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View Full Version : Denied Flank - what is this exactly?



Hugger
05-03-2008, 09:41
Obliged, if anyone could elaborate on this type of tactic.. Odds are, I am already doing it, but I would like to know the definition :-)

Thanks!

Tomas

Goldenwolf
05-03-2008, 09:56
Hugger,

I am sure people will disagree with me, but....

It is when your army is setup to fight on one flank, and to use the middle to screen the other flank. So if you setup strong right, your center sets up to defend the Center and Left, letting your right smash the enemy.

FurryMiguell
05-03-2008, 10:30
I must admit, it sounds very right, but I'm so sure I've heard the name saying "deploying a lot of fast cavy and good flanking units on one flank, so that your opponent will not normaly be able to use that flank without deploying heavily there". but your version sounds a lot more logic. I sure that tactic every time. its THE way to guard your armys one flank, while you can have all your fast cavy on the other flank, and give your opponent a hard time flanking you

Cheers:D

kroq'gar
05-03-2008, 10:33
I always thought a refused flank was deploying, using the borad edges to guard your back and flank, and then forcing the enemy to come to you.

Its pretty much what dwarves do most the time...

Lucky24/7
05-03-2008, 10:35
Denied flank is deploying heavely and on one flank and forcing your oppent to come to you .... also known as the refused flank.

Theres a diffrent name for the tactic of advancing up one flank while keeping your center still. but I cant rember it right now :D

But in genrall its deploying on 1 side making any deployment on the other null/void

Very easy tatcic if you have alot of dispossible/fast cav units (hounds, snotlings, skaven, empire) as it allows you to fake a deployment on one flank when the true force of your army will be comming from the other :D

Varath- Lord Impaler
05-03-2008, 10:53
it can also be known as the 'Castle' deployment.

Deploying in the corner (preferably around a hill) so your army stretches diagonally across. Meaning both flanks of your army are protected and you are showing only your front to the enemy army.

Gazak Blacktoof
05-03-2008, 11:33
it can also be known as the 'Castle' deployment.

Nope, the castle deployment is based around defending one fixed spot, usually a hill (or castle ;)).

The castle is best employed in a corner of the board where one flank is protected by that board edge.

The refused flank is essentially fixing one end of your battle line whilst wheeling and attacking with the other end whilst the centre protects the extended attacking flank and the refused flank. A refused flank will usually be composed of missile units on one flank, infantry in the centre and monsters or cavalry in the attacking flank.


Denied flank is the fast cavalry and skirmish tactic described by FurryMiguel. Essentially you make one part of the board difficult to advance through, you can also use a denied centre tactic along the same lines to prevent easy access through the centre. Denying tactics are those most often used by MSU armies to slow and stifle the enemy whilst they target and destroy other sections of your battle line.

Hugger
05-03-2008, 12:58
Thanks for all the input guys... Looks like I am doing it right already, just needed clarification on the terminology :-D

Oenghus
05-03-2008, 13:29
A trickier version of DF would be to deploy evenly across the board (faster stuff on the wings) and then 'pull' one flank around behind your center. You then end up with all of your strength on one side of the board, while your opponent (who has presumably deployed more or less evenly with you) is left scurrying to catch up. Works best with fast armies.

Brother Enok
06-03-2008, 22:18
Denied flank, or refused flank is what I call my battle line when I set up entirely on one side of the board against a gun line, nullifing the weapons on the empty side, or forcing them to re-deploy.

txamil
07-03-2008, 00:25
Denied flank, or refused flank is what I call my battle line when I set up entirely on one side of the board against a gun line, nullifing the weapons on the empty side, or forcing them to re-deploy.

Which works if your avg troop cost is more than the avg gunline unit. On average, this is not the case however.

Brother Enok
07-03-2008, 10:59
Forgive me, but I wasn't just talking about warhammer and 40K. I use it in games like total war as well.

blurred
07-03-2008, 12:08
Which works if your avg troop cost is more than the avg gunline unit. On average, this is not the case however.

Why's that? IMO refused flank is almost always the best tactic against a gunline.

Avian
07-03-2008, 13:45
My article on Greenskin Battle Tactics (http://folk.ntnu.no/~tarjeia/avian/tactics/greenskin_battle_tactics.php) describes both the refused flank and the castle tactic, with illustrations an' everyfink. ;)

ZeroTwentythree
07-03-2008, 14:45
Which works if your avg troop cost is more than the avg gunline unit. On average, this is not the case however.

I don't even understand what that means, but not matter how I try to read it, it I'm not agreeing.

Points cost has little to do with it IMHO. If you opponent is wasting his time moving his missile troops instead of shooting you with them, then it's going to be a payoff whether you've prevented him from killing 50 points or 500 points. Additionally, in the time he's been redeploying, you've presumably been running at his other troops and closing in on the relative safety of close combat.

Darth Rubi
07-03-2008, 17:09
I think the traditional refused flank also involves deploying a fast unit/s on the refused flank, which can rapidly redeploy to your main flank. Alternatively, a sacrificial unit should be placed there, but either way you need to lure your opponent into actually deploy something on the refused flank

Brother Enok
08-03-2008, 12:38
It has worked fine for me, in both 40K and Fantasy. I also find points has very little to do with it. Its often a case of bringing my army to bear on one side of his gunline, then rolling up his thin extended formation.
Using small cheap units as a distraction can also somtimes fool an oponent into maintaining his gunline, instead of attempting to redeploy. Either way a rufused falnk with this method makes the game quite uncomfortable for you opponent.