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TroyJPerez
14-02-2010, 12:27
I was just curious what everyones most hated units to face are. I'm sure there will be plenty of demons mentioned here as well as a few of the new monsters that have been released. Just curious on everyones opinion. I think the thing I hate to face the most is Stegadon Engine of the Gods. Only for a half dozen reasons.
1. Impact hits and yet can march unlike a chariot.
2. Can nuke things in combat via the burning ailment thing.
3. Is unit strength 10 even after it loses crew.
4. Impact hits don't all hit the stegadon, but randomize amongs everything.
6. Gives lizardmen a fake level 3 and thus more dispell dice.
7. 5+ ward against everything (not just shooting or magic missiles like most things) farther than 12 inches away.
8. One of the most impossible units in the game to marchblock.
9. Has crew that can be shot to take hits saving the stegadon.

These are just a few reason I hate this beast. Its ability to hit things in combat pretty much makes any extended combat impossible. Its march and burning ailment power means it has a potential of 12 inch range of hits. I tend to find that all my normal tactics just fail due to al the rules it can break.

bigcheese76
14-02-2010, 12:50
One unit I hate alot is Wood Elf Dryads. I wish they didnt skirmish and would rank up properly so my cannons can kill them properly. My friend plays a whole army of them just to annoy me sometimes. Ah well, they still have to meet my Iron Breakers in combat.

GuyLeCheval
14-02-2010, 12:55
Advice for the OP, take a small unit with killing blow, or maybe a cheap killing blow hero, kill the priest, run away. Powers nulified, full VP gathered.

My most hated unit would be mmmm, I think Thorek...

LaurentleBete
14-02-2010, 13:31
The HPA. I just can't think of anything to deal with it.

xalfej
14-02-2010, 13:31
flamers and skinks

Bodysnatcher
14-02-2010, 13:47
Doomwheel. please let them sort out an FAQ that makes it reasonable.

Condottiere
14-02-2010, 14:06
Anything that requires a 200% investment to take down.

Duke Georgal
14-02-2010, 14:15
Are there 10 units in the Skaven army?

That would be my top ten most hated units right there.

Put them in any order you like. I hate them all the same.

OldMan
14-02-2010, 14:52
Hellpit abomination. This thing is freaking insane. In small games it can kill everything all on it's own.

GodlessM
14-02-2010, 15:05
In no particular order:

1. 3+ units of Handgunners
2. Engine of the Gods
3. Dragons
4. Hydras
5. War Machines
6. Souped up Dwarf Lords
7. Flamers
8. Greater Daemons
9. Steam Tank
10. HPA/Doomwheel

The SkaerKrow
14-02-2010, 15:07
I hate every unit* in every army, because I play Dark Elves.


*Except units carrying the Standard of Balance. I'm just indifferent about them for some reason.

GodlessM
14-02-2010, 15:09
I hate every unit* in every army, because I play Dark Elves.


*Except units carrying the Standard of Balance. I'm just indifferent about them for some reason.

Lol .

w3rm
14-02-2010, 15:19
I despise Black Gaurd, Hydras, and Doomwheel I would despise if I didnt play Skaven :D

colmarekblack
14-02-2010, 16:01
Night Goblin regiments. You can't get near the things for fear of them releasing fanatics and when you do get into combat your caught by netters reducing your strength.

Unuhexium
14-02-2010, 16:08
My #1 hate is Stegadons, with or without EotG. Insanely tough for their points and their accessibility makes them a huge threat.

zak
14-02-2010, 16:13
Certain Greater Deamon builds
Black Guard with ASF banner
The Hydra - why does it get hatred?
HPA - What were they thinking?

El'Flashman
14-02-2010, 16:25
I hate every unit* in every army, because I play Dark Elves.


*Except units carrying the Standard of Balance. I'm just indifferent about them for some reason.

LOL that's just classic :D

Witchblade
14-02-2010, 16:34
I think this thread makes no sense if people don't list what army they're playing.

Many armies can't deal with a thirster, while some Empire armies see them as free VP.

tarrym
14-02-2010, 17:02
Mine is grave guard...great weapons, asf (from the pretty mandatory corpse cart/vampires nearby) and banner of the barrows :(

Stegadeth
14-02-2010, 17:08
I think this thread makes no sense if people don't list what army they're playing.

Many armies can't deal with a thirster, while some Empire armies see them as free VP.

True. All the Stegadon hate really makes me chuckle inside. They are not nearly as bad as everyone makes out. Of course, I usually only field one unless it's a 3000 point or better game, because I'm not a complete douche. I ought to try it sometime and see how it goes though. For the point cost as a mount I think it's pretty fair, honestly. Each Stegadon mount I take means a block of 18 Saurus Warriors with full command and a dispel scroll or even higher priced magic item I can't take.

Or a fully decked out Scar-Veteran and Salamander unit plus more magic items.

Or 40 Skirmishing skinks...

scipunk
14-02-2010, 17:15
Any thing that is Khorne.....especially an all Khorne Daemon army.

It seems near to impossible to kill.

Tae
14-02-2010, 17:18
1. Flamers in a mono-Tzeentch army
2. Flamers painted Green to be 'Nurgle flamers'
3. Flamers painted Red to be 'Khorne flamers'
4. Flamers painted Pink to be 'Slaanesh flamers'
5