View Full Version : Experimental Fallen Realms - 1500

08-04-2009, 08:10
Just trying out some different builds. 1 ringwraith in my list has worked well for me, so I took two, and its worked even better. So I might as well try three now and get a feel of how things work. I also want to get suladan and amdur into a list eventually.

1500 Pts - The Fallen Realms Army

1 Ringwraith [The Shadow Lord] @ 125

1 Ringwraith [Khaműl the Easterling] @ 125

1 Ringwraith [The Betrayer] @ 125

6 Easterling Cohort @ 230
1 Easterling Captain

4 Easterling Cohort @ 190
w/ Pikes
1 Easterling Captain

5 Easterling Cohort @ 200
1 Easterling Captain

3 Corsair Arbelasters @ 75

4 Easterling Kataphrakt Cohort @ 175
1 Dragon Knight

1 Half Troll Warband @ 100

3 Morgul Knight Regiment @ 155
1 Knight Commmander

Total Army Cost: 1500

The goal of this army is magic boosting my formations while crippling my opponents. The shadow lord either goes with knights or the large formation of swordsmen. Khamul goes in the other large easterling formation and the Betrayer in the trolls or something else. Setup with the shadow lord and khamul's formation in front so that shooting is minimized as I advance. Keep lanes of fire clear for the arbelasters as my opponents advance. Use pikemen and khamul to make the opponent avoid charging as much of the board as I can.

PS: Amazing combo. Wings of Terror with Khamul on his formation, depending on if you have priority or not move your formation so that by the end of the movement phase only your formation will get to charge. Then get either Khamul or another Ringwraith to cast Strength from Corruption on Khamul's formation. (So with 3 ringwraiths im pretty sure I can get 1 to go off, if not more). Raise Khamul's formation's strength by +2/4/possibly more if you SfC multiple times. Roll D6 (or 2D6 if you cast it successfully twice). However many hits you take, you then get to roll for khamul's essence leach. So 1/3 on average of the hits you take will be reflected onto one of your opponents units (thus making SfC less damaging to you). Then lets say if khamul was in a 6 company strong formation of Easterlings they charge D6 + 8, hit at strength 5/7/etc. and have Defense 7. Nasty.

08-04-2009, 10:26
Honestly I would generaly only use Strength from Corruption like that if I were in a unit of orcs, morannon orcs, or other cheap troops. Easterlings at 30 and 35 points per base seem too valuable to suffer from automatic hits like that. But it's a good idea, and I might just increase my supply of Morannons to take advantage of it!

The best use I see for the spell so far is to get free hits on my opponent's Mumak. Who cares if it's now Strength 10 intead of 9? Free hits!

With the list I would drop the half trolls and increase command optiosn elsewhere in the list, expecially a banner for each of your two cav regiments.

08-04-2009, 11:25
In a gamy way it seems as a rather balanced army. Though I agree with that you need banners with your cavalry. You will hate yourself when you roll that one or don't reach the target.

Theme wise I'm not so impressed, I rather play with a strict theme and pick "allies" from one other army including some leader (even though everything is from one list, theme wise I don't agree with that). Or several lists, but then it would be a very large battle indeed say 3000+ points or so.
Theme wise I would stick with Easterling archers before Arbalesters. I would also include the Dark Marshal as one of the Wraith if I included either Black Numenorians or Morgul Knights. And I really don't see how Halftrolls would join an Easterling army without Harad warriors and leaders present.
Also, three Ringwraiths in such a tiny army?!? one would be enough in my opinion, two tops. I would use shamans for magic even if they are not that much cheaper.

I rather loose with style than win by optimizing the best dice pool at every corner.

08-04-2009, 14:14
I'd actually recommend not taking the banner in such a small unit of cavalry, especially if you put a character in there. With three regiments, you have your captain in one, the character in the second, and a banner in the third regiment. It must be arranged that way because you must have at least as many regular troops in a regiment as upgrades/characters. So if you took a single casualty you would be forced to remove one of your upgrades, since you can't have only the upgrade in a regiment.

I think Morgul Knights max out at 3 regiments, so either take the banner and captain and no other characters in it, or don't take one of the other upgrades; otherwise even a single casualty is very expensive!

