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Motley
25-08-2009, 07:20
Anybody know how many Space Hulk sets GW made???
I read a couple of post saying that they sold around 3000 the firts hour and another one saying that in germany they sold 2000 in the firts day from a total of 7000 sets.

............................Anyone???

AndrewGPaul
25-08-2009, 07:28
Ease up on the question marks; there's a war on, and they're rationed. :)

Number I heard from my LGS owner was 80,000 worldwide.

Motley
25-08-2009, 07:32
Wow!! thats a really big "LIMITED EDITION" .............

Christine
25-08-2009, 07:35
Calm down kid. But think about it - 80,000 for the whole planet? Yeah that is kind of limited edition when you look at it from a global perspective.

Motley
25-08-2009, 07:44
Yes maybe your right ......but remenber that there is not that many countrys where you can buy this game so... you have to think in the real markets.. US, Europe, Japan, Australia .......i was thinking.. actually a little less than half of that, maybe 25000 sets. Or even less...
Im buying two sets becouse im going to send one to a friend in Venezuela and i think is going to be maybe the only one on that country....

Lord Malorne
25-08-2009, 08:03
If they have teh intarwebz then likely anyone can order it.

Znail
25-08-2009, 09:46
Ease up on the question marks; there's a war on, and they're rationed. :)

Number I heard from my LGS owner was 80,000 worldwide.

80'000 sounds possible, but still somewhat low, I would think somewhat over 100'000 realy. They supposedly had a crash on the website when they passed 25'000 preorders.

As for limited edition, even with 100'000 made so will that prevent SH from being a top selling board game as there are many games who sold more then that.

Narf
25-08-2009, 12:53
from what ive heard it breaks down somthing along these lines

UK - 20,000 (UK GW)
USA - 25,000 (USA GW)
Oz - 15,000 (warseer)
france - 7,000 (warseer)
germany - 7,000 (warseer)
spain - 7,000 (guess)


broken down thats around 60,000 as english language
with about 7,000 per each major language, notice you could also add, russian, chinese, japanese, maybe dutch (though most dutchi's can speak english) to this which would add another 42,000+, making the total around 102,000

though some of the american copies may also be in spanish, though only a small amount, maybe 10% of the 25,000 to appeal to the 2nd biggest language in the USA

i'd not be surprised if there are not a few polish-european copies, and copies for other smaller languages, though this may not be cost effective.

eriochrome
25-08-2009, 13:10
Remember that GW sales last fiscal year were 126M pounds so if you assume the average customer is spending 1000 pounds a year(high average due to outlier fanatics buying forgeworld titans like candy, I expect the median value to be more around 20-40 pounds per month) then they have 126,000 serious players. So at 80-100K copies they have more regular customers than they made copies of the game for. Will all their regular customers buy a copy, no. But will people who are not regular customers anymore buy a copy also probably.

Znail
25-08-2009, 15:49
There was some report from GW that they had around 750'000 customers, so not everyone needs to buy a copy.

As for languages so do most people in 'minor' countries speak english and actualy prefeer non-localised versions. Its mostly countries who aspire to having their language spread around the world that expect translations for everything.

AFnord
25-08-2009, 16:28
Last time i saw a localized gw based product they translated "goblin" into "troll", and troll into troll (correct translation of goblin would be "vätte") (and granted, it was a a computer game, dark omen for those interested), so i'm glad that they don't localize things like this over here. It never works out well.

starlight
25-08-2009, 16:34
There was some report from GW that they had around 750'000 customers, so not everyone needs to buy a copy.

I think you'll find that's the estimated number of *wargamers* out there, not *GW customers* (although they'd like to think so:p).

:)

The most reliable numbers I've heard are in the 65,000-100,000 range. Although there are quiet rumblings that they're actually doing *pre-orders+X%*, so it's anyone's guess unless they are actually part of the Space Hulk/GWUK Marketing team.

