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Calden
29-02-2008, 12:06
Hello folks!

Recently four friends and I decided we needed something different, and after enjoying a few games of Apocalypse, we turned our attention to the beauty that is Epic! I've always liked the look of 40k's bigger/little brother, but never really got into it as I was put off by things like "abstraction".

Well age has taught me that isn't really a problem, and reading the rules has made me positively excited about playing the game! My friends and I have managed a few games using card proxies to get a feel for things and make sure it wasn't just a flash in the pan interest, and we all seem really smitten.

Now, what I'm after is some pointers, advice, or whatever you can give to help us on our way. We plan on using the 2008 Handbook that is floating around, as it seems the easiest way to keep us all on the same page.

FYI I'm going Ulthwe, and my friends and going for the Orks, Marnies and Guard.

Hena
29-02-2008, 14:25
First play few games without aircraft and WE. That makes the understanding of basic rules easier. As aircraft has almost their own rules and WE bend several quite much.

Note that the handbooks list section is not that widely accepted so would keep that in mind when playing.

Also the Marine player should be prepared to get creamed at the beginning as they are rather hard to play with :) .

Dwarf Supreme
29-02-2008, 16:56
Welcome to the Wonderful World of Epic, Calden. I'm glad to hear that you and your friends enjoyed it.

I agree with Hena; play a few games without aircraft and WEs. It'll be easier to learn the game that way. Then when you're comfortable with rules, add them in. Also, start with small games, like around 2000 points. 2700-3000 points is a typical tournament-size game. Most players collect more than 3000 points, so that they can swap things around for variety.

Chaos and Evil
29-02-2008, 20:00
I can only chime with the other guys above, that starting small (~1500-2000pts) is the best idea.

What made up your mind to use the 2008 Handbook?

I'll freely admit that my gaming group also uses the Handbook, but I'm interested to know your reasons...

StugMeister
29-02-2008, 23:01
Welcome indeed sir! Tis good to see more folks coming over to the glory that is Epic!

I agree with what the other dudes said - don't worry about aircraft or War Engines just yet, and 2000pts ought to be good to start with, but I started at 1500.

tabletopnews
01-03-2008, 05:50
I'd aim at the lower end for the first few games and go with 1500 pts. I agree that leaving out everything other than the infantry and basic vehicles is the key. After a few games I'd suggest adding WEs then Titans, spacecraft and finally aircraft.

I think your Marine playing friend may have some troubles as Marines in E:A are tough to play and really unforgiving. Make one mistake and your gameplan is finished.

Chaos and Evil
01-03-2008, 09:46
Tell him that Marines get a lot better when he uses Thunderhawks though. :D

tabletopnews
02-03-2008, 01:17
Tell him that Marines get a lot better when he uses Thunderhawks though. :D

And drop pods.

Calden
02-03-2008, 12:46
Thanks for the tips folks. We've been playing a few games to get our heads around the rules, without fliers to start with, and things are going well so far. We plan to play a few more games without fliers, and then introduce them. Everyone seems pretty excited about it thus far.

We went for the handbook, mainly because the changes that had been made in it made sense to us, and having everything in one document will just make things easier for reference purposes, rather than skipping between different files.

Gary
03-03-2008, 16:16
Hi Calden

Very good idea to take up Epic, it's a magnificent game :). Easily one of GW's best I reckon.

You've probably worked out a lot of this yourself already, but in case you haven't played too much yet, here are some of the things that I think are so great about Epic:

1) Simultaneous turns: Not only do you have to choose what to do, but you also need to pick when to do it. This gives you absolutely loads to think about in terms of prioritising, makes things more even (as your opponent doesn't get to batter you for a whole turn with no reply) and stops you getting bored waiting for the other player to move all his stuff.

2) Blast markers: The game has a beautiful system for dealing with the suppressive effect of fire. This adds loads of tactics to the game as you don't have to kill an enemy to really mess up his day - sometimes softening him up is all you need.

3) Working together. The way that firefights work means that you are rewarded for getting formations to support each other. This is hard to master and takes planning, so adds another layer of stuff to think about.

