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primarchvulken
01-11-2008, 07:48
Could i use them as an army? the current rules for them wont support a whole army.

Sidstyler
01-11-2008, 08:12
Could i use them as an army? the current rules for them wont support a whole army.

Kinda answered your own question, didn't you? :p

I'd say you could do whatever you wanted for a counts-as army though. Take a lot of sternguard in the new SM codex, they're pretty much like Deathwatch anyway.

Warforger
01-11-2008, 08:23
You can, for +5 points per model a tactical marine can be upgraded to a Death Watch Veteran with one of there special rounds, mind you one of those are Kraken Rounds (I hear Fire warriors digging holes for graves). They also have some special rounds like bolter rounds that re-roll to wound (equiv. would be Hellfire rounds) a 18 range S3 shotgun, a heavy 2 pinning bolter (good against hordes).

You can also have the Sternguard be Death Watch Veterans.

So Something like this
Death Watch Captain Henrailus-100
Relic Blade +30
Combi-Melta+10
Hellfire rounds+10
Death Watch Upgrade-Metal Storm Ammunition, +5
155

Troops
Tactical Squad, 10 man 170 (all bolters, even serge)
Serge with Power Fist+25
Kraken Bolts on all +40
Plasma Gun+10
Heavy Bolter
245

Tactical Squad 10 man-170
Plasma Cannon, Plasmagun+15
Power Fist+25
2 Deathwatch with M.40 targeter+10
6 have Inferno Bolts +30
Rhino+35
285

Tactical Squad 10 man-170
Kraken Bolts +40
Heavy Bolter
Plasmagun+10
220

Elites:
Sternguard Veterans
8-man
Power Fist+25
4 Combi-Flamers +20
Rhino+35
280

Sternguard Veterans
8-man
2 Lascannons +30
230

1245

PDF (http://oz.games-workshop.com/games/40k/spacemarines/gaming/deathwatch/assets/deathwatch.pdf)

Culven
01-11-2008, 15:34
There are a couple of problems with Warforger's list. First, the 5 point upgrade doesn't include ammunition. It only allows access to the ammunition at the points cost indicated in the Kill Team entry. Second, the list is showing two types of special ammunition in the Plasma Cannon squad. This is not allowed. The unit must use the same ammunition throughout. Only an actual Kill Team could have Stalker rounds and another ammunition in the same unit.

doskar
01-11-2008, 20:47
I had been running a deathwatch squad, and then the new Codex came. I think you get way more bang for your buck (points) with Sternguard. I converted and repainted mine.

Warforger
02-11-2008, 04:48
Where does it say that you can't take mixes of special rounds?

BigRob
02-11-2008, 08:18
Can you still use the original kill team rules? I always thought if you wanted to include them in an army they went in an Ordo Xenos Army as allies. Use the Witch Hunters book and use an Inquisition only force with a kill team and either guard or more allied space marines.

Remember Deathwatch are rarely deployed as an army, because they are so rock hard.

Spacker
02-11-2008, 10:15
Culven, I think you have that back to front. The Killteam unit states "the same ammo must be used throughout the squad". The section before that on upgrading individual members of squads to DW vets does not have that same restriction, it says "Each may then select one of the following ammunition types ...", so each model can have a different one if you so choose.

BigRob, yes you can still use the CA list if your opponent approves. Those rules clearly state that you can put a Kill team squad into a Codex: Space Marines army, an Imperial Guard army, or Inquisitorial army. For individual squad member upgrades you can only do so with a Codex: Space Marines army.

ManOfRust
02-11-2008, 10:31
If you were resigned to using a 'counts as' army then a convenient ruse would be to use Pedro Kantor's rules as a stand in for your Deathwatch Captain. A bit restrictive on the wargear front (Dorn's Arrow makes for a pretty cool archeotech/xenos weapon) but you get to use Sternguard as your Killteams with special ammo and handy weapon options as troops and he even has a Strike Cruiser in orbit in case you really want to exterminate the alien infestation.

rodmillard
03-11-2008, 01:05
I'm building a deathwatch element to my Inquisition army using the WH codex:

Inquisitor Lord & Retinue, Assassin, 2 Arbites squads & Orbital Bombardment from the WH list, the DW kill team, and inducted space marine units (which is after all what the deathwatch are). For my inducted units I'm painting them as deathwatch with each squad from a different chapter, while keeping to the parent chapter's fluff - so my DW bikers are originally whitescars, the tac squads are Imperial/Crimson fists, the vehicle support is Iron Hands etc. Anything that can be given a drop pod will be.

Its not ideal - Warforger's list from the new codex is probably closer to the fluff, but I want each "wing" of my =I= force to play like an =I= army (I already have a 3000+ point marine army if i want an army that plays like marines...)

Culven
03-11-2008, 01:15
Culven, I think you have that back to front. The Killteam unit states "the same ammo must be used throughout the squad". The section before that on upgrading individual members of squads to DW vets does not have that same restriction, it says "Each may then select one of the following ammunition types ...", so each model can have a different one if you so choose.
Ah, my mistake. I probably mixed those up since I've been playing the Kill Team rules more recently and when I played my Deathwatch army I kept it to one type per unit for simplicity and so that each would have a specific role. :o
I'm building a deathwatch element to my Inquisition army using the WH codex:

Inquisitor Lord & Retinue, Assassin, 2 Arbites squads & Orbital Bombardment from the WH list, the DW kill team, and inducted space marine units (which is after all what the deathwatch are). For my inducted units I'm painting them as deathwatch with each squad from a different chapter, while keeping to the parent chapter's fluff - so my DW bikers are originally whitescars, the tac squads are Imperial/Crimson fists, the vehicle support is Iron Hands etc. Anything that can be given a drop pod will be.
I would suggest that you not have a Deathwatch Kill Team and non-Deathwatch units in the same army. It may lead to confusion, especially since it is possible to upgrade Tactical Squad members to Deathwatch Veterans.