Znail
25-08-2009, 16:45
The most reliable numbers I've heard are in the 65,000-100,000 range. Although there are quiet rumblings that they're actually doing *pre-orders+X%*, so it's anyone's guess unless they are actually part of the Space Hulk/GWUK Marketing team.

I gave that theory a bit of thought and discarded it after that. There is too little time for them to actualy adapt the number of copies made to the pre-orders. I think they would need atleast a month more then now to do that. As it is now so do they just barely have time to do the distribution between the revelation of SH and the release date. There is simply no time to make any extras and get them out to stores in time for the release.

starlight
25-08-2009, 17:17
I meant as *final numbers*. Likely SH is still in actual production, but toward the end of the run, with the final numbers being determined based on how well it sells initially.

Dangersaurus
25-08-2009, 17:25
I really doubt that's possible with outsourced manufacturing.

EDIT: By possible, I mean feasible or sane on the manufacturer's part.

starlight
25-08-2009, 17:45
And when did that ever influence GW...? :eyebrows:



:p

Dangersaurus
25-08-2009, 18:08
And when did that ever influence GW...?

Always?

It seems to me that level of control over units produced would cost as much as simply producing more units than the projected demand and pulping the overrun.

starlight
25-08-2009, 18:12
As opposed to X units with optional Y and Z runs by 31 Aug 09...?

X = their most pessimistic
Y = their expected run
Z = their most optimistic run

They order X and potentially add Y and Z if preorder demand meets certain standards.

Dangersaurus
25-08-2009, 18:28
As opposed to X units with optional Y and Z runs by 31 Aug 09...?

X = their most pessimistic
Y = their expected run
Z = their most optimistic run

They order X and potentially add Y and Z if preorder demand meets certain standards.

Right. That's more feasible. I thought you were literally trying to say they were doing preorders+X.

eriochrome
25-08-2009, 18:31
As opposed to X units with optional Y and Z runs by 31 Aug 09...?

X = their most pessimistic
Y = their expected run
Z = their most optimistic run

They order X and potentially add Y and Z if preorder demand meets certain standards.

The only problem with that is that they probably have multiple different subcontractors making the components: 1-2 Company for box and card board, 1 company doing the books, 1 company doing the minis, and final one assembling the kits together. It is a lot easier to coordinate all that when you order Y ahead of time since more than likely when you want the increased level later a few of those component people will be busy and not able to get the items all together on time creating problems with storage of components and sub contractors wanting payment upon their completion.

I am sure they contracted for extra pieces after the initial run but I doubt those are at the same price point which means they make less profit on the later boxes making them less likely to order them. Look at a game like blood bowl they want like 80 bucks for it when it has the same boardgame stuff as a 10 dollar monopoly with maybe 25 dollars retail worth of gw minis but they probably only sell significantly less than 1K a year now I would guess.

Znail
25-08-2009, 20:11
The problem is that any extra units produced at this late date wont be in time for either delivery to shops for the release date or for preorders, wich makes it much less interesting from GW's perspective. They seem reluctant to have specialist games on the shelves of their shops at all, so they arent realy interested in keeping SH around for as long as possible, but want to sell alot in short time instead.

Souleater
25-08-2009, 20:32
Which brings the inevitable question: why not support them through their website?

Have the rules available for download and the miniatures ordered direct from MO. That way GW at least get all the profit.

starlight
25-08-2009, 20:50
So you would think...especially if they were smart enough to make the tiles/etc out of plastic and flog them separately as well... :( Heck the old Necromunda bulkheads were one of the most popular terrain pieces in the old Bitz system...it stands to reason that terrain at this level would be at least as popular. :)


Will they *ever* learn...? :(

Souleater
25-08-2009, 21:02
I would also see this as an excellent way of supporting the old crumblies -sorry, veteran players - such as myself.

I realise they want the colourful, shiney stuff in the High Street but I think they are missing a good opportunity by ignoring their old mail order roots.

