PDA

View Full Version : Is no partials the answer to deathstars?



Malorian
05-02-2010, 16:07
I've never been a fan of deathstars, and when I heard the new skaven book had no partials on blasts I thought it was a bad idea, but maybe when you put the two together it's like fighting fire with fire.

With all the death stars there is one thing they can't protect themselves from: shooting that doesn't need to roll to hit.

If 8th indeed picks up the skaven rule of no partials then things that shoot out the flame temple or stone throwers could be the thing to bring them down.


So what thinks the nation of Warseer? Would removing partials mean a drastic reduction in deathstars being used?

GuyLeCheval
05-02-2010, 16:10
Maybe, but if you aren't playin skaven, there won't be so many tamplates around...

Phazael
05-02-2010, 16:12
Unless you are playing Empire, gunline 40k style, or dwarves, or with breath weapons....

All this will do it strengthen MSU builds, which people hate more.

Malorian
05-02-2010, 16:13
All this will do it strengthen MSU builds, which people hate more.

Do people really hate MSU builds more?

I don't know about other groups but I know mine would much rather play against an MSU list than a deathstar list...

Ultimate Life Form
05-02-2010, 17:32
Well, it would damage Death Stars, but it would also instantly kill every other R&F troops, which would be a bad, bad thing in my opinion and a crushing blow to how the entire game plays.

But hey, GW's headed into a different direction anyway. Who wants overpriced R&F like Goldswords and Goldgors if you can get unkillable monsters with ridiculously overpowerd rules instead? That's why every new book has 3+ new Monster entries, and templates will do zilch against those.

WinglessVT2
05-02-2010, 18:28
I'm not sure there is a way to make them less popular.
Like said above, no partials will hurt line-infantry and armies that take lots of small units more than big, badass units.

Malorian
05-02-2010, 19:27
I don't know about that.

I mean everyone will get hurt more with no partials, no getting around that, but at least for non-deathstars it's usually in the form of cheap models rather than expensive ones and thus has less of an effect. (Losing half your shade-star is way more important than losing half a unit of goblins.)

Skinnydookie
05-02-2010, 19:28
I always thought a way to stop this would be to have the following rule:

Too many cooks- If a unit has too many commanders leading it, this can cause confusion and distraction amongs the troops. Too many undead wizards could mean the troops being compelled to do 2 different things at once.

For every hero or lord character over one in a unit, you suffer a -1 to hit penalty for all models in the unit and the enemy get +1 to hit. For example if a Dark Elf army had 2 masters and a Dreadlord leading some Warriors the whole unit would be at -2 to hit the enemy and the enemey would be +2 to hit them.

Please note that Battle Standard Bearers and Wizards with only 1 attack do not count as they are trained to take a supporting role.

N810
05-02-2010, 19:30
It would be the end of core infantry and most multipart models... :(

Ps. the skaven are using the Small template without partials,
this makes it more of a medium template,

Malorian
05-02-2010, 19:33
It would be the end of core infantry and most multipart models... :(

Ps. the skaven are using the Small template without partials,
this makes it more of a medium template,

Well really this could be a rule coming with 8th anyway, so the idea of no partials really isn't under out control. The thing I'm wondering is if it'll reduce deathstars.

(And skaven have bigger template that don't use partials either :eek: (see plague catapult))

Gunless Ganger
05-02-2010, 19:36
I always thought a way to stop this would be to have the following rule:
...
For every hero or lord character over one in a unit, you suffer a -1 to hit penalty ...
Please note that Battle Standard Bearers and Wizards with only 1 attack do not count as they are trained to take a supporting role.

Sounds perfectly balanced and fair to me! :angel:

**Quietly continues building Temple Guard Death star featuring Slann (BSB/wizard with only one attack), Saurus hero, and Skink Priest on engine of the Gods (wizard with only one attack!)**

spiderhaiku
05-02-2010, 19:52
I think it would have a good chance, but the best rule change to stop Deathstars (without wanting to go off topic) would be to limit one character per unit surely?

Edit: Must refresh screen before posting, Skinny got in there.

Awilla the Hun
05-02-2010, 21:30
Only the answer for an army with lots of artillery, or a few fire breathers. But, of course, not every army packs all that heat.

Witchblade
05-02-2010, 22:14
'No partials' makes most things I hate more powerful. Pit of shades, stone throwers, breath weapons... Also, it's not like these things need the buff and it's not like infantry needs the nerf.

Condottiere
05-02-2010, 22:17
I always thought a way to stop this would be to have the following rule:

Too many cooks- If a unit has too many commanders leading it, this can cause confusion and distraction amongs the troops. Too many undead wizards could mean the troops being compelled to do 2 different things at once.

For every hero or lord character over one in a unit, you suffer a -1 to hit penalty for all models in the unit and the enemy get +1 to hit. For example if a Dark Elf army had 2 masters and a Dreadlord leading some Warriors the whole unit would be at -2 to hit the enemy and the enemey would be +2 to hit them.

Please note that Battle Standard Bearers and Wizards with only 1 attack do not count as they are trained to take a supporting role.Actually, I want to do the opposite; units cannot exceed a maximum size without the addition of command miniatures; if the unit is over the prescribed size, it suffers a -1 to it's leadership. The idea's been percolating within me for the last three months.

orlanth1000
06-02-2010, 06:26
Actually, I want to do the opposite; units cannot exceed a maximum size without the addition of command miniatures; if the unit is over the prescribed size, it suffers a -1 to it's leadership. The idea's been percolating within me for the last three months.

Percolating.....very nice word Condi :D

The word is R&F is where it's at next edition, so I'm sure the new template rules won't wreck them .....well hopefully :cries:

someone2040
06-02-2010, 08:46
To be honest, I expect units of infantry to get a lot bigger if this becomes mandatory. I for one, am scared of Skaven weapon teams and Doom Rockets and whatever else they have.

For my Dogs of War, I only have one block unit in 2000 points. One template can take out almost the entire unit. 335 points gone. It's kinda Deathstar, it's more along the lines of I don't have the points to fit in other block units (Without dropping something else valuable).

So one could say, this is the answer to deathstars. Because people will need to increase unit sizes to account for the fact that their units are going to dissapear as soon as a template lands on them.

That or as other shave said, will lead more to MSU instead, so it doesn't matter when one unit gets turned into mush.

Overall. Skaven template weapons = scary for infantry.

danny-d-b
06-02-2010, 09:41
its not going to be the death of death stars- more likely to be the death of ranked infantry compleatly- I get the felling if this carries on we will see no ranked infatry at all, just guns, knights and monsters, o and everyone having 10 power dice