PDA

View Full Version : Black Numenorian's ?



tezdal
29-01-2010, 19:01
Just curious, where is in mentioned in the books about the evil men of Numenor? I recall it mentioned about the city of umbar having some correct, but where else is wrote about where they reside?

Whitwort Stormbringer
29-01-2010, 20:47
I believe Frodo and Sam mention seeing black Numenorean cavalry among the Witch King's forces as they pour out of Minas Morgul, although I'm not 100% on that. However, that would imply that they live in Minas Morgul as well.

Additionally, the Mouth of Sauron was a black Numenorean and he resided in Barad Dur, I believe, so you could extrapolate that there are more black Numenoreans there.

Condottiere
29-01-2010, 20:58
I believe they get a few mentions in the Silmarillion and in the LotR Appendix. They might reside in the old southern colonies of Numenor, assuming there were others besides Umbar.

tezdal
29-01-2010, 21:04
How bout during the Last Alliance timeframe, any mention of them fighting for Sauron? I believe the southern colony's were already "corrupt" by that time correct?

Eldarion
30-01-2010, 01:16
Alot of them went into the far east from what i can remember.

Condottiere
30-01-2010, 05:49
There were basically two factions, and I believe that Umbar was the supposedly the best port on the mainland, strategically located and probably heavily garrisoned, so that it's colonists and troops were Royalists, as compared to the loyalists up north.

Thorin Hubertson
30-01-2010, 07:50
How bout during the Last Alliance timeframe, any mention of them fighting for Sauron? I believe the southern colony's were already "corrupt" by that time correct?

Before the Battle of Dargolad, Sauron attacked Osgiliath, which was defended by Anarion while Isildur travelled north to organize reinforcements. That force comprised Black Númenoreans.
I once found an order of battle, but I can't remember wether it's canon or not (unfortunately, I can't find the source where this was written).
In the Battle of Dagorlad, the left wing (western wing) of Sauron's Army was made up from Black Númenoreans, men from Harad, Orcs, and Trolls, commanded by a Black Númenorean named Herumor. It has been said this was the strongest part of the army. The center wing was very strong, too, and was made up of Orcs, Trolls, and new units of Uruk-hai. The right wing (eastern wing) had Easterlings (yeah... looks plausible). The same time, the siege of Osgiliath was going on until the main army was defeated on Dagorlad.
The force of the Alliance was like this: advance guard with Elnaith-cavalry from Lindon; eastern wing with Dwarfes from Khazad-dûm including descendants from Belegost and Nogrod (Durin IV) and troops from Arnor (Elendil, Isildur, Elendur, Aratan, Ciryon). The center wing with Gil-galad and Elendil, Noldor (under Glorfindel, Gildor Inglorion) and Sindar (Círdan, Celeborn), the western wing Sindarin (Oropher, Thranduil), Silvans from Lórien (Amdír, Amroth) and survivors from Eregion. In Osgiliath, Anarion with troops from Gondor and reinforcements from Arnor held the city.
Another source states that the force of the Alliance numbered 10 times 10,000 elves, men, and dwarfes (=100,000), while Sauron commanded 5 times 100,000 orcs, trolls, and bad men (=500,000).

Steam_Giant
30-01-2010, 17:37
In "the return of the king" the Black numenoreans are the Black Corsairs of Umbar. Those of the "kings men" that survived the downfall of Numenor became corsair pirates, they settled in Umbar and made war on gondor with a rich history. Check these link for more info:

http://tolkiengateway.net/wiki/Corsairs

http://tolkiengateway.net/wiki/The_Mouth_of_Sauron

http://tolkiengateway.net/wiki/Black_N%C3%BAmen%C3%B3reans