But this is going off topic, like a badger trying to balance on a chocolate bar of the same name.

eriochrome
25-08-2009, 21:17
I do not believe GW goal is to support the old crumblies. Look at how bad the support is for the specialist games as is. Tons of content was lost in the website transition. Space Hulk is not even a game like Blood Bowl with tons of different groups to collect. Space Hulk is a good game because it is not complicated by all that stuff.

Should it be limited so more players can get it over time, no I do not think so, but GW understands that by making it limited they can accelerate the purchases thus banking all the profit without all the costs associated long term product lines.

Motley
25-08-2009, 22:25
Going back to topic, after reading more post im pretty sure that they did an average of 5000 copies for big sales countrys( US, UK, France, Germany) and maybe 3000 or 2000 for small sales countrys ( Spain, portugal, australia...)

eriochrome
26-08-2009, 12:53
The US and Britian have way more than 5000 copies. The US has about 1000 retail sites combining Indies with GW outlets. If each one can get 10 copies like my FLGS(one forum said his store ordered 25) then they have -5000 for direct and restock. It is certainly higher than 5K for US.

Znail
26-08-2009, 13:41
Motley's numbers doesnt add up pretty obviously as all countries arent equal in how much GW sells. This lis looks pretty accurate thou:

from what ive heard it breaks down somthing along these lines

UK - 20,000 (UK GW)
USA - 25,000 (USA GW)
Oz - 15,000 (warseer)
france - 7,000 (warseer)
germany - 7,000 (warseer)
spain - 7,000 (guess)


broken down thats around 60,000 as english language
with about 7,000 per each major language, notice you could also add, russian, chinese, japanese, maybe dutch (though most dutchi's can speak english) to this which would add another 42,000+, making the total around 102,000

though some of the american copies may also be in spanish, though only a small amount, maybe 10% of the 25,000 to appeal to the 2nd biggest language in the USA

i'd not be surprised if there are not a few polish-european copies, and copies for other smaller languages, though this may not be cost effective.

But I dont think the game is localised in every language there is. French, German and Spanish possibly Italian I think is probobly all there is as far as localisation goes. Most people that buy GW games will manage to understand one of those or English. But ofcourse, the other countries still need to recieve copies of the game so will add up to the total of games made. So I think that around 100'000 seems a good number.

static grass
26-08-2009, 16:59
My source tells me that they everyone who orders one will get one. But at the end of september they will no longer be sold.

Brother.Gabriel
26-08-2009, 19:43
According to my local store manager there has been 70,000 manufactured with 25,000 pencilled for the UK. Stores are getting between 30 to 100 copies for selling in store depending on how big that store is. These ones will be the only ones they ever get unless they sell out extreamly quickly and some are still left having not be sold by mail order or other countries etc....

We have been told to mail order it if you definatly want it as they won't guarentte one for the day and will be selling there copies on a first come first serve basis. Though you can put your name on a list of people that they will ring. I mentioned that people in some area of the country had been taking deposits the manager told me that head office has told them that Space Hulk will not be depositied and no store should be doing a deposit system. Thats why I have order mine though mail order.

Znail
26-08-2009, 21:00
Well, if you know you want it and live in US, UK and any other country where they currently have free mail delivery so is there little reason not to just pre-order instead of standing in line at a store later.

Melchor
27-08-2009, 04:38
In fact, with pre-order there is always a chance of getting it early. ;)

eriochrome
27-08-2009, 12:34
Well, if you know you want it and live in US, UK and any other country where they currently have free mail delivery so is there little reason not to just pre-order instead of standing in line at a store later.

Some people like to support their friendly local gaming store where the staff is nice and knowledgable and not always trying to up sale you on all the really crappy hobby supplies that gw makes.

Znail
27-08-2009, 14:33
Well, independent stores get so few copies that its not like they wont be able to sell all of them anyway.

