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Tokugawa100
22-12-2009, 18:56
Hi all.

One thing confused me at the end of the movies, did the entire country of Mordor just fall into a void?

If people went back there would there just be an enormous bottomless crater where mordor once sat.?

What happened to Mordor.?

canucklhead
22-12-2009, 19:26
The movie was a little ott about that scene. In the book it was more like an earthquake. fissures opened and the forces of Sauron fled into the darks of the Earth to hide and whimper. Mordor still exists geographically, and, for many long years, was a place of darkness and ash, essentially a volcanic wasteland. Given enough time, it would become wholesome again, Ithilien first, then Morgul Vale, then across the mountains into the wastes of Gorgoroth would again creep life.

To paraphrase the book.

Condottiere
23-12-2009, 00:59
Aragorn eventually reconquers it - to leave it unoccupied is just asking for problems sometime later down the line.

Iracundus
23-12-2009, 01:51
Also the movies made it seem that all of Mordor was an inhospitable wasteland incapable of supporting life. That however was not true for eastern Mordor which Tolkien in his additional writings supposed was the breadbasket region (due to fertile volcanic slope soil) supplying Sauron's armies. Orcs are still mortal and still need to eat, so Sauron would have had to provide for a major logistics chain.

Steam_Giant
23-12-2009, 10:29
Orcs are still mortal and still need to eat, so Sauron would have had to provide for a major logistics chain.

What a fantastic concept.

Sauron "The Dark Lord" presents.. "Mordor's Economic Policies" :D

Iracundus
23-12-2009, 13:51
Tolkien felt however that even if Sauron was engaged in farming, his farms were more likely plantation style in being based on a slave labor force.

Also naturally to arm his force, he would have had to mine for iron ore to get the raw material for the arms and armor of his armies, plus ensure the manufacture of sundry things like leather, cloth, and wood for use in handles, utensils, etc...

For the rebuilding of his fortress, he would have to had to find quarry sites and man those, and then find a way to either ferry the stone or haul it by land to the building site.

Of course, Sauron probably loved doing all of this at some level since he loved Order originally.

canucklhead
23-12-2009, 17:02
Very true, as Sauron was originally a Maia of Aule. Several of Aule's followers fell to Melkor in the eraly times, not because they were evil, but because they were easy for Melkor to bend. Aule was enamoured of craft and the making of things, and it wasn't hard to bend that into the desire of possession and ruling.

Iracundus
23-12-2009, 17:34
Sauron is mentioned as falling due to admiring original Melkor's seeming ability to get things done and vast plans.

As Tolkien mentioned, Sauron's original love for order, organization, and efficiency was a virtue but was perverted and twisted to being order and organization at the behest of Sauron's will (ie tyranny).

It is interesting to note that Tolkien felt Sauron was probably the practical designer and organizer of much of Morgoth's defenses, armies, and works. Morgoth was more of the "grand ideas" type and may have come up with the concept and given the executive order to do something, but then would have delegated the actual nitty gritty stuff to Sauron, as Morgoth was perpetually lost in his own dreams and ideas of domination and desire for creation.

Steam_Giant
23-12-2009, 20:07
So your saying Sauron was the Bureaucrat of Melkor ? Dont they say the worst atrocities of WWII were commited by bureaucrats. I like the theme but then i have a love/hate relationship with order.

Condottiere
24-12-2009, 02:23
Towards the end, Melkor probably just liked pottering around his throne and moving his armies around, admiring his Crown Jewels. Sauron gets around and about more.

Iracundus
24-12-2009, 08:03
Sauron however once he starts acting for himself starts to act like Morgoth in being the thinker in the bunker and getting others to do the work, like the Witch King or the Mouth of Sauron.

Steam_Giant
24-12-2009, 10:10
Towards the end, Melkor probably just liked pottering around his throne and moving his armies around, admiring his Crown Jewels. Sauron gets around and about more.

lol

I just found a quote in the Silmarilion where Gwindor describes his insprisonment in Angband. He talks of the mines of Angband where captured elves are forced to work.

I imagine Sauron doing similar, Orcs eat alot of meat by the sound of it, so arable farming is probably less prominent, except for feeding the large amount of livestock needed to keep his armies at full strength.

Spider
26-12-2009, 10:06
...just liked pottering around his throne and moving his armies around, admiring his Crown Jewels.

And what man doesn't?

Dragon Prince of Caledor
27-12-2009, 01:28
And what man doesn't?

LMFAO! Not all so easily fall to his/her own power :angel:

Anywho I believe that Mordor would have sustained some life in the years after. But after all the horrors of that place I doubt that any of the peoples of Middle-Earth would have dwelt there.
Peace

jakelautrec
02-01-2010, 22:26
lol i can just imagine sauron bein all like clean freak in his tower room

Simon Sez
03-01-2010, 11:14
As I recall there was a large inland sea, the Sea of Nurnen, which supported plantation-style agriculture powered by human slaves. After the war Elessar declared the slaves free, but some elected to remain and keep the area as their homeland.

brightblade
05-01-2010, 17:13
Towards the end, Melkor probably just liked pottering around his throne and moving his armies around, admiring his Crown Jewels. Sauron gets around and about more.

Melkor did let himself go towards the end but he lived in Angband which had a great wheelchair ramp for his mobility scooter. Sauron was still struggling to get a Stannah stair lift fitted when the ring was destroyed.;)

Well, if he will live at the top of that big Tower!:p

fracas
31-01-2010, 19:54
ever read sauron's blog?
http://www.sauronsblog.com/

Avatar of the Eldar
07-02-2010, 15:54
ever read sauron's blog?
http://www.sauronsblog.com/

ZOMG! Hi-larious. And the boy knows his Tolkien quite thoroughly. I literally LOL'd on the Tom Bombadil entry.

Gaargod
07-02-2010, 19:32
Well that was a fun hour or so reading the blog... Seriously, i need to have more self-will when it comes to doing my work.

Its like reading the early works on tolkien's world, but the fun version :)

tezdal
08-02-2010, 03:10
Wow Saurons blog was excellent !

Desert Rain
09-02-2010, 12:48
Hahaha, that blog was great fun!