2250 Lizardmen

[Ax'ataxa]

2250 well rounded (of course my opinion) list

255-Saurus Oldblood
-Light Armor
-Scimitar of the Sun Resplendent (+2 atk), The Maiming Shield (+1 atk), Carnosaur Pendant.

174-Saurus Scar-Veteran
-Light Armor, Shield, Great Weapon
-BsB~Plaque of Dominion

150-Skink Priest
-Lvl 2
-Diadem of Power, Scroll

150-Skink Priest
-Lvl 2
-Scroll x2

540-Saurus Warriors
-2 units of 20
-Full Command, Spears

140-Skink Skirmishers
-2 units of 10 with blowpipe

120-Chameleon Skinks
-1 unit of 10

120-Terradon Riders
-1 unit of 4

165-Kroxigors
-1 unit of 3

275-Ancient Stegadon

160-Salamander Hunting Pack
-2 Salamanders, 4 handlers

Any questions or comment?

[Bard Harlock]

I don't really find that full command is necessary for my Saurus units, but of course, this is a well rounded list, so maybe that slight bit of min-maxing should be overlooked. I've never used the ancient stegadon with the giant blowpipes before. How does that work out for you? It is very refreshing to see a list without EotG!

[Ax'ataxa]

it actually works pretty well, it is a great way to fire over your saurus getting ready to charge and knock a rank off of the opposing player

[Gaargod]

A few points:

Stick the priest with 2 scrolls on the engine (and swap a scroll for Plaque of Tepok). I'm sorry, its just a better choice - it gives you a fairly solid magic offense and defense, and you are already paying most of the points for the steg. Also allows you to split the sallies into 2 units of 1.

Saurus work very, very well in 18 with a banner (6x3 ranks). Cheaper, with lots of attacks

Chameleon skinks are... well they're very outshined by terradons. But tbh, i would drop them them entirely - you already have 5 skirmishing units.

I prefer saurus cav over krox, but that's just me.

However, i feel the item loadout on your heroes is very odd. Assuming they're there to lead the saurus, there are better ways (imo) of doing it.

The lord will work very, very well with cold one, blade of revered tzunki+glyph necklace )(or BoR and enchanted shield). Gives him a brutally good save of 0+ (or -1+) and hits hard against tough target, while saurus provide a load of S4 attacks.

The hero again could do with being mounted for the extra armour. I would suggest dropping the Plaque (you don't really need it tbh) and getting him some magic gear instead (possibly Burning Blade? Compliments saurus nicely).

[Ax'ataxa]

that's the point of the list in general, it is something no one on this forum would play ... plus whats the point in strategy if you always stick to the same builds? plus my friend told me he wants to play 2500 so I'm just going to add a block of 20 saurus with hand weapons and keep everything else the same.

[mdauben]

That's a pretty interesting army list, Ax'ataxa. I admit, I've played LM on and off since the first Army Book came out, but I have never fielded a LM army without a Slann. Looks very doable though, and your list makes me want to give it a try.

[Ax'ataxa]

thanks, i've always said thinking outside the temple chamber walls was more interesting

[Gaargod]

Ok, sorry. Its just if you post a general list up on warseer with no explicit 'this is meant for friendly games' or such like, its assumed you're looking how to increase the competitiveness of your army.

Its fine for just random muck about games, but obviously could be primed a lot more. Notice that i didn't just point to the nearest slann+2 EotG list, do try to work roughly around the boundaries set.

[Ax'ataxa]

why can't it be a good list? Why cant a list be about having fun and not just winning? I know the faults of every unit in the army, but why cant i just worry about having fun when everyone is busy worrying about winning? why is it all about winning anyway? i just want to know why everyone is so obsessed with building the end all beat all list that they can turn into a noob stomper on any player they face whether they've been playing for 6 years, 6 months, or 6 weeks? Its a hobby because it's supposed to be fun. Now i know you where giving helpful hints, and you probably didn't mean it offhandedly, but why dose one unit HAVE to be better, why cant a bunch of chameleon skinks go march blocking, machine hunting and firing at enemies? they have BS 4 which means they start off better then terries, i get more shots, and on average will be closer to the enemy line with out being in major jeopardy because i will be out of sight and scout move them into trees, rocks, or a building. i don't want to sound rude i just want to know why one unit outranks another? and what is more important to the community here; winning, or having a blast with the people you call friends, rivals, and enemies?

[WarhammerNoob4ever]

i think what he is saying is that, terradons on average do better than cham skinks do..... does that mean terries do better everytime or r "better".... No, just means most ppl find that terradons do a better job than chams.