Muncher666
27-08-2009, 14:48
Going back to topic, after reading more post im pretty sure that they did an average of 5000 copies for big sales countrys( US, UK, France, Germany) and maybe 3000 or 2000 for small sales countrys ( Spain, portugal, australia...)

Australia's hardly a small sales country mate. :P

Allan.

Starblayde
27-08-2009, 15:24
Spain, Germany, Italy, France etc got about 500 each, according to my Store source, which is about the same number available across all of London's stores.

Seems most of the guesses I've read here are an order of magnitude higher than the actual figures.

eriochrome
27-08-2009, 15:42
Spain, Germany, Italy, France etc got about 500 each, according to my Store source, which is about the same number available across all of London's stores.

Seems most of the guesses I've read here are an order of magnitude higher than the actual figures.

I am guessing your source is the one who is wrong(not saying other numbers are right). Searching on GW's german site has like 20+ stores around Berlin and 30+ around Hannover. I doubt that they are planning less than 10 boxes per store just counting the stores in 2 metro areas.

Starblayde
27-08-2009, 16:13
I am guessing your source is the one who is wrong(not saying other numbers are right). Searching on GW's german site has like 20+ stores around Berlin and 30+ around Hannover. I doubt that they are planning less than 10 boxes per store just counting the stores in 2 metro areas.

Note that GW Stores and Independent stockists of GW stuff are two different things entirely, though. There are three GW stores in Berlin, for instance, not 20+.

Znail
27-08-2009, 16:32
But the independent stores can order 15 copies and even my local toy store got 10, so I would expect any shop in a major city to order as many as alowed. I heared that actual GW stores got more then 15, one number mentioned was 70.

500 to each of the major language countries (Germany, France etc) is redicilously few and would make localisation very costly for that few sold.

Even 7000 underestimates the German market for Boardgames. Germany is very big on both making and buying boardgames with around 25% of the world production in boardgames. SH could help GW get a bigger foothold into Germany if they used it wisely.

abaddonseviltwin
27-08-2009, 18:42
I've no idea how many they made but talking to the manager in my local GW store, he said that the word going around the stores in the local area was that mail order was going to announce being sold out a day or two before the 5th and all stock was going to be moved to stores.
To me it seems like that's a lot of stock to keep in stores, unless they've already shifted a lot in preorders. But it does make some sort of sense, build up the hype, sell plenty without any real advertising (except a few t-shirts for Germany's Games Day) before the release, get people in the stores in the knowledge that if you want a copy, you've got to buy it there and then, because mail order are all out. Genius?

eriochrome
27-08-2009, 19:28
I've no idea how many they made but talking to the manager in my local GW store, he said that the word going around the stores in the local area was that mail order was going to announce being sold out a day or two before the 5th and all stock was going to be moved to stores.
To me it seems like that's a lot of stock to keep in stores, unless they've already shifted a lot in preorders. But it does make some sort of sense, build up the hype, sell plenty without any real advertising (except a few t-shirts for Germany's Games Day) before the release, get people in the stores in the knowledge that if you want a copy, you've got to buy it there and then, because mail order are all out. Genius?

Plus that drives foot traffic into stores. The only problem I see is that most of the GW stores are tiny and already filled with stuff. They do not really have room for storing tons of copies of space hulks unless they just stack them on their gaming tables.

snottlebocket
27-08-2009, 19:37
But the independent stores can order 15 copies and even my local toy store got 10, so I would expect any shop in a major city to order as many as alowed. I heared that actual GW stores got more then 15, one number mentioned was 70.

500 to each of the major language countries (Germany, France etc) is redicilously few and would make localisation very costly for that few sold.

Even 7000 underestimates the German market for Boardgames. Germany is very big on both making and buying boardgames with around 25% of the world production in boardgames. SH could help GW get a bigger foothold into Germany if they used it wisely.

Our local independant had the option of ordering up to 40 copies. He didn't though since he's never going to shift that many but still.

