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ml2sjw
04-10-2009, 13:02
Playing around with a campaign to reintoroduce Hybrids to the game, thought I'd bounce the thoughts we have been having off you lot. Main aim is the classic aim for all starship boarding games and recreate the first scene of StarWars.

Any how rough sketch of the rules.

1.) As a blip move exaclty the same as stealers

2.) Once converted from a blip move shoot etc exactly the same as a terminator

3.) Require a 5+ to hit

4.) Only armed with small arms bolters, autoguns and the like one D6 to hit requiring a 6 to kill. No sustained fire bonus.

3.) D6 -2 in Closecombat


New Actions

1. Can't go onto overwatch, requires discipline ammuntion yadda yadda yadda, real reason stops players getting into a stale mate.

2. Shoot then move, 1 AP model shoots then moves. Subtle but important difference, allows a model to shoot then duck behind a corner.

Thoughts?

Patriarch
04-10-2009, 14:00
My suggestions:
5 APs (faster than a human, slower than a stealer)
Move as a stealer unless armed with heavy weapon. All Hybrids can guard.
1d6 in close assault (but see below)
Marines add +1 when attempting to kill a Hybrid (so storm bolters kill on 5+/4+, assault cannon on 4+/3+, flamer & psychic storm kill automatically; all marines gain an extra +1 in close assault).
Weapons:
Power weapon - +1 to close combat (making them equal to a normal terminator) and allows parry.
Bolter - single dice, can sustain and overwatch BUT the base number to kill a terminator is 7. To score a 7, you need to roll a 6, and then immediately roll a 4+. This lowers to 6 if you sustain. (Reason is, Terminators are much harder to shoot than a stealer, and also prevents overwatch stalemate - hybrids will nearly always lose to storm bolter marines).
Missile Launcher - 2APs to fire, cannot be combined with movement. Unlimited range. Kills a marine or door on 3+; or can fire a frag missile: section effect which kills marines on a 6, stealers on a 5+ and hybrids on a 4+. No overwatch or sustained. Hybrids armed with missile launchers still have 5APs but move like Terminators.

There are other, more exotic weapons but I'd see how these go.

thefan
04-10-2009, 16:11
Why can't you just use the rules from the Genestealer expansion from 1st edit?? :)

Patriarch
04-10-2009, 19:51
Without the psychic rules, there is very little reason for the Stealer player to take hybrids as per 1st ed - they are slow, very squishy, and unless they are shooting at LC or TH marines, they are usually hopelessly outclassed. There is no reason for the stealer player to take them unless he is forced to (which some non-psychic missions did), as purestrains were better in most respects.

A bolter hybrid using 1st ed rules is a bit less useless, but only because 1st ed bolters and storm bolters were too good against terminators IMO (1 in 6 and 11/36 chance of killing a terminator with one shot - same as against a purestrain stealer, and much better odds than in 40k).

If you wanted to try these, you might use a blip substitute system like with the Broodlord: a 1-blip becomes 2 hybrids with power swords; a 2-blip can be a single bolter hybrid; a 3-blip can be a single hybrid with missile launcher.

thefan
04-10-2009, 20:27
I WANT THE BEAMA!!! ( in my best Arnald voice) A group I played with a long long time ago agreed that the converision beamer was one of the coolest weapons the hybrids had. It was like kryptonit to the termies. A really good chance of taking a termie out instantly. A game changer. Step out for one, termie shoots misses. Shoot for 2 roll anything but a 1 and your dust. OUCH!!! Unlimited range too. Made for some really fun games.

Don

grg3d
05-10-2009, 16:03
Hybrids with weapons are not as good as pure strain :wtf:

bolt pistol 6+to kill / range 12/ 1d6 / +1 to H to H / sustain fire
bolter 6+ to kill / range UL /1d6 / sustain fire
heavy bolter 6+ to kill/ range UL/2d6/ sustain fire
plasma pistol 3+ to kill / range 12/move and shoot 1AP
plasma gun 3+ to kill /1d6 / range UL/ move and shoot 1AP
heavy plasma gun / heavy flamer about the same 1d6 2+ to kill /section
laz cannon 2+ to kill /range UL/ 1d6
auto cannon 5 + to kill/ range UL/ 1d6/1 ap to shoot/sustain fire
The conversion beamer 2+ to kill /range UL/ 1d6


Plasma gun.....The preferred weapon of Hybrids, move and shoot before you can spend CP or do overwatch shooting...

Patriarch
05-10-2009, 19:29
Hybrids with weapons are not as good as pure strain :wtf:

bolt pistol 6+to kill / range 12/ 1d6 / +1 to H to H / sustain fire
bolter 6+ to kill / range UL /1d6 / sustain fire
heavy bolter 6+ to kill/ range UL/2d6/ sustain fire
plasma pistol 3+ to kill / range 12/move and shoot 1AP
plasma gun 3+ to kill /1d6 / range UL/ move and shoot 1AP
heavy plasma gun / heavy flamer about the same 1d6 2+ to kill /section
laz cannon 2+ to kill /range UL/ 1d6
auto cannon 5 + to kill/ range UL/ 1d6/1 ap to shoot/sustain fire
The conversion beamer 2+ to kill /range UL/ 1d6


Plasma gun.....The preferred weapon of Hybrids, move and shoot before you can spend CP or do overwatch shooting...


Space marine with Storm Bolter - kill a hybrid on 4+ on either dice (before sustaining).

Since the heavy weapons needed to be moved into place before firing, the marine usually had opportunity to overwatch fire (or use a CP for an unlimited range shot) to kill the hybrid before it had chance to fire. In order to be sucessful with this, the hybrid had to a) target close assault Terminators b) shoot from the side/rear c) be lucky d) be psychic, so it could use an aura e) set up and shoot over 12 squares away from a marine who has run out of CPs. 95% of my successful hybrids were the d) type, no matter what they were armed with.

Plasma gun I'll grant was pretty good, except that you were only allowed one shot per two turns.

grg3d
05-10-2009, 20:33
I agree
but
just the thought of having to face hybrids with ranged weapons made the marines act differently....its hard to fight a bullet :D

thefan
05-10-2009, 21:04
I have to agree with last 2 posters. The hybrids with weapons did put the HMMM in the game. You never knew what was going to come out of the blips on the board. Makes for some tense moments. Purestain are nasty but range weapons against a stationary target suck too. Especially after a overwatch shot.