threats).
    Personally, I really like the -1 to hit; feels like a much more accurate depiction of fighting with an unwieldy weapon than always striking last, while also keeping it back just a notch, but I would never call it a weak choice.
    Mind you, they're probably gonna be crazy expensive to boot... kinda thinking the chainsword's gonna be the standard go-to weapon for squad leaders, really, while most characters will be running axes or relics(if those are still in).

    Quote Originally Posted by Voss View Post
    Eh. Knight only, don't care.
    Agreed, though I will say I find it interesting that the giant centrepiece super-model of doom operates without RNG, considering that's where such things tend to be at their most tense... I.E. I was really expecting it to be either D6+3, or just straight up 2D6...

    Quote Originally Posted by Voss View Post
    Well, I don't really think there ever was a 'time of the tactical squad'. Mostly people complained about having to take them at all.
    As for the other Primaris squads... I'm not so sure. At a higher base ppm, and special/heavy weapon costs on top they're going to be pretty pricey. Without a lot of stray bodies, they also take a higher penalty from proportionate damage- losing those pricey weapons faster.
    Well, the "basic" intercessor squad has been stated to not have any specials or heavies... it's "just" a bolter squad, and that's one of the two things I actually like about them; it brings the focus onto the marines themselves, and their ability to blast xenos apart with rapid-firing rocket launchers, rather than being glorified bulletsponges to protect the sarge and his cadre of specialists.
    The other thing I like about them is their visual design.
    Heck, had they been "just" marines wearing a fancy new mark of armour, carrying a new generation of weapons, and trying out some fancy new tactics, I would've probably been on board with the whole thing...

    Quote Originally Posted by Voss View Post
    Theoretical Primaris assault squads on the other hand, I can see people favoring those. And I do think the Ap on the base squad is good. I just don't think it will rate compared to having real weapons in the squad, especially if the base per model cost is significantly higher. (And if heavy weapons can be taken for 5 man squads. If you must take 10, well, then. In that case, yeah, I'd largely want double wound, double attack with AP, rather than pay for 5 more bodies).
    Y'know, I've been wondering... mayhap these ARE the new assault marines...?
    I mean sure, they've got up-gunned boltguns, but they're not THAT upgunned - the real gain of the squad is the extra attack and wound, which would put them roughly on par with "classic" assault marines in damage output. I could easily see the idea behind them being that you shoot while closing the distance, the extra range ensuring that you won't need a transport, and rather than stop at rapid-fire range, you go all the way, smashing into close combat, and out-doing all but dedicated CC-specialists, who are instead locked in place against your ultra-survivable two-wound marines until one of your own elites can come along to finish the job.
    Not bad for a "mere" troop choice.

    ...possibly a bit TOO good...
    Ok, fine, there's probably gonna be a jump-pack version too. though I'm not sure how much those are really gonna bring to the table; their bonus speed would be quite effectively off-set by not killing anything before hitting the front lines, and the bonus attack from your standard-issue chainsword doesn't have quite as much bite when given to what I presume to be a smaller squad whose members already had two attacks to start with.
    Heck, assuming the standard 10-man tactical, 5-man assault squad sizes stay the same, we're looking at 20 attacks for the "tacticals"(intercessor), to only 15 for the "assault", as opposed to the 10-10 balance for classic marines(excluding sergeants).

    @Lord Damocles:
    Guardsmen are S3, and most likely WS4+, with no buffs to CC. One bonus attack ain't gonna change squat.
    Last edited by theJ; 19-05-2017 at 21:32.
    Quote Originally Posted by Avian View Post
    Never attribute to malice what can be attributed to a shaky grasp of English.

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