Daemonhunters @ 1500 - Fluffy, but playable.

[dariakus]

I wanted to make a somewhat "friendly-competitive" Daemonhunter list, and here's what I've been able to come up with. As usual, looking for anything I may have missed, or any useful tactics/things you'd change to make it better.

Here goes:

-=[HQ]=-
GK Brother Captain
- 4x GK Terminator Retinue w/Psycannon

-=[Elites]=-
Inquisitor
- 2x Sage
- 2x Mystic
- Psycannon
- Psychic Hood
- Rhino w/Smoke

Eversor Temple Assassin

-=[Troops]=-
Stormtroopers x5
- Meltagun x2
- Rhino w/Smoke

Stormtroopers x5
- Meltagun x2
- Rhino w/Smoke

Grey Knights
- Justicar + 6 PAGKs
- Incinerator

-=[Heavy Support]=-
Land Raider Crusader x2
- Smoke

Total: 1492 Points

[mdauben]

Originally Posted by dariakus

-=[HQ]=-
GK Brother Captain
- 4x GK Terminator Retinue w/Psycannon

Always a solid choice. I like to add at least one TH/SS to a GK Termi squad.

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-=[Elites]=-
Inquisitor
- 2x Sage
- 2x Mystic
- Psycannon
- Psychic Hood
- Rhino w/Smoke

Not sure if this is really a worthwhile choice. Shooty Inquisitor squads are not bad, but with only one worthwile weapon (the Inq's Psycannon) its not going to be doing much. When building a shooty Inq. I almost always include 3xWarriors, either Gun Servitors or Veterans with Plasma Guns and sometimes even add an Acolyte with something like a stormbolter, too.

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Eversor Temple Assassin

My own favorite is the Callidus Assasssin, but that's as much personal choice as anything.

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-=[Troops]=-
Stormtroopers x5
- Meltagun x2
- Rhino w/Smoke

Stormtroopers x5
- Meltagun x2
- Rhino w/Smoke

These squads are really kind of small. Stormtroopers die pretty easily so I prefer full squads when I can get them.

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Grey Knights
- Justicar + 6 PAGKs
- Incinerator

I always take double special weapons in my PAGK squads. I find it one of their best perks. For me, its usually the Psycannon, but if you intend to get in close the Incinerator is good, too. Giving the Justicar meltabombs is never a bad idea, either, given the DH chronic weakness in anti-tank capability.

Quote

-=[Heavy Support]=-
Land Raider Crusader x2
- Smoke

Really, except for the IST Meltaguns, you don't have any anti-tank firepower. Given that, I would probably take the original LR instead, for the lascannon. Since your GK Termi squad is only 5 strong, it will still fit in a regular LR if you want that.

Also, at 1500pts you are limiting yourself a lot in what else you can bring by taking two LRCs. I know that LR spam is a very popular style of play, but personally I find it rather limiting especially in a list like DH where everything else is already so expensive. Just my opinon.

Just some ideas to think about. Of course most of those ideas require you to spend more points, so it's up to you if you want/can do that.

[Hellgore]

mdauben quite brought it to the point. Although if you keep your ISTs in the rhinos they are quite sheltered in there.
Only thing I see differently: the Inquisitor layout is quite okay as you can keep him and his retinue firing out of the rhino so you don't need added warriors that couldn't shoot anyway.

At least you're completely mech'd up, so this gives you some durability to get to the enemy.

[dariakus]

I'm 1000% open to not running LR spam, but my concern is with getting my guys into battle without getting shot up on the way in. LRs are the only transports that GKs can ride in.

For the Inquisitor, do you suggest dropping the Sages and Mystics entirely and running with the Warriors instead? Or adding those in addition to some sages and mystics? The other option is running him as minimal as I can just for a decent assassin, but that feels kind of like a waste

I don't have my book on me and can't remember off-hand what the Callidus does again. I picked the Eversor because I've seen him single-handedly erase platoons on turn 1. He of course then dies to the rest of the enemy's return fire, but I'll take that.

Good point about the lack of AT. I should probably run both of the LRs as Godhammers (Lascannons) and not Crusaders.

