How to take on Beastmen with HE

[StugMeister]

Hello all,

I've got a game against Beastmen on Saturday, 2000points with my High Elves.

As far as I know my opponent owns 2-3 Spawn, A Doombull, 8 Minotaurs (reckon he'll use them in two units), 6 Dragon Ogres, 2 Shamans and maybe 2-3 20man Beastherds.

I myself am going for a Prince on an Eagle, two L2 Mages, 2x 8man SilverHelms, 15man SwordMasters, 2x 10man Archers, 2x Chariots and 4 RBTs.

With my chosen force I'm tempted to hold one flank with most of my RBTs and archers, and then storm round the other flank with the SilverHelms and Chariots.

My main concern is that Elves don't possess enough strength to take on Dragon Ogres or Minotaurs. With this in mind I'm hoping to whittle them down a bit with the missile fire.

So, there's my two cents; any of you guys got any ideas/experience?

[Major Defense]

First I will consider that you are set on taking an eagle-mounted prince. You're probably thinking that the Bow of the Seafarer could do a lot of damage from the flank of his minotaur and ogre units. However, those skirmishing beastherds will charge him off the table after you get off your first shot. This could be played to your advantage by baiting his beastherds to defend the flank, leaving frontage open for your RBTs. You could also bring a couple of riderless eagles with him to soak up charges. Yet another option is to take the Reaver Bow and Ring of Fury (which I guess could also be taken with BotSf) and concentrate on causing panic tests on beastherds.

You might think about putting your mages on Elven steeds in case things go bad and I don't need to warn you about ambushing beastherds - and Morghur!

So the prince is 275ish, 200ish for each mage.....

Why so many Silver Helms? Do you just have that many models? I don't find them terribly effective without a magic banner to spruce them up. You could combine them into a single unit of 16 to get the extra rank bonus. With the Lion Standard they could more easily charge dragon ogres and get +5 C.R. before casualties!

I'm also jealous if you have a model for the character on an eagle. I passed up an eBay auction for one a while ago because I didn't know how rare they are. I can't find anyone else who makes such a model. I guess I'll go look around again.

[StugMeister]

Why so many Silver Helms? Do you just have that many models? I don't find them terribly effective without a magic banner to spruce them up. You could combine them into a single unit of 16 to get the extra rank bonus. With the Lion Standard they could more easily charge dragon ogres and get +5 C.R. before casualties!

Yup, thats how many i have. And yes, I don't find them that effective either! The reason i have them split is so that I have more units to move with.

You might think about putting your mages on Elven steeds in case things go bad and I don't need to warn you about ambushing beastherds - and Morghur!

I don't think I have to worry about ambushers as my opponent has the Doombull as his general (Hopefully!) - I am right in thinking that the ambush rule is only allowed if you have a Beastman lord? So it can't be used if his general is a Doombull or Shaggoth?

I'm also jealous if you have a model for the character on an eagle. I passed up an eBay auction for one a while ago because I didn't know how rare they are. I can't find anyone else who makes such a model. I guess I'll go look around again.

Oh don't be jealous, in all honesty its not even a Great Eagle model.
A while back (quite a few years), I did Wood Elves and had four Warhawk riders; my commander is just a conversion based on one of these. My opponents are fine with it meaning I don't have to shell out extra cash!

[Major Defense]

Yup, thats how many i have. And yes, I don't find them that effective either! The reason i have them split is so that I have more units to move with.

For 403 points (plus the cost of a magical banner) you can have a 4x4 unit of 16 Silver Helms with full armor and full command.

5 S5 attacks, 4 S3 attacks
US=32, banner, musician



For 434 points you can have 3 Tiranoc Chariots with one ridden by the BSB carrying the Battle Banner.

3D6 S5 impact hits
8 S4 attacks, 6 S3 attacks
US=13, banner, +1D6 C.R.



That is such a no-brainer! Silver Helms have always served me best as well-armored bait. I'm no more likely to buy Dragon Princes (+3 points/model) as they don't bring anything more to a charge except a more expensive magic banner and toys for the champion. Yeah, yeah - +1 to M, WS, I and Ld - but that's not really impressing me they way they did in 5th edition.

I don't think I have to worry about ambushers as my opponent has the Doombull as his general (Hopefully!) - I am right in thinking that the ambush rule is only allowed if you have a Beastman lord? So it can't be used if his general is a Doombull or Shaggoth?

You are correct - Doombull general does not allow ambush to be used.

[taer]

First I will consider that you are set on taking an eagle-mounted prince. You're probably thinking that the Bow of the Seafarer could do a lot of damage from the flank of his minotaur and ogre units. However, those skirmishing beastherds will charge him off the table after you get off your first shot.

Yeah, except the bow has a 36inch range, which is quite a deal to play around with, and if his opponent spends all his time sending his Beastherds to deal with a single character, then he is already forcing his opponent to react to him, which is really how you win games.

[StugMeister]

I'm hoping to use my Prince on his Great Eagle as an assassin to take out his Doombull. I was gonna give him the Sword of Hoeth (auto wounds) but now I'm thinking the Seafarer Bow may help keep him outta trouble more.

I'm hoping to use my two SilverHelm units to take on his two Minotaur units, the SwordMasters can go after his Dragon Ogres and my chariots can intercept his. I'm hoping I can take care of the BeastHerds with lotsa RBT and archer fire.

[Satfam]

For 403 points (plus the cost of a magical banner) you can have a 4x4 unit of 16 Silver Helms with full armor and full command.

5 S5 attacks, 4 S3 attacks
US=32, banner, musician

Sorry for going a bit off topic but if you actually use this unit, how does it perform? I've always loved fielding large units but 16.... to my mind it would only have a few marginal advantages over a unit of 12

[Major Defense]

Sorry for going a bit off topic but if you actually use this unit, how does it perform? I've always loved fielding large units but 16.... to my mind it would only have a few marginal advantages over a unit of 12

It would have exactly two marginal advantages; US 32 instead of 24, and the extra rank would lend +1 C.R.. I was just pointing out how much less useful and practical Silver Helms are compared to other options.

[StugMeister]

So, the big battle is tommorow - anyone gonna wish me luck?

I'm feeling quite confident, as long as I can roll some good numbers on the dice my RBTs should be able to waste quite a lot of the army before it hits.

[taer]

It would have exactly two marginal advantages; US 32 instead of 24, and the extra rank would lend +1 C.R.. I was just pointing out how much less useful and practical Silver Helms are compared to other options.

Oh, and don't forget affinity for cannoballs +1! Always a game winning component.

[StugMeister]

The battle is now over and it was a victory for my Elves!

His list in the end was 1 Doombull, 2 Shamans, 6 Minotaurs, 6 Dragon Ogres, 4 Chariots and a 60man BeastHerd!

I took out his Chariots early on with a charge from a unit of SilverHelms and my 2 chariots; the resulting chaos also held up his Dragon Ogres and Doombull for a turn. My RBTs took down a tonne of the BeastHerd before the SwordMasters charged them off the board throughout the next three turns.

All in all a good game. One tip I picked up, which I should have learnt by now, is never use SilverHelms against Chaos Spawn.

[StugMeister]

The other thing I learnt is that Curse of Arrow Attraction and RBTs work fantastically. Even though my opponents BeastHerd was there merely to soak up firepower I still didn't fancy 60 Gors and Ungors hitting my lines.