08-04-2009, 17:05
Theme wise yes the trolls are a little out of the normal for me. However, I'm not so strict on theme as you perhaps. Why is multiple ringwraiths unthematic? Not anymore then any epic hero. The nine regularly go out to hunt for the ring in packs. These three brought a small army with them to do so. That actually makes much more sense then going alone sometimes. Warpriests and shamans make less sense to me as I don't remember them ever being mentioned in the movies or book ( i could definitely be wrong though)...so really if we are going to stick with theme they don't exist. However yes I could change the betrayer to the dark marshal that would be fine.

As for archers over arbelasters, I completely disagree with you. It makes more sense for an army focusing on heavy sword and shield (pike and shield) and heavy cav not to have their own men delegated to the dishonorable role of ranged shooting. Rather bring in the mercenary pirate scum to fufill that role while the true men of Ruin march forward to get to grips with the enemy. This was the attitude in france during the medieval period. That's why the nobility were usually heavy cavalry or heavy armored dismounted knights, not bowmen.

And keeping with the nobles from Rhun with mercenaries from afar, the trolls actually do fit in, as they would work as excellent mercenaries. Paid to fulfill a role in the force, and its not like fighting for money would be against their morals.

And I'd rather use might then pay 35 points I could spend on more troops for a banner.

Oh and yes SfC might be slightly more effective in a mob of orcs, however with khamul in a large formation of easterlings on average I will lose 2.33 repeating easterlings and my opponent will lose 1 model. Then my easterling's will be hitting at +2 or 4 strength. With a higher fv than orcs and a higher defense, the unit will get more attacks and be able to handle more return attacks. Either orcs or easterlings will work great with the spell

08-04-2009, 17:17
Just a quick question, how do you handle units like Giant Eagles or Nazgul on Fell Beasts using their swoop attack to move 36" behind your line? I haven't seen many good ways to stop this so far.

It would seem that it either forces you to redress your formation to face them or suffer a -5 to fight and get clobbered from behind. Ranged units cannot turn to face and shoot in the same phase, since a unit rotating would most likely cause it to move too far. You could use Magic I assume, but that again requires you to turn your unit around, making it a tastey target to charge from the other side.

Monsters seem to be the best way to deal with a threat like this since they have a 360 degree vision and charge arc, however they are usually too far away.

How would you deal with two? Giant Eagles are pretty cheap for their effectiveness.

I'm not saying this is a weakness in your list in particular, but it is a tough problem that every army has to deal with, and I am curious what people's strategies are.

08-04-2009, 17:38
Indeed that is quite tough to deal with. I would probably get a Ringwraith and the formation of arbelasters into a building/wood behind my force acting as a rearguard. The any monsters swooping behind me will be hit with pall of night (to stop them from charging), transfix, etc. And my crossbows and ringwraith would have 365 line of sight. Then the rest of my force would advance via wings of terror and get stuck in with the enemy or depending on the rest of his force I would box up my units so they can't be flanked and let him come to me. (assuming he cannot pick me off with shooting).

Nu Fenix
09-04-2009, 01:42
After the comments you made about various units in my FR review, I expected to see certain things here.

No Khandish Chariot? After explaining the potential damage it can give out, and commenting how you have used two with success previously, I expected to see one or two of them here.

In units with a Ringwraith, are you using a Captain over a Dragon Knight for the extra point of Might, and also for backup Courage if the Ringwraith dies/leaves the unit? Otherwise, why not shave 15 points off and go for the extra Fight?

Once the model comes out, will Amdur be finding a place in there somehow, possibly as an alternative to one of the Ringwraiths [Shadow Lord would be my pick]?

09-04-2009, 04:40
Well they definitely have a place in a fallen realms list. The only reason I dont have them included here is because I wanted to experiment with half trolls (I just got 2 companies mail order yay). But no normally my lists do have a chariot or 2. They are nasty (while they live).
It is for the extra fight and courage, only because sometimes ringwraiths will move to different formations at the beginning of the turn so they have range and LoS for their spells. However, maybe trying out dragon knights would be a good idea, 45 points gets me another formation or with more points freed up elsewhere would let me include another strong unit. Actually those points saved could definitely be used to put amdur in there.