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View Full Version : Why doesn't Tigurius have something in his profile that indicates his psychic power?



Arakanis
09-05-2009, 23:03
So, I was doing a comparison of imperial psykers, and most of the big four librarians are described as rather elite badasses. You've got Mephiston, who basically overcame the flaws of his geneseed, something that no other Blood Angel (Or Astartes, AFAIK) has ever done. And he has increased strength, toughness, and may always cast all his powers every turn.

You've got Ezekiel, who apparently turns peoples brains to mush, and knows the mind and heart of everyone he turns his eye upon. In the game, he's powerful to actually shatter the minds of Chaos Space Marines, Tyranid Hive Tyrants, Dark Eldar Archons, and shockingly, even Necrons, Greater Daemons and C'tan.

I recall the Stormcaller guy having something that was ridiculously crazy too, but what does Tigurius get in game to show that he's the most powerful psyker in the Imperium? He can use three powers a turn, but a lot of Psykers can do that. Mephi can cast 4, I believe. He knows nine different powers, which is definitely something, but I don't really think it shows his potency as described. Is there some rule or stat that I'm missing that elevates him above the Sane Death Company Librarian or the Man Who Makes Gods Repent?

TheBigBadWolf
09-05-2009, 23:22
Tigurius touched the Hive Mind and survived, I think that shows his power.

But in game, he gets to use any librarian powers after deployment, and double range on them too

massey
09-05-2009, 23:22
Nope. Librarians got toned down in the newest Space Marine book.

TheBigBadWolf
09-05-2009, 23:25
I need to pick it up sometime, I thought it had changed but couldnt remember.

Maidel
09-05-2009, 23:40
Just having a look at them - mephiston is truely scary - better stats than dante! and CHEAPER in points can use 3 per turn has artificer armour, plasma pistol and force weapon

Ezekiel gets stats inbetween the other two, makes the other troops around him fearless gets the artificer armour and master crafted force weapon and is way cheaper than both the others.

Tigurius gets more choice psyhic powers to choose from but has crap stats..

Yea - he got screwed in this version - the other two are much better options - both the others have better stats and one is much cheaper and the other is slightly cheaper and awesome in combat.


EDIT - I just checked the previous version - he was WAY cheaper, had better stats AND had all the double range stuff. Jeeze he got shafted.

Warforger
10-05-2009, 04:53
Nah, not really, last ed he was used in power builds for infiltrating command squads then a 24" range power that makes untis fall back.

This edition he's able to use up to 3 powers and has every SM power, so he can get a 5+ invulnerable, I10 and S6 power weapon if he passes his psychic tests.

Elessar
10-05-2009, 18:44
I recall the Stormcaller guy having something that was ridiculously crazy too, but what does Tigurius get in game to show that he's the most powerful psyker in the Imperium?

Most powerful psyker in the Imperium? I think the Emperor might have something to say about that....

Mr Zoat
10-05-2009, 18:51
Most powerful psyker in the Imperium? I think the Emperor might have something to say about that....

That guy does even less than the chaos primarchs.

Neftus
10-05-2009, 19:01
Because he's not Calgar

Surgency
10-05-2009, 19:04
Just having a look at them - mephiston is truely scary - better stats than dante! and CHEAPER in points can use 3 per turn has artificer armour, plasma pistol and force weapon

Ezekiel gets stats inbetween the other two, makes the other troops around him fearless gets the artificer armour and master crafted force weapon and is way cheaper than both the others.

Tigurius gets more choice psyhic powers to choose from but has crap stats..

Yea - he got screwed in this version - the other two are much better options - both the others have better stats and one is much cheaper and the other is slightly cheaper and awesome in combat.


EDIT - I just checked the previous version - he was WAY cheaper, had better stats AND had all the double range stuff. Jeeze he got shafted.

As opposed to the Codices in general, where DA and BA both get screwed by the amazingly better SM codex, in terms of characters, wargear, vehicles, and options ;)

captainramoz
10-05-2009, 19:42
Most powerful psyker in the Imperium? I think the Emperor might have something to say about that....
Most powerfull psyke alive:eyebrows:

shutupSHUTUP!!!
10-05-2009, 20:11
There's no indication that Mephiston was an exceptional psyker (even a normal marine Librarian is quite powerful however) until he fell to the black rage and came back. His psychic power seems to have been boosted beyond his natural talent. Either that or it might be that his strength is 50% psychic power and 50% mystical strength of Sanguinius or something.

Ezekial is a powerful psyker but as a Dark Angel he is probably somewhat specialized. He can't do everything as well as Tigurius but he might be superior in his chosen areas of expertise (psychic interrogation methods etc).

Tigurius is a powerful psyker in his own right and can do lots of things well. He clearly has plenty of raw power backed up by the intelligence and will to use it properly, hence the "most powerful" tag.

Maidel
10-05-2009, 20:23
Tigurius is a powerful psyker in his own right and can do lots of things well. He clearly has plenty of raw power backed up by the intelligence and will to use it properly, hence the "most powerful" tag.

Based on the 'in-game' rules, I think there is no doubt that he is the most powerful psyker - however, hes utterly screwed in the stats department AND he costs more than the other two.

