Some EC advice..

[The Emperor's Child]

I'm going to start an Emperor's Children army soon, bought the codex today so I can start thinking about how I'm going to do this.

I'd like to hear some opinions from others on why you build the army the way you do, like do you replace all your bolters in your CSM units with sonic weaponry or do you think that will make them too expensive points wise?

Do you equip any units to be more suited to CC or do you leave that task up to the Daemonettes?

And a question; when you give a unit the free chaos icon wich should be displayed on the model as mentioned in the codex, does it replace one of the models weapons he normally would be carrying in that hand?

Any other do's and dont's would also be welcome ofcourse, thanks in advance.

[Lithanial]

the icon does not replace any weaponry, its a freebie

ill leave the rest to the EC players ^^ all i can really say is that all sonic weaponry squads provide some SERIOUS mobile firepower

[The Emperor's Child]

Another question; can the Minor Spychic Powers from the Book of Slaanesh only be given to Sorcerers or also Lieutenants/Lords?

[Spoonie]

They can be given to any model who is a "Sorceror" this includes Lords and Leiutenants with the "Sorceror" ability.

[sigur]

I've also been very tempted to start an EC army lately. So....many...convertion possibilities....painting....pink...*drools*.

The sonic weapons really help your units to be mobile pretty much all the time, stilll fire at full range and/or still charge into close combat in which they'll most likely strike first due to warp scream.

I think (and read more than once) that the EC list is fluffy, strong but not overpowered or unbalanced. The only thing I'm afraid of is of squads becoming too expensive (pts-wise) when equipping many squad members with sonic weapons.

[Cade]

I tend to limit my sonic weapons to my chosen.....it costs rather a lot to equip an entire army with them!

Daemonattes are your best friends. Remember this and you'll be okay!

[Xander-K]

with the sonic weapons what kind of army do you want?
bearing in mind slaanesh have the +1 Initiative (-1 enemy I) which will only be useful in close combat.

if you equip your guys with sonic weapons you lose that vital extra attack they'd get if they had bolt pistols, so I wouldn't go too overboard with that idea.

combat drugs are a no brainer, ignoring 1st unsaved wound or having +1I (on top of warp scream) are fantastic benefits to keep your HQ alive.

daemonettes? well probably best to take them in larger groups (12+) since they have such a low armour save.

daemonettes on steeds? rending machines who move as cavalry, very very evil - but unfortunately the models look ridiculous.

Keeper of Secrets - moves 6 inches a turn, can be shot easily as he is a monstrous creature, but for 160pts he is one tough cookie that can soak up a lot of damage.

Doom Sirens are superb, basically like having frag grenades for the whole squad and an extra flamer - again this should be another no brainer for your ECs

Warp Amp - if used in conjunction with blasphemous rune and a chosen champion with visage this could bring your opponents leadership down by 4 or 5 points - but then again you have to get very close to the enemy with the vehicle carrying this, so best to put it on a landraider (which in itself is a risky pointsink).

[The Emperor's Child]

I thought a Doom Siren only counted for the model carrying it? Because in the codex it talks about the model with a Doom Siren not a unit.

And I'm not really sure about what kind of army I want yet, still figuring out if I want it very shooty or not.

[mkerr]

Originally Posted by The Emperor's Child

I'd like to hear some opinions from others on why you build the army the way you do, like do you replace all your bolters in your CSM units with sonic weaponry or do you think that will make them too expensive points wise?

Sonic Blasters are amazing. For an extra 5 points, you get a weapon that is so much better than a bolter. Move and shoot up to 24", shoot twice and assault, stand still and shoot 3 times. I find they are definitely worth the points.

Blastmasters are also great. Very versatile. I can move my Havocs for positioning and still get lots of S5 shots at 36" (with a chance to pin). Once positioned, I can switch to the higher strength frequency.

Not a lot of low AP weapons, but I make up for it with rending attacks.

Originally Posted by The Emperor's Child

Do you equip any units to be more suited to CC or do you leave that task up to the Daemonettes?