4) Easy to learn. Despite all the complexity above, the rules are actually very intuitive and easy to pick up. A perfect balance really.

5) It looks great. There's nothing like seeing whole companies of tanks trundling about the place, or being cut apart by Warlord Titans. Most of the Epic models are really good. In Epic scale, there's also scope to make some really extraordinary terrain, if you're so inclined. Cities look like cities, and mountains look like mountains.

6) Grand Tournament scenario. Most people tend to use this scenario for their games - which is good cos it's brilliant :). It's usually very balanced and often leads to close games that require a lot more than just killing the enemy.

7) Balance. The army lists for Epic are generally very balanced. There will always be some units/lists that are a bit over or under powered, but it's quite hard to pick a very cheesy list, and you will almost always have a good game, whatever your opponent uses.

8) Easy to get into. It's easier to get an Epic army together than a 40k or Warhammer one, I reckon. You need fewer models and they can be easier to paint up quickly (they might be small, but they usually look fine with a slapdash wash and a highlight).

9) Rulebook. The Epic rulebook is lovely. Full colour, crammed with pictures, with lots of interesting stuff to read about scenarios and campaigns and all that jazz. Even though you can download the rules for free, I'd still recommend getting a copy of the actual book if you can. It's well worth having.

10) Community. There might not be many Epic players around the place (relative to 40k), but Epic converts tend to be pretty fanatical about the game, so there will always be people to play and discuss Epic stuff with if you look for them.

Apologies for the rambling, Epic can get me a bit excited :)

ripperdoc
20-03-2008, 17:56
9) Rulebook. The Epic rulebook is lovely. Full colour, crammed with pictures, with lots of interesting stuff to read about scenarios and campaigns and all that jazz. Even though you can download the rules for free, I'd still recommend getting a copy of the actual book if you can. It's well worth having.




Which rulebook are you talking about? I'm wanting to get into Epic but I'm having a hard time sorting out which rules people are using and where to get them.

Thanks
ripper

CyberShadow
20-03-2008, 18:51
This is something that I will be sorting out with my web site soon. It can be confusing to get into the game.

Essentially, there is a single rule book. This was made available to buy from GW. It is now also available for download in several sections on the SG web site. This contains the core rules and force lists for Marines, IG and Orks.

There was then a suppliment, also published and now available in sections to download from the SG site. This contains the force lists for Eldar (Biel Tann), IG Siege Masters and Feral Orks.

These are the basic rules and are all official.

In addition, there are a number of official updated rules. Initially, this was only an update to the Skimmer rules. However, earlier today a full update list was made available to download from the SG site. These can all now be considered official. However, for your first couple of games, you may want to just use the previous core rules until you get the hang of it.

Finally, the force lists are in various states of official-ness.

Official:
- Chaos Lost and the Damned
- Chaos Black Legion
- Marine White Scars

Other force lists are still in development. The latest SG approved, unofficial lists are also available to download. In addition, some lists have updates not yet posted on the SG site. For example, the EA Tau list has version 4.4 on the SG site. This is the latest version, and is not 'official' but is an updated work in progress version. I also have version 4.4.2 which is the next stage, but is not yet available from SG.

As you can see, things are in a complicated state. My advice would be to simply download the core rules, Swordwind (the Eldar suppliment) and the latest version of whatever force list you like from the SG site. Get a few games in, and ask any questions to take it further from there.

Good luck.

Patriarch
20-03-2008, 19:25
Which rulebook are you talking about? I'm wanting to get into Epic but I'm having a hard time sorting out which rules people are using and where to get them.

Thanks
ripper

Hardcopy here:
http://uk.games-workshop.com/storefront/store.uk?do=Individual&code=60710399017&orignav=300808

Free electronic copy here:
http://www.specialist-games.com/epic/rulebook.asp

Official experimental army lists & rules here:
http://www.specialist-games.com/epic/Vault.asp

Unofficial but extensive playtest army lists here:
http://www.tacticalwargames.net/cgi-bin/forum/ikonboard.cgi?act=SC;c=12

Enjoy! :)