Unfortunately, in a game with stats vs points, somethings are gonna be "better" than others..... what everyones definition of better is, is obviously going to vary, but lets face it, stats/play expereince/point value, just shows that somethings do better on average than others and are more "better" (yes, i kno, bad english but meh)

Does that mean YOU shouldnt use the unit/item/whatever, no but lets face it, you asked people what they thought of what u wrote on ur list, u shouldnt be surprised that they told you.

Personally, i think the above suggestions are sound, i havent found kroxs to be worth the points/slot they take up vs COC, but then again, i havent found COC to be all that great either (but mine seem to suffer rubber spear syndrome on a regular basis). if you taking a lvl 2 skink and an ancient, the 15 points to make it an EotG seems like a no-brainer to me as well, but then again, if u dont want an EotG dont take one.... just dont be surprised when someone says its worth the 15 points......

Personally, if your taking an Old-Blood and not taking a Carny, i think you are missing the point..... a Carny is the only reason, i personally, would take a Old-Blood over a Slann anytime, anyplace, anywhere..... but again, thats me and you can do what you want.......

Those are my suggestions and what i think of ur list, but if you want to take a fun list vs a friend, knock yourself out and take what you want...... Hell, take 200 skinks if you want, just dont get offended if you come onto a forum and ppl tell you that there are specific weaknesses to your choice and ways they think it would be "better"

[lizardmaster]

I think that's a very solid list, the carnosaur may not be able to join units as it's a monstrous mount but placed beside the kroxigors (or stegadon) it's more than capable of holding your flank while threatening your opponents. The oldblood's equipment is common and effective, 9 str 5 attacks on top of the carnosaurs viciousness always brings solid results in my experience. However, don't let yourself fall into a pattern with your equipment, there are dozens of variations and there is no "best way".

Your magic defence is impressive, but having used that configuration a few dozen times I recomend dropping both skinks to level 1. That's 6 dispell dice and 3 scrolls, don't even bother casting. You'll be shutting down the opponents magic offence and any points he spent on scrolls etc will be wasted, giving you a point advantage from turn 1. That extra 70 points could raise the unit size of 1 saurus unit to 25, helping to ensure a full rank bonus when the unit reaches combat.

The magic standard is always a good idea in this kind of a list, remember that a well designed lizard list will always excell at whatever specialization you pursue. Whether it's combat, shooting, movement, magic offence or defence, choose an area of expertise and go overboard. I've found this particular race to excell in any area and still remain balanced. I would like to point out that a bsb in this army cannot take non-magical equipment except for light armour though (no great weopon or shield).

Forgo the magic offence and focus on field position, magic defence, and counter attacks and this list will be very effective against most opponents.

[lizardmaster]

oh and btw, there is no "better" models, the points very accurately reflect the models worth WITHIN THE SPECIFIC ARMY! If you're going to play competitively remember that 300 pts of ogres is no more valuable than 300 points of skinks. There are no better models, just better tacticians. Chameleon skinks that don't earn twice their victory points by the end of the game are chameleon skinks without practice. Terradons are just easier to use efficiently.

[Ax'ataxa]

@ WN4E~ please don't take it as i a rant, read it as a monotone genuine post of curiosity, i know that i asked for opinions, but i also asked for questions, like "why did you chose this over that?", i would be happy to answer that. but when someone comments on the list, i get curious. so please understand i did not mean to be "irate" in any way i was simply curious on why they would pick one over the other. I also like to repeat myself because i'm weird like that

@ Lm~ i chose the lvl 2 cause i like the extra chance to roll the one, two, and three spells from heavens. he's not on a carnie, he's just got the pendant. what do you see it as right now though, balanced in most aspects, or more leaning to combat, shooting, movement, magic offense or defense?

[lizardmaster]

I think it would be a little week on the physical defence, a Bretonian or shooty empire/Dwarf army would shred it to peices. It would however excell at localization of force and magical defence. In other words, you should be able to pick an area of the table and confidently take it.

You could for example send your fast-moving big hitters into the opponents table corner opposite your chameleons, then hold it with the slower moving saurus while the march blocking chameleons prevent that side of the enemies deployment zone from getting reinforcements. Just deploy your hole army on 1 corner and your chameleons in the far corner on your opponents side. With any luck you could consolidate your position and face off with strength against the remainder of the enemy army.

Extra skinks are fantastic at forcing this to happen. start your deployment with skink units on the side of the table you have no interest in and odds are your opponent will deploy something usefull on that side of the table. That unit will get involved in the main fight only musch later in the battle. Also, planting a 65 point unit in front of an expensive unit as a sacrifice is great for drawing expensive units away from your main force on the other side of the battlefield.

[Ax'ataxa]

never thought of it like that. now that you mention it i can honestly say i am guilty of being drawn in like that i'll try this out in my up coming match next saturday.