If I drop one of the LRs, I can get a second PAGK squad and boost the IST squads to full. I've then got two PAGK squads who are footslogging across the field Do we have any decent mechanized options at 1500 points that doesn't require Land Raider spam?

[mdauben]

Originally Posted by dariakus

I'm 1000% open to not running LR spam, but my concern is with getting my guys into battle without getting shot up on the way in.

One question I have to ask is; how much terrain do you use? If you follow the guidance in the BRB (25% of table) that's actually quite a lot. I would not argue that transports are very handy to have, but I think the reason so many people consider them absolute must-haves is that they play on boards that are too open.

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For the Inquisitor, do you suggest dropping the Sages and Mystics entirely and running with the Warriors instead?

I really like to bring at least one Sage for the +1 BS stat. A second Sage or a Mystic are nice, but not as nice as that first Sage. I agree that taking a naked Inq just to run an Assassin is a waste but with the limited number of Retinue for a Elite Inq, not to mention the limited points you are workig with, its a bit of a trade off what you get. I would probably consider 1xSage and 2xPlasmagun Vets the minimum for a shooty Retinue. Another Warrior, Sage and Mystic, or maybe upgrading the Vets to Gun Serivtors are bonuses, but not absolute requirements IMO.

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I don't have my book on me and can't remember off-hand what the Callidus does again.

She's a close combat assassin like the Eversor, but with different weapons (phase sword, neural shredder) and different special rules (word in your ear, jump back). They are both effective, I think, like I said I just have a personal preference for he Calli.

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Do we have any decent mechanized options at 1500 points that doesn't require Land Raider spam?

Not really. One option to consider, if you dropped one LRC like you suggested, you could Deep Strike either your Termis, and/or the PAGK squads. Of course using the Reserve rules can be chancy, but it can also drop you right where you need to be without having to walk through a hail of fire first.

Honestly, there is nothing really wrong with "LR Spam", its a valid way to build an army with some legitimate advantages. Its just that I see is sooooo often, that I automatically look for alternatives whenever it pops up.

[Grimhack]

Maybe something you might want to consider is giving the psychic hood to the brother captain instead of the elite inquisitor. Most psykers out there are Ld 10 but the Inquisitor only has 8 which would make it really hard to win with the roll-off.
About the squad sizes of the stormtroopers, 5 man squads in rhino's aren't bad as they can shoot their 2 special weapons out of it and claim objectives in the rhino. And if your rhino gets wrecked or destroyed, then usually your stormtroopers are just as much of a snack if they are 5 guys or 10.
And personally I don't think assassins are really worth it in 5th edition.

[dariakus]

Can you shoot two meltaguns from the Rhino? The DH book Rhinos list only a single fire point.

[grailknight]

rhinos count as open topped right?

[mdauben]

Originally Posted by dariakus

Can you shoot two meltaguns from the Rhino? The DH book Rhinos list only a single fire point.

Correct. A Space Marine Rhino has two fire points (C:SM p.76), but a Daemonhunter Rhino only has one (CH p.30 ) and there is nothing in the current DH FAQ to contradict this. So the IST in a Rhino can only fire one Meltagun per turn.

Originally Posted by grailknight

rhinos count as open topped right?

4th ed flashback! In current edition vehicle rules (BRB p.66 and 70) I can find nothing that says that when passangers use a vehicle's firing points, that the vehicle becomes open topped as was the case in 4th ed.

[Sceleris]

Which is why you take WH stormtroopers (who also benefit in that their transport can be used by anyone)

[Gunfighter_IX]

Originally Posted by dariakus

-=[Elites]=-
Inquisitor
- 2x Sage
- 2x Mystic
- Psycannon
- Psychic Hood
- Rhino w/Smoke

There's no reason not to make this an Inquisitor Lord.

A Lord with Psycannon, Psychic Hood, 3 Heavy Bolter Servitors, Mystic x2 and Sage with Rhino+Smoke will run you 200 points. You can stay at 1500 points by dropping you PAGK with Incinerator.

I'd say that's a fair trade off for 9 more Heavy Bolter Shots.

[Volandum]

Oh yeah, Ld8 hoods are pretty useless.

[Gunfighter_IX]

EDIT:

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