Mojaco
27-08-2009, 21:48
I heard the number of 70.000. Which seems more then enough to satisfy current need. Good, because now those @#$% that bought more just for the profit are going to have to sit it out before making money on their investment.

starlight
27-08-2009, 22:26
Speculation is not investing. :p

I'm getting three and they're all for ME! :evilgrin: Super Space Hulk in the hobby room! :) eBay gets *nuthin*! :p

Starblayde
28-08-2009, 07:37
Apparently my local (and quite small) GW store got fifty for their stock, of which 18 have been snapped up already in pre-orders, and they reckon that they'll all be gone within a couple of weeks. And, as they keep saying, 'when they're gone, they're gone!'

Danteng7
30-08-2009, 16:41
The number i got from my indie is that 10,000 is the total number produced worldwide.

Bassik
30-08-2009, 17:36
I allways thought the GW factory was like Willy Wonka's, only more awesome :(

dwarfhold13
30-08-2009, 21:07
I allways thought the GW factory was like Willy Wonka's, only more awesome :(

they even have a the game room.. where everything you can touch, you can play.. i mean it.. everything in there is playable, i mean you can play it!

don't know if they know what snozberrys are though

eriochrome
31-08-2009, 03:16
The number i got from my indie is that 10,000 is the total number produced worldwide.

Far to low. If it was that low it would be sold out already.

Danteng7
31-08-2009, 08:37
Far to low. If it was that low it would be sold out already.

Yeah. I thought its quite low too but his news are pretty reliable.

But nobody will know for sure whats the total unless GW disclose it. No matter, those who wants it has already ordered theirs, so nobody loses out due to the limited number of copies.

Znail
31-08-2009, 10:03
The number i got from my indie is that 10,000 is the total number produced worldwide.


Far to low. If it was that low it would be sold out already.


Yeah. I thought its quite low too but his news are pretty reliable.

But nobody will know for sure whats the total unless GW disclose it. No matter, those who wants it has already ordered theirs, so nobody loses out due to the limited number of copies.

I would be a bit more sceptical about his news in the future. 10'000 is far to low to be even realistic. We got some 300+ GW stores, 1000+ indy partner stores and online pre-orders. The numbers for the GW stores we heared so far is 50-70 and for indi stores 10-40. We also got some inside news that they got 3'000 pre-orders in the first hour or so and got past 25'000 after a couple of days. Simply put, 10'000 doesnt even cover GW stores, Indi stores or online pre-orders individualy, much less combined.

eriochrome
02-09-2009, 17:20
I've no idea how many they made but talking to the manager in my local GW store, he said that the word going around the stores in the local area was that mail order was going to announce being sold out a day or two before the 5th and all stock was going to be moved to stores.
To me it seems like that's a lot of stock to keep in stores, unless they've already shifted a lot in preorders. But it does make some sort of sense, build up the hype, sell plenty without any real advertising (except a few t-shirts for Germany's Games Day) before the release, get people in the stores in the knowledge that if you want a copy, you've got to buy it there and then, because mail order are all out. Genius?

Looks like you were right on with this. That is exactly what they did. Maybe the stores are getting tons or copies. Maybe only a few more than there orders. Time will tell.

Starblayde
02-09-2009, 21:35
Two days ago my local store had 4 left out of the 50 they were given, so that's testament to lots of people parting with £60, at least, hehe.

Souleater
03-09-2009, 19:11
My nearest GW store (which is tiny) is being sent eighty copies plus their pre-orders.

eriochrome
03-09-2009, 19:41
My nearest GW store (which is tiny) is being sent eighty copies.

Plus Preorders probably. Very limited it appears.

Souleater
03-09-2009, 19:43
Yeah, I'll edit that.

Gargobot
03-09-2009, 20:03
If you check out these countries of the GW Website: UK, Belgium, Denmark, Finland, Ireland, Netherlands, Norway, Sweden. They all say it's sold out in the respective countries.
So I don't have a number, but it seems limited edition is an honest statement.