The new, improved High Elf rumour thread.

[Harry]

So as yet another High Elf thread is moved to General Fantasy discussion, as it spirals out of control off topic, here, by way of a fresh start, is everything we have got so far on High Elves.

Lets try and keep this on on topic (and in the rumour section!) and I will try and keep this first page up to date with any new (confirmed) information as it becomes available.

High Elf release: November: Book and Army Box set.

THE BOOK : It is done and on its way to the printers. Written by Adam Troke (I presume with input from the rest of the games developers).

Intrigue at court is gone.
Elves strike first. (Army rule).
Archers can fire in two ranks.
Special Characters include (There could be more but I have not heard it) :
Tyrion, Teclis, Eltharion and Alith Anar as Lords. (Tyrion, Teclis, Eltharion have been there since the first book. Rick Priestly : 'leave none of the old background behind'. Alith Anar : New model).
Korhil and Caradryan (Captain of the Phoenix Guard) as Heroes. (Mentioned in the Nemesis Crown booklet).
There will be three other ‘vanilla’/generic Hero options. (So a new Character type!)
There will be three types of/different Dragons in the book.
There will not be a unit of Drake riders. (Allesio : 'we will not make the same mistake as we did with the pegasus knights).

THE MINIS

Plastic kits: Mostly by Martin Footit.

Characters/Heroes/Commanders (Makes 2 characters one mounted and one on foot).
High Elf Mages (Makes two mages one mounted and one on foot).
Plastic Dragon kit. (75Hastings69 posted this on warseer months ago. Flying horizontally like the old Dragon Masters dragon (for those who remember that far back). It will come with various rider options to represent different character options who can ride it.
NO NEW SPEARMEN OR ARCHERS!
High Elf Cavalry Plastics. (These were rumoured months ago by 75Hastings69 but I have heard nothing. They may be delayed and set for a later release).
Plastic Chariot kit with option of Lion steeds. (Dave Thomas)

Metal

Alith Anar. (Gary Morley).
Possibly a new eagle.
Lothern Sea guard including a Sea guard Captain/Commander with a Sea hawk on his wrist and a standard bearer with a carved wooden leg. The art work for the seaguard is a lot more ‘gritty’ than the old look. (More ‘sea dog’ than Sea Elf!) I don’t know if these are part of a bigger ‘redo’ of the Sea Guard models or not.

[Arhalien]

What? THe olds one was moved to General? The mods must be getting fed up with us Well, after all the dwarf handgun discussing then it makes sense.

Looks like a good comprehensive list there Harry; are you going to ask Sylass to add it to the roundup?

[Harry]

Sylass moves in mysterious ways and not at my calling.

If anyone thinks I have missed anything from any of the Elf threads let me know and I will check it out and add it.

[Arhalien]

Originally Posted by Harry

Sylass moves in mysterious ways and not at my calling.

Hmm, the few times I've pmed him about the ruoundup he seems to have responded, but that may just be me

[NakedFisherman]

Thanks for the concise write-up, Harry. Is the new hero type simply a hero from a specific province (the Shadowlands?)?

[C-Coen]

Thanks for making it clear now. (1 post instead of 5 pages with Dwarf guns)
Altough I'm not a HE player I look forward to new mini's. The Lothern guys seem very promising.

But about the 'Elves strike first' rule.. that's not fair, right?
Because WE are updated at the end of the 6th edition, they won't be done for years. So the quite-heavily-armoured brothers from Ulthuan strike before the very-light-armoured-or-simply-almost-naked Asrai..? That sounds ridiculous..!

[Bloodknight]

Cool rumours. Do you know if that strike first rule will work even with great weapons?
At first I thought: man, that´s overpowered. Then I thought about how my pikemen work and these guys still lose more combats than they win, so I guess it´s allright as long as the points reflect it.

Dragon kit could be interesting, I am looking forward to seeing it.
Also: a new character choice. What´s there between fighty hero and mage? Some sort of Beastmaster like the DE got?

[Talis]

Wood Elves do strike first. With arrows.



*Edit*
(WARNING: The above is meant to be read with a light touch -- a smattering, if you will -- of sarcasm. No game mechanics are meant to be authoritatively defined by its logic. No *cough* hippie *cough* elves were harmed in its formulation.)

[theunwantedbeing]

Not if they dont get the first turn......

Striking first doesnt seem like a viable rumour at all,I know the HE players seem to disagree but thats beacuse they think its brilliant....

Spearmen striking first...they get a few extra attacks most of the time,not overly game breaking.
Swordsmasters striking first....whole different kettle of fish as suddenly charging them is a very bad idea.
White lions...they hit even harder than swordsmasters so definitely a bad idea to charge them.
Archers....archers suck in combat and are inexperienced in the ways of hadn to hand fighting so why they'de strike first is beyond me...
Phoenix Guard striking first....not much worse than with the archers unless they get multiple attacks.

Striking first seems to take the tactical ability out of the HE army,and theyll still get initiutive thats worthless to them unless hte new rule works off initiutive...which seems overly complicated as the whole system seems to be getting cumbed down massively.