I put a squad of Possessed Marines (Daemon Talons) in a Rhino (with a Warp Amp). I use the Possessed Aspiring Champion to bring in my Daemonette squads.

My 1500pt list is like this:

HQ
Chaos Lord (Dark Blade, Combat Drugs, Steed of Slaanesh, DAura, DStrength)

ELITES
6 Possessed Marines (DTalons) w/ Chaos Rhino (Warp Amp, Extra Armor, Smoke)

TROOPS
3 Squads of 6 Noise Marines (4 Sonic Blasters, Blastmaster, Aspiring Champ with Power Weapon / DStrength -- i often buy infiltrate on these squads)
2 Squads of 6 Daemonettes (sometimes 1 squad of 12 -- or 1 squad of 10/13 if i don't want them in too early)

HEAVY
6 Noise Marine Havocs (4 Blast Masters, 2 bolters, tank hunters)
Chaos Defiler (with Indirect Fire and/or Mutated Hull)

If the games are larger, I'll add a predator or dreadnought.

Best of luck!

[yankee boy]

Welcome to the EC club! First off, with reagrd to the icon, I would simply make a banner and place it on a model's back. The icon does not take up weapon space, and it would be clear that way.

I have a 2500 pt EC army and have lists for various point levels. In a 2000 pt game, I typically take 3, 12 man squads, all with sonic weapons and 1 blastmaster. I take 2, 6 man havoc squads w/blastmasters, a tooled up cheesey Daemon Prince and use the extra points on Daemonettes. I also take vet skills for one squad and for the havocs, typically infiltrate (1 havoc squad takes tank hunters).

This list is devastating to opponents. PERIOD.

When I came up with it, I had played balanced marine armies and assumed that the all sonic weapon list was too expensive, etc. The army is new for me, but I have won 8 straight games with it against a variety of opponents. I have played Eldar, Marines, Tyranids, Mechanized Imperial Guard, and Tau, and won each and every time.

Yes, your noise marines are expensive, but they are fearless, so they never break and run. I use large squads, which are harder to weaken and render ineffective. Most importantly, your sonic weapons eat armies alive.

A 12 man squad will fire 22 times and twice for the blastmaster at 24" range. That's on the move, so your effective range is 30". Stand still and you'll fire 33 times and shoot a str8 blast, as well. In my game vs the nids, I have 3 squads in decent firing positions, firing 99 times per turn, also with 3 blastmasters.

The havocs can move and shoot and are extremely effective while doing so-no ohter heavy weapon teams can really do this. Stand still and you will chew through large squads with ease.

Now, neighsayers will say the following:
"Your models are too expensive!"
-true, but they are rock hard, as good as space marines, 3+ save, fearless, and deliver a huge salvo.

"Sonic Weapons are good on paper, but not in actual games"
-Simply not true. Most players make the mistake of taking just a few of them, so the results are negligable. In large numbers, you have a long reach with tons of shots. You should see people's faces when I pull out the dice- complete and utter horror.

"Sonic Weapons don't have great AP, and everyone plays marines"
-1st: Sonic Weapons decimate AP5 and higher.
-2nd: I have found the AP value is not such a big deal, simply because of the large amount of wounds you inflict. The enemy has to eventually fail armor saves when rolling large amounts of them. I played a marine army with 50 tacticals- 50 of them! In one turn alone I managed to kill 16 of them. Most players don't take that many troops and even if they did, can't afford to sustain those kinds of losses.

The best part of the sonic list is the overwhelming defeats I have inflicted. I have had 1 game make it to turn 6. MOst have been over by 3 or 4 and the othe rplayer concedes- nothing is left.

The large marine squads provide a firebase. The daemon prince kills vehicles and large squads of weak troops. He also acts as a focus for the daemonettes, which wreck squads, can hurt vehicles, and generally scare my opponents. I find that enemy players focus undue amounts of attention on them, allowing my marines to keep shooting eveything up. The marines weaken squads or remove them, and the daemonettes clean up what's left.