Mephiston has better stats than a chapter master! AND can use three powers a turn (But more restricted than tigurius)

Brother Siccarius
10-05-2009, 20:28
You've got Mephiston, who basically overcame the flaws of his geneseed, something that no other Blood Angel (Or Astartes, AFAIK) has ever done.

Others have done it, Mephiston is just one of a small group who have.

I'd point out that every Space Wolf that doesn't go to the Wulfen has also overcome his geneseed's flaws.

shutupSHUTUP!!!
10-05-2009, 20:46
Mephiston is basically a Death Company marine all the time (without the insanity) with a portion of the strength of a primarch, backed up by the best equipment, has psychic powers and is in a chapter that encourages it's Librarians to be good in close combat. He is probably one of the most singularly deadly warriors in the entire astartes.

Tigurius on the other hand is a powerful psyker, there's no reason why he would be as physically powerful as Mephiston.

Maidel
10-05-2009, 21:02
Tigurius on the other hand is a powerful psyker, there's no reason why he would be as physically powerful as Mephiston.

very true - I just think by looking at it he gets royally screwed on points by comparason.

massey
10-05-2009, 22:29
In 2nd edition, Mephiston had the same stats as a Fantasy Vampire Lord, which is basically what he is.

Giganthrax
11-05-2009, 03:10
Tigurius grants the army the ability to reroll any reserve roll (even successful ones, I think).

I don't know if this has much (or anything) to do with his psychic powers, but it certainly is something unique for a psyker.

Alessander
11-05-2009, 06:23
didn't the fluff say he was able to predict a lot of important events as well? that reflects the reserve-reroll ability, fluffwise being able to predict what would delay a unit and passing on the info so they are able to circumvent the delay.

LexxBomb
11-05-2009, 07:54
tigurius is not the most powerful psycher in the Imperium (living or otherwise) its just Ultramarine propaganda

genestealer_baldric
11-05-2009, 08:22
he the most powerfull physker is based on he surposedly taped into the hive mind, there is no proof. He did get good at predicting there targets but thats all he making educated guesses i think even the Big E would get at least a very bad headache if the tapped into the hive mind.

As to the topic in question, i think that the hive mind decteced his intrusion and have now got there very own ultramarine puppet which will spring into action when needed to help in the next attack on ultras

NightrawenII
11-05-2009, 09:23
Every time I see *most powerful psyker in the Imperium* I think poor Blood Ravens, they are chapter full of Psykers and they even dont have official Special Character.:rolleyes:

Arakanis
11-05-2009, 09:52
he the most powerfull physker is based on he surposedly taped into the hive mind, there is no proof. He did get good at predicting there targets but thats all he making educated guesses i think even the Big E would get at least a very bad headache if the tapped into the hive mind.

As to the topic in question, i think that the hive mind decteced his intrusion and have now got there very own ultramarine puppet which will spring into action when needed to help in the next attack on ultras

That or the entire Ultramar empire is just a huge genestealer cult. ;)

genestealer_baldric
11-05-2009, 09:55
That or the entire Ultramar empire is just a huge genestealer cult. ;)

thank you sir a new string in bow to wind up my local smurf player :D

Gdolkin
12-05-2009, 02:33
Others have done it, Mephiston is just one of a small group who have.

I'd point out that every Space Wolf that doesn't go to the Wulfen has also overcome his geneseed's flaws.
Good point about the Wolves, indeed, 'overcame his geneseed's flaws' could mean different things for individual marines within a chapter, between related chapters or across all chapters. An Imperial Fist or Black Templar who can choose tactical retreat over suicidal stubborness is 'overcoming his geneseed's flaws', or an Iron Hand who retains a shred of compassion or 'humanity', or a Raven Guard who didn't turn albino.. it's just more severe, definite and dangerous with the Wolves and the Blood Angels. They don't manifest destructive and obsessive personality traits, they turn into monsters.
So, who are these others who have come through the Black Rage sane and become more rather than less than they were? Has Lemartes succumbed? Tycho doesn't count, he never came back, right? I want it to be just Mephiston..
How exactly does it happen anyway? How long does it take after the first signs? Does one start having brief fits of Sanguinius delusions and furious violence between periods of normality, which gradually or rapidly get longer and more intense until you're lost to the Rage and the Thirst, only to be spared by death? Like, a Blood Angel goes into battle as normal, but with one knee or shoulder painted with black with a red cross to say "watch your brother, he's been acting a bit odd lately, staring and muttering.. he's not Death Company yet but today might be the tipping point"? How far out of it do you have to be to get painted all black and considered 'gone'?
I know really, it's "As the Chaplains chant the Mass of Doom, those whose eyes are glazed or speech slurred fall into the arms of the Death Company Chaplains and are taken away." So what, the Mass is a deliberate and effective psycho-doctrinated trigger to provoke any latent fits that might be brewing? That's handy.. I like the idea of Blood Angels being on the Chaplain's 'to watch' list for some time, and having the time to realise and be noble about the horror of what is happening to them.. Hum..

Kiras of the flame
12-05-2009, 03:49
Tigurius is noted as the most powerful space marine because of the incredible powers he uses outside the battlefield as well as the power of prediction most common in Eldar Farseers...
The rules FOR him however were made so you can field him as any special character for your own chapter... It's not that he displays his power in the game but the fact that his mind is on a higher plane than other chief librarians