[Sylass]

Originally Posted by Arhalien

[...] Looks like a good comprehensive list there Harry; are you going to ask Sylass to add it to the roundup?

It's already added to the HE thread there, after all I'm watching what you lot are doing here.

That said, striking first for all HE sounds insanely good...

[Daihmon]

I can see why players would be upset at the idea of a blanket strike first rule, it does force certain unit types to use specific rules to counter the effect.
Eg: Wardancers now must use their 4+ ward save dance rather than their +1 attack dance, the latter being much more useful against the larger ranked up force of spearmen.

However, the points per model have to be going up for such a rule to be put into effect, so idea that my units will be getting even smaller than they already are will make it easier to tie or beat us in combat even if we take off some kills before you strike.

A loss of a rank and likely the loss of outnumbering needs to be balanced out with the ability to strike first, or our infantry simply will not win combats, or even tie them...which is more the point of Spearmen anyway.

Thanks for the post Harry.

[Xyon]

I still doubt the strikes first rule, and I play HE. However, most if not all of the infantry units are over-priced as it is, if this rule comes to play I can see alot of troops staying their points value, or some even going down in points even with this rule.

[Harry]

Firstly the blanket strikes first rule is not my rumour but the rumour that started the 'High Elf titbit' thread. That said it is the same rumour that I heard back during the 'State of the High Elves' thread and the same rumour I have since heard a couple of other places. It remains the only rumour I have heard on the topic and I am ready to accept this is the way of things.
(Rather than 'some get it, some don't' or 'initiative order' or 'only on a full moon' or any other variation which I have only ever heard suggested here, or on other forums).

Originally Posted by C-Coen

But about the 'Elves strike first' rule.. that's not fair, right?
Because WE are updated at the end of the 6th edition, they won't be done for years. So the quite-heavily-armoured brothers from Ulthuan strike before the very-light-armoured-or-simply-almost-naked Asrai..? That sounds ridiculous..!

Is that not like saying its unfair that High Elves can't move and shoot. They are also masters with the bow.

The point is they are trying to make the armies different. Wood Elves get to place woods, move through woods, shoot as they move through the woods. It is about trying to get at the essence of an army. Is this not what Wood Elves are all about. It has nothing to do with what High Elves are all about. So why should we be looking to make the High Elves army rules apply to any other armies.

I defended the strikes first rule on the last thread by pointing out that striking first is not just about speed. It is about skill.

"Speed in combat, striking first is not just about physical speed. It is about skill. Displacement, (avoiding getting hit) Attack au fer, (Engaging the opponents blade), feint, riposte, (Counter attack) Etc. These skills can be taught to the disiplined mind through regular training."

The point is that whilst Wood Elves are sitting around within the security of the borders of their forest, making daisy chains and doing leaf prints the High Elves are sailing the seven seas picking a fight with the bad guys. When they are not doing this they are training until they become masters of the sword and spear so they can do this. (or ironing there dresses).

They can hit first because they are better fighters than there softer, tree hugging, relatives not becase they are faster.

(There will now follow a number of why wood elves are haarder than High Elves posts).

Originally Posted by Bloodknight

Cool rumours. Do you know if that strike first rule will work even with great weapons?

Don't even know for sure that IS the rule. That is the rumour. I have not read the wording of this rule. I have no idea about details or exceptions to it. My understanding is 'High Elves strike first'.

[FuSs]

When i hear first strike for elves i have to think about a scene in Lord of the Rings where orcs are attacking a phalanx of elves.
Just before the orcs reach their line all elves pull out their swords and slash the first rank of orcs.

Too strong? - Probably.
Stylish? - Of course it is.

[ghost21]

alith alnar ?

yes my favorite he hero returns,

[Lander]

Wonder what their going to call the "strike first rule" in the book

[Paulus]

Nice roundup for HE here Harry, good luck keeping it up to date mate

One that really caught my attention here:

Originally Posted by Harry

There will be three types of Dragon in the book.

IIRC you mentioned it in the Watchmen article but I didn't think that it was refered specifically to HE.

Do you know if were looking at something like Drake, Dragon & Emperor Dragon (sorry if this has been discussed before)?

I'm really looking forward to the HE release now & am treating my Lizzie's as more of an army to tide me over until there release.

[TimmyMWD]

To all you doubters, I can confirm through my own sources that High Elves will indeed be striking first - the whole army.

-TimmyMWD
Owner; Asur.org.uk

[ErikNe]

Originally Posted by TimmyMWD

To all you doubters, I can confirm through my own sources that High Elves will indeed be striking first - the whole army.

-TimmyMWD
Owner; Asur.org.uk

Even white lions and characters with great weapons? that seems a bit over the top IMO.

[Paulus]

Originally Posted by TimmyMWD

To all you doubters, I can confirm through my own sources that High Elves will indeed be striking first - the whole army.

-TimmyMWD
Owner; Asur.org.uk

Any idea how this will work?

Is it all the time or only in special circumstances?

What happens when charged by the enemy?

Cheers,

Paul