Give it a try and proxy a list- it's a fun, quirky army to play and incredibly powerful, as well.

[Spoonie]

I disagree with you on a few points Xander, just from personal experience. The thing about the sonic blasters is you can move towards the enemy and still be able to shoot a respectable amount, making up for the lost attack. Of course this costs 5 points a model, but it's fun to move and shoot

For combat drugs, yes they're awesome, but I don't see ignoring the first unsaved wound as being that useful alot of the time. Most demon princes will either wipe out everything in their kill zone, or be fighting something they don't get saves against anyways. But the attack is great, and the WS and str can come in handy aswell, making it a very flexible piece of wargear.

Also with some careful manuevering demonettes can minimize the hits they take. If you assume you're going to kill 3 or 4 marines on the charge, you can try and make it so those are the only ones that you'll be able to fight. Then they have a pretty good chance of running with visage, otherwise you're still going first next round.

If I ever did Emperor's Children, I'd probably take a ton of sonic weapons, just because I'm big on mobile firepower.

[The Emperor's Child]

Some great advice so far, I'm probably going heavy on the sonic weapons, I like their mobility. Btw.. I was wondering what kind of weapon is a Doom Siren supposed to be regarding how it looks? Is it like a gun? Or something like that huge thing the Slaanesh Lord model is carrying on it's shoulders/back?

[Sakura]

Do I even begin to list the advantages?

its only the most unbeatable army in 40k that doesnt even appear to be as good as it is to the naked eye.

let me just say a few quick notes and i'll let you fill int he rest yourself.

Bikes........... guns.... bikes... icons... keepers....
baby havocs..... stoic squads of madness.
havocs with tank hunters.
fast lords with claws and hounds (siren if you want to be a creep)
terminators with better guns with PWs striking faster than 99% of other armies that matter.
dreads that lower leadership to a possible -6
cheap stronger predators that have blastmaster rather than a putty autocannon.
invincible ICs with lash of tormant hitting just as hard but unable to be hit with retinue.
Oh paaaalease.

Pink is the colour of a real man, a man that doesnt care if you call him a girl bcause that gives him an excuse to hurt you.

[Xander-K]

Originally Posted by The Emperor's Child

Or something like that huge thing the Slaanesh Lord model is carrying on it's shoulders/back?

yes thats a doom siren, you get smaller versions with the EC squad sets though.

Originally Posted by Sakura

Pink is the colour of a real man, a man that doesnt care if you call him a girl bcause that gives him an excuse to hurt you.

oh yeah, and if you do wanna play EC you don't have to use that colour scheme, just use the same models with pretty much any colours and you will be fine, mine are yellow and black, which I tell you now looks very nice.

[The Emperor's Child]

I'm not really sure about wich of the sonic weapons included in the EC CSM box is a Sonic Blaster or a Blastmaster either.

And one question I asked earlier still remains unanswered, someone said a Doom Siren makes the whole unit it is in always strike in Initiative order, but from what it says in the codex I'd say it only counts for the model carrying the DS. Can anyone clarify this?

[warwizard_99]

It is only the model carrying the DS.

As for EC, congrats on joining the group. I've played for about 8 months and am 18-0-0, against every army out there. Slaanesh does not appear as strong on paper as it is in practice. Everyone, including myself, thought it foolhardy to take on EC, as it was the only Chaos power I did not own. After playing this long, I can say that you can make your list three ways.

1.) Utilize Warp scream to the max. Give Noise Marines Melta Guns, bp/CCW, and a Champ w/ a PW, run lots of demons, and charge, very Khornesqe, at your opponent. Works to a moderate degree.

2.) Competely utilize sonic weapons on everyone, and out shoot every other army that exists in 40k, period.

