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tu33y
13-10-2009, 12:45
bugmans bar. me and my mate were in there last sunday. we sat talking about the decor (which is pretty awesome) and the bar selection (ditto) and that if GW looked into franchising the Bugamans Bar experience it might do ok. there are LOTS of empty pubs in the UK right now, even in town centres. A bugmans bar, with a very small discrete model cabinet in the corner selling Bugmans merchandise and even box sets (at off peak times obviously) would in the very least break even if you did food and had special beardy "real ale" pumps, maybe local and GW own micro brewers etc?

for those who immediatley poo-poo this idea think of A; the Pit and Pendulum in Nottingham which is laid out like the Addams Family House inside (and is awesome to the maxx- the toilets are behind a swinging bookcase secret passage style- true) and the Flowerpot in Derby which does really well by selling beer with twigs in it.

i dont see one on every street corner but a small number of bugman cloned bars would be in the very least worth looking into by GW.

what do you all think?

here is the inside of the Pit and Pendulum for those not familiar with the coolest pub in Nottingham
http://blog.white-uk.net/wp-content/uploads/2009/05/pit_and_pendulum.jpg

rich1231
13-10-2009, 12:54
mad as a mad thing bought from a shop called mad on mad street

Jedi152
13-10-2009, 12:56
Maybe. Hobgoblin ales seem to have established a foothold.

P&P is indeed awesome, although i've walked past the Flowerpot hundreds of times i've never been in.

Mannimarco
13-10-2009, 12:57
indeed it would be awesome however 40k is a niche hobby as is, there are more and more minors getting involved and fewer older people (and the minors cant even be in a building with an alcohol liscence unless with an adult)

pubs have always been a great survivor during economic downturns however more and more pubs and clubs are closing down, you only need to look at the stats to see just how many have closed down over the past year, if mainstream pubs and clubs cant survive today then i doubt a bugmans franchise would

the fact that its different would see get some people in to start with but eventually people would just go back to the way they were as the novelty wears off

tu33y
13-10-2009, 13:03
im not saying its a key sales outlet, infact the model sales would be very low. im just thinking it wouldbe wroth diversifying into the industry and using some of their IP. real ale bars with conservative music playing will always draw a crowd. you dont need to link it too closely with warhammer- just have it as a 'fantasy' themed bar that sells WD on the bar.

it would bring decent group income in with an acceptable outlay.

CaptainSenioris
13-10-2009, 13:23
A lot of these empty pubs are empty due to being in a poor location with little local business. Not the best place to make a start.

blongbling
13-10-2009, 13:24
bugmans bar. me and my mate were in there last sunday. we sat talking about the decor (which is pretty awesome) and the bar selection (ditto) and that if GW looked into franchising the Bugamans Bar experience it might do ok. there are LOTS of empty pubs in the UK right now, even in town centres. A bugmans bar, with a very small discrete model cabinet in the corner selling Bugmans merchandise and even box sets (at off peak times obviously) would in the very least break even if you did food and had special beardy "real ale" pumps, maybe local and GW own micro brewers etc?

for those who immediatley poo-poo this idea think of A; the Pit and Pendulum in Nottingham which is laid out like the Addams Family House inside (and is awesome to the maxx- the toilets are behind a swinging bookcase secret passage style- true) and the Flowerpot in Derby which does really well by selling beer with twigs in it.

i dont see one on every street corner but a small number of bugman cloned bars would be in the very least worth looking into by GW.

what do you all think?

here is the inside of the Pit and Pendulum for those not familiar with the coolest pub in Nottingham


Mad an idea as I have ever seen. GW wont even franchise its stores let alone something like a bar that would be open to even more abuse and damage to its reputation.

I think you either dont go to enough pubs to understand what you need to do to be succesful in the bar industry or you are just whoefully niave in what it takes to run a succesful business.


im not saying its a key sales outlet, infact the model sales would be very low. im just thinking it wouldbe wroth diversifying into the industry and using some of their IP. real ale bars with conservative music playing will always draw a crowd. you dont need to link it too closely with warhammer- just have it as a 'fantasy' themed bar that sells WD on the bar.

it would bring decent group income in with an acceptable outlay.

And that is exactly why pubs are going out of business left right and centre, that type of pub doesnt generate enough money to sustain itself anymore and shows why this model wouldnt work.

grissom2006
13-10-2009, 14:35
im not saying its a key sales outlet, infact the model sales would be very low. im just thinking it wouldbe wroth diversifying into the industry and using some of their IP. real ale bars with conservative music playing will always draw a crowd. you dont need to link it too closely with warhammer- just have it as a 'fantasy' themed bar that sells WD on the bar.

it would bring decent group income in with an acceptable outlay.

