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peculiar interloper
06-09-2009, 11:16
Hello,



I found releasing brother Claudio from the sprue to be tricky as one of the mold 'flow paths' was attached to one of his lightning claw claws.

Because the model was at one location attached to the sprue with it's lightning claw, it's very easy to destroy this claw either by clipping or 'twist-turning' the model.

For the rest I haven't seen any problem locations with the sprue, but I'm still releasing the models from the mold.


The models seem to be made in true 40k spirit by the way of the CAD CAM system which is in a sense much like a STC. I'm sure 3D printers were used.


greetings,

jullevi
06-09-2009, 11:41
For tricky parts you might want to leave a bit of sprue to be removed later, ie. not until you have removed the figure from the frame. If you didn't understand what I meant, take a look at this blog (http://www.boardgamegeek.com/thread/439555) and how the poster removed C.A.T from the sprue.

peculiar interloper
06-09-2009, 12:04
I understand what you mean perfectly, I've been pulling models out of molds since 1999.

What I mean is that the claw is an especially delicate point that needs [I]extra[I] attention. Even if you leave a bit of mold to the claw, you still need to cut it away using as little force possible because you might bend it or accidentally cut it away.

ceimeifukan
06-09-2009, 14:40
yeah I found that and Lorenzo's cloak to be the most tricky, actually ended up snapping one of the dangly bits trying to get it out.

Tymell
06-09-2009, 16:50
I got my copy yesterday, and I've noticed this on lots of things. Not just pieces breaking when snipped, but other sections where it's the opposite: the join to the sprue is so big you need a saw to get it off.

The game might be great, but I have to say the sprues themselves are utterly atrocious in quality. Joins at bad points that result in broken models and peg joints; big lumpy joins that I need a hacksaw to get through; just plain oddly placed ones that are fiddly to get rid of. Bad show GW.

Sergeant Lorenzo is the worst. One join on a sword that nearly broke, one on his tiny little chalice with wings that -did- break, one on his side that is so hard to get at, ones on his base that I'm hacking away at right now, and one on his gun arm peg which snapped.

Rabid Bunny 666
06-09-2009, 17:30
With Brother Claudio, i pust my needle file directly under the join between the claw and sprue, it prevented it from bending. The only model I had was with sergenat Lorenzo, clipping his torso off the sprue warped the ring around his head, so i'll need to resculpt that.

squilverine
06-09-2009, 19:09
I was lucky enough to avoid and breaks or snaps, but did have a couple of close calls, maily with Sergeant Lorenzo and brother Claudio.

My best advice for the more difficult parts it not to use clippers, use a very sharp scalpel/knife and use it in a sawing action.

peculiar interloper
07-09-2009, 18:48
I think the oddly placed & shaped sprue clip-off points has everthing to do with how these models were made.

I'm close to sure model design was done 95% with computer aided design and machining programs (CAD CAM's).

If one observes the complete models closely one sees that when trimmed & cleaned properly the seperate parts that make up a single model are in fact *very* close fits. Lorenzo's cape for example. The relatively new plastic terminator lord for example, doesn't fit as close. The mold lines of the models are also very deliberate, only on places where you don't notice them, on sharp edges for example, or on flat surfaces where they are easely filed off. There is the odd exeption ofcourse, ribly edges on the thunder hammer spring to mind.
What I mean by all this is that because of this heavy use of CAD CAM systems great detail was achieved by placing sprue flow's (clip off points) at the most optimum position for the optimum depositing of molten plastic. This comes at a cost ofcourse.

CMDante
07-09-2009, 19:31
I got my copy yesterday, and I've noticed this on lots of things. Not just pieces breaking when snipped, but other sections where it's the opposite: the join to the sprue is so big you need a saw to get it off.

The game might be great, but I have to say the sprues themselves are utterly atrocious in quality. Joins at bad points that result in broken models and peg joints; big lumpy joins that I need a hacksaw to get through; just plain oddly placed ones that are fiddly to get rid of. Bad show GW.

Sergeant Lorenzo is the worst. One join on a sword that nearly broke, one on his tiny little chalice with wings that -did- break, one on his side that is so hard to get at, ones on his base that I'm hacking away at right now, and one on his gun arm peg which snapped.


Your kidding right?! These are some of the best frames GW has ever made. Have you ever seen any company mass produce 2-3 piece figures with such crisp detaila and on so few frames? Don't blame the frames if you mess up your mini's. Take some time and get the right tools for the job.

I use some 800 grit wet/dry paper for really delicate sanding and a fresh scalpel blade and there isn't a problem.

The right tools for the job make all the difference.

BaronVonSnakPak
07-09-2009, 22:49
i didnt have a problem removing claudio from the mold, my problem was with lorenzo and his cape and the winged chalice above his head.

tymell: i suggest using clippers for removing the bases from the sprue. it takes a second and then some minor leveling with a hobby knife.

Tymell
07-09-2009, 23:07
Your kidding right?! These are some of the best frames GW has ever made. Have you ever seen any company mass produce 2-3 piece figures with such crisp detaila and on so few frames? Don't blame the frames if you mess up your mini's. Take some time and get the right tools for the job.