3.) use both. I have 3 six man Noise Marine squads with 5 sonic blasters and a blaster, I have 3 Havoc squads with 4 Blastmasters and 2 bp/ccw, with tank hunter, 3 units of eight demonette's, 1 squad of six cavaalry, a unit of six terminators, and a minimum size DP that weighs in a 125 pts. I have yet to lose. I can fire almost 100 shots, if stationary, or I can move every turn, and fire 60+. My demonette's are 8 strong because any more, and they are wasted, and at 6, they pop out a turn early and get shot to pieces. My cav are 6 because I want them to be favored and appear turn 2 so I can run/fleet/assault any unit I please turn 2. I have the termies, as funny as it seems, as the armies weakness. I built the army, from game one, for people to see Termies, fear them, shoot them to pieces, and everything else in my army to tear them to bits. I lose my termies every game, but if I take them out, I add 2 more units of cav, and that is just overkill. I have a DP, again, for the fear factor. He is statured, has mutation, flight, and twin CCW's. If he does anything for me, it is gravy, because unlike other people, he is one of my meat shields...

I love playing/painting EC, and don't plan on turning away from them anytime soon. There is the constant question, for me, as to why would you want to pay the points for marines to be assaulty, when the 'ettes do it faster, better, and cheaper. Plus, you would give up the sonic weaponary that is so cool!

[The Emperor's Child]

Originally Posted by The Emperor's Child

I'm not really sure about wich of the sonic weapons included in the EC CSM box is a Sonic Blaster or a Blastmaster either.

Nevermind tihs question, already found my answer by looking it up on the online store of the GW website.


So yesterday I made the second step towards my EC army, bought a box of Noise Marines, so now I'll just have to order some extra Sonic Blasters. I'm already very excited, I never found Slaanesh very interesting either.. until I really looked into them, they will be a nice change from my other armies. I'm slowly getting more ideas of what I might want from my future army.

I've just put together a simple 500 pts army so I can play with that for a while to get the feel of the army. Later on I might add a Dreadnought, some bikes and ofcourse more Marines and Daemonettes. But for now, I won't go any further as this until I've painted every model in it, since I have the tendency to not finish my armies if I buy a whole lot all at once.

- Chaos Lieutenant:
Combat Drugs
Doom Siren
Daemonic Strength
Power Weapon & Bolt Pistol

- 2 units 6 Noise Marines:
4 Sonic Blasters and a Blastmaster
*Aspiring Champion with Power Weapon & Bolt Pistol

- 5 Daemonettes

[warwizard_99]

Personally, I don't pimp out my characters. To round out some points, or something, I can see, but short of using a little Demonic Strength, or Mutation, I really haven't found the need to. Also, I don't use combat drugs...I develpoed a mentality, a long time ago, where number's matter. For those combat drugs, I'm giving up a marine with a blaster...is it really worth it. Also, unless you play on boards with loads of terrain, a Doom Siren isn't really worth it. I would use a psychic power, or something, over the DS...

Also, I did the very same thing you did, for the first couple of games. I kitted my squads with sonic weapons, then gave my champ a power weapon. The problem you ask: My squads never made it to combat. So all the power weapons I gave my champs bought me a squad of demonette's...see where I'm going with this?

In my earlier post, I said that my DP is my meat shield because he is what's left after trimming and editing my list through 15 games. I came out with the points, through dropping this or that, to buy a winged DP...

I don't know if this will help any, but a different view is always good.

[The Emperor's Child]

Ofcourse a different view is always good, that's why made this thread in the first place.

I was actually just having doubts about if I really wanted to give my Champions a Power Weapon & BP. I first thought it might the give the unit a bit more punch in case they do get in combat, but on second thought they would be cheaper with a Sonic Blaster and would give the unit 2/3 extra shots. My Lieutenant will probably be enough for some extra CC effectiveness, since I doubt I will encounter too many problems in only 500 points. If I also drop the Combat Drugs and Daemonic Strength I can add 3 Daemonettes wich would give me 6 (9 on charge right?) extra attacks with their deadly Talons, wich I think will be more likely to earn their points back.

Thanks.

[Xander-K]

tank hunter cannot be used with sonic weaponry, it was on one of the chaos faqs (also probably in the official 40k forum).