These types of bars appeal to a select few people to few to run a business off it's business suicide thats been done a million times over. Consider this GW as a Hobby won't account for more than 25% of the population and out of that those in it will be mostly kids. Take the adults of my local GW who pass through the door in a given month and i'd have oh maybe 30 customers hardly going to float a business is it.

xowainx
13-10-2009, 15:09
A lot of these empty pubs are empty due to being in a poor location with little local business. Not the best place to make a start.

Quite, the pub industry is dying at the moment due to a combination of factors, branching out into it with a niche selling point would be commercial suicide.

Tohellweride
13-10-2009, 15:27
They tried the GW record label back in the early 90`s and that died on its ass. They need to stick to what they do best. The only up side of this i could see is that people could not complain White Dwarf is a kids mag as they would have a Pub location page. ;)

squilverine
13-10-2009, 15:42
Whilst in principle it is a cool idea, for those who don't know or understand GW and the Dwarf imagery it would be easily mistaken for Norse/Viking, which in turn conjures images of rowdy behavour and fighting. Not good for a bar where the target customer is a geek!

GW stores have trouble packing in customers and most of them are well under 18, unfortuanatly the idea is a little too specific, also I doubt GW would want to associate themselves with the alcohol industry as there are too many opportunities for negative PR, given that GW struggle to convince most middle class parents that they aren't glorifying violence the idea of them trying to sell booze to their darling Benedict and Cordelia would have the Citroen Piccaso driving masses reaching for the nearest pitchfork.

This coupled with the fact that the pub industry is going through very testing times at the moment. Tax on beer has made running a pub which doesn't sell food nigh on impossible, cheap supermarket booze and the smoking ban have encouraged more drinkers to stay at home and the recession coupled with greedy breweries/pub management companies are slowly squeezing any profit left out of the business.

Llew
13-10-2009, 16:19
I always thought (barring good, old-fashioned alcoholism) the best reason to go to a bar was to drink and hope to meet girls.

It would seem like this franchise would cut off half of that equation. ;)

tu33y
13-10-2009, 16:24
ho hum. as usual trying to inject a bit of positivity and light heartedness with bluesky thinking into warseer and it turns into a flame attck and being called niave.

just one point tho- its theme pubs that are survivng the pub industry downturn, its the run of the mill standard estate pubs tha suffer. but some very good points from amny of you!

simonr1978
13-10-2009, 16:26
These types of bars appeal to a select few people to few to run a business off it's business suicide thats been done a million times over. Consider this GW as a Hobby won't account for more than 25% of the population and out of that those in it will be mostly kids. Take the adults of my local GW who pass through the door in a given month and i'd have oh maybe 30 customers hardly going to float a business is it.

I'd be very surprised if anywhere near 1/4 of the population had been wargamers of any description at any point during their life - if I were to pick a number I'd imagine those in the GW hobby would probably account for nearer 1 or 2% tops with around a 3-1 ratio of under 18s to adults.

Our own little wargames/rpg club at school had maybe 7 or 8 attendees in a school of around 400 pupils and sixth formers.

grissom2006
13-10-2009, 16:34
I'd be very surprised if anywhere near 1/4 of the population had been wargamers of any description at any point during their life - if I were to pick a number I'd imagine those in the GW hobby would probably account for nearer 1 or 2% tops with around a 3-1 ratio of under 18s to adults.

Our own little wargames/rpg club at school had maybe 7 or 8 attendees in a school of around 400 pupils and sixth formers.

The figure was only used as a example and i know it's not a realistic one.
Will say this your schools ratio is a low one to when i was in school we easily had over a 100 gamers and that school had 500 pupils.

pookie
13-10-2009, 16:34
well its certainly a 2intresting" idea.

But there is a very good reason why all these pubs/clubs etc are closing, people for many reasons are not going out as much any more, and with the pub being even more Niche than some real ale type pubs etc then i cant see it lasting more than its first month.

rich1231
13-10-2009, 17:32
Active gamers are less than 2% of population.

You might have noticed that Miniatures gaming is considered a bit sad by many. Can you imagine how difficult it would be to attract non gamers into your pub/bar?

75hastings69
13-10-2009, 17:42
Genuinely a terrible idea, mainstream pubs and clubs are closing at a shocking rate, a pub themed at around 2% of the populous would be suicide.

BigRob
13-10-2009, 17:51
Now if this Bugmans Bar was located in the Battle Bunker stores then the vets nights would indeed be something to go to, epecially because then there would be no kiddies.