The detail really has no relevance to my point: I'm complaining about the -frames- and the way they work, not the models. The models are intense. The frames feel badly planned and produced.

I've had over 10 years of experience, and never had anything LIKE this level of trouble. And I've collected plenty of useful tools over those years.

CMDante
07-09-2009, 23:14
My point on the detail is perfectly applicable to your complaint about the frames, at the end of the day the layout of the mini's on the frames is determined by the angles the parts need to be at in order to have the detail cast correctly. Unfortunately in a few areas this has led to some unusual extending of detail (Scipio's trailing foot for example).

The frame doesn't appear to me to be any more difficult to deal with than most other GW kits. I'm pretty sure the guys who create the frames at GW are skilled enough at their job to have made the best of them given the detail on the figures and the sheer number on 1 frame (2 if you include the Librarian frame).

Basically, I think these are anything but bad frames but we are all entitled to our own opinions.

Tymell
07-09-2009, 23:18
Details effect frames, but just because they're highly-detailed is no excuse for poor layout. Some of the models in the box are just fine, and are just as detailed as the rest. But others, like Lorenzo, are an absolute nightmare.

AndrewGPaul
08-09-2009, 00:07
What was the problem with Lorenzo? Mine came away no problem, and all the mould lines and attachment points cleaned up fine. Some of the parts are joined at small areas, true, but no worse than other minis I've assembled.

LostTemplar
08-09-2009, 00:29
I used a plier to remove all pieces from the sprue and then removed any excedent bits. the only damage i had was on the flamer, Zael, who will have a bolt mark on one of his leg protection armour bits.

But i was impressed ad the closeness of the models to the spure and the compact sprue, aswell as the requirement for specialized tools to remove all parts.

wilsongrahams
10-09-2009, 19:49
I had no trouble either but then I've been working on plastic kits for twenty years. A pair of thin wire cutters usually suffice with a sharp scalpel - not a craft knife - you can even use a razor saw. I rarley use a file to clean up a mini apart from under the feet / bases. Careful use of a scalpel along all the muld lines makes them even better after priming and painting too.

Anyone that pulls models off the sprue can expect breakage!

Bookwrak
10-09-2009, 23:28
I remember a while back a poster complaining bitterly about the plastic quality GW uses, because breaking and twisting the models off the sprue tore chunks out of them, or left protrusions, and how did everyone else cover it up?

I just use a set of dedicated sprue clippers, which is why I've never had an opportunity to post in the 'so I almost sliced my finger off one day' threads.

torn
10-09-2009, 23:50
I remember a while back a poster complaining bitterly about the plastic quality GW uses, because breaking and twisting the models off the sprue tore chunks out of them, or left protrusions, and how did everyone else cover it up?

I just use a set of dedicated sprue clippers, which is why I've never had an opportunity to post in the 'so I almost sliced my finger off one day' threads.

i think this is one of the reasons GW arent making games to cater for the regular boardgamer any more. Ive been making plastic model kits for 20 years and i found some of the marines quite difficult, or at least time consuming, even with the proper tools.

A regular board gamer who is possibly unequipped with any tools would struggle to get the pieces out in any fit shape.

just as an afterthought to this issue - if GW (or fantasy flight games) were to now re-release space hulk they could do it using push out card pieces rather than plastic. easier for regular board gamers, and anyone wanting to use miniatures can then go into a GW store and buy some. everyone wins.

strewart
11-09-2009, 05:51
You have to remember there is a big limitation on the sprues as well, due to the peg joints (and the pegs are actually quite long not short) the only way the peg-holes can be aligned on the sprue is facing directly up or directly down or the hole won't form and the mold won't come off the plastic. With this limitation in mind, and that they wanted the sprues relatively flat (you notice a lot of the models, especially nids, do look a little bit squished and flat) I think they did a fantastic job to get everything to go together so well.

Some of the sprue connections were quite large, but I had no trouble getting the models off. Clip a small chunk of sprue off with them then carefully cut away at it with a scalpel.

Chip Dakalo
26-12-2009, 00:46
If one observes the complete models closely one sees that when trimmed & cleaned properly the seperate parts that make up a single model are in fact *very* close fits. Lorenzo's cape for example.

They are so close that I have problem with Lorenzos cape piece. It seems that I cannot get the piece to go all the way into the joint. The arm looks good, but the cape does not seem to be in place, its a millimetre up and this creates really unwanted effect. I am not very good on assembling models so this is quite a challence.

BTW, my box has two of the same type of genestealer frames (+1 different):
-1 frame which has the Broodlord and 5 door bases in a straight line on one side of the frame
-2 identical frames which have a 'stealer emerging underneath the floor and 5 door bases grouped on one corner of the frame

Is this correct or should there be 3 different frames of 'stealers?

strewart
26-12-2009, 04:21
Its correct, two of the nid sprues are the same. Some of the marines are hard to push completely together, you really need to get the angle perfect and put pressure at the right place. Don't be afraid to trim down the peg a bit.

HaunterV
29-12-2009, 02:38
a stealer lost a hand :S