The local wargames club meets in the British Legion and the fact that there is a bar is a big pull for the older gamer.

rich1231
13-10-2009, 17:55
Big Rob, you are US based yes?

Battle bunkers dont exist in the UK... so it might just be possible.

But in the UK it would fail and fail quickly.

Sith Monkey
13-10-2009, 17:58
Maybe. Hobgoblin ales seem to have established a foothold.

P&P is indeed awesome, although i've walked past the Flowerpot hundreds of times i've never been in.

Hobgoblin is one of the finest ales around, now if there ever where a Bugmans pub with an open fire and serving wenches, i think i'd spend a few happy hours there.

BigRob
13-10-2009, 19:49
Big Rob, you are US based yes?

Battle bunkers dont exist in the UK... so it might just be possible.

But in the UK it would fail and fail quickly.

No I'm UK, I just didnt realise the bunker things was US only since they were advertised all over our White Dwarf a while back.

Total Fail? I don't know about that, obviously the whole thread suggests pubs are not a viable buisness at the moment, but the idea of a Gamers pub would be something I'd be interested in If I was rich enough not to mind the loss.

But then I'd buy a Dampervan if I could.

75hastings69
13-10-2009, 19:55
Now if this Bugmans Bar was located in the Battle Bunker stores then the vets nights would indeed be something to go to, epecially because then there would be no kiddies.

The local wargames club meets in the British Legion and the fact that there is a bar is a big pull for the older gamer.

I think any establishment looking to make a profit and hence staying in buisiness by selling to a small crowd on one night a week would be unrealistic.

Sadly this thread is pretty much pointless as it is nowhere near a viable buisiness opportunity, as interesting as the concept may seem to us few that are into wargaming etc.

As Duncan Ballantyne would say "I'm out!"

rich1231
13-10-2009, 20:00
Hmmm bars can lose alot of money very quickly. I know some very succesful bar and club owners. All their niche locations are dead as a dodo and lost them fortunes. If you narrow your market to gamers for drinking etc.. you wil lose lots.

People dont travel long distances in the UK for a Pub. So your gamer and spouse footprint is small. Your market is small. Then your product will actively put off much of the mainstream market. I think its safe to safe its an idea that sounds cool but as soon as reality pokes its sneaky head in it all goes a little erm brown and moist.

static grass
14-10-2009, 13:59
I don't know how I would explain to my wife I was going to the warhammer pub. Maybe Harry does?

Will there be LARP weapons?

... and dragonforce? (they are great live btw)

sigur
14-10-2009, 14:21
Clearly setting the target group for entering the hobby to 8 to 16 year olds and then starting to run pubs? This is an awesome idea!

Seriously, GW should make miniature wargames not whore out IPs. Apart from the fact that it would make me sick (which happens most of the time when companies decide to sell their "IP"s out to random crap) there are so many reasons why this idea is just plain bad. They are established on their market (well, they actually more or less created the market) but that's no reason to start entering other markets like a loon. They have no idea about how to run franchise-based restaurants/pubs and, as far as I heard, many pubs in the UK are struggling at the moment so it's possibly the worst time to start such an endeavor. Also, as static grass said, many adults would be embarassed to go there and it would be swarmed with kids. Sounds like the worst pub possible. As far as I understood british pubs, people go there because they want to go to the pub. They don't want an "experience", they want beer.

There are some very enjoyable "gaming" pubs here in Vienna. This means that it's pubs for adults with a bunch of board games lying around. It works, it's enjoyable and it's fun. A pub with a big fat GAMES WORKSHOP franchise slapped onto it is about the opposite.

blongbling
14-10-2009, 15:10
now having said all this there is a bar in Warsaw called the Paragon Cafe. It is a gamers venue with tables and display cabinets and is somewhere that all the gamers go to and, I have to say, is quite cool.

On the wall is a hand drawn map of Middle Earth, there are lots of books that you can sit and read (I used to send them all the new novels from BL each month for free) and they have a bar serving beer and food. When I was last there they were opeing up a gaming hall enxt door so you could play and drink there too but I dont know if that actually happened or not.

Now hopefully it is still going as I've not been for a few years but I have had some great nights, getting drunk and chewing the cud with Polish wargamers.

So, it CAN work but frankly this is the only bar of its type I have ever seen and is only alive due to the gaming connections they have, if they ever left then it would die. Now the same concept wouldn't work outside of a major city as the community would be too dispersed, in Warsaw it is quite compact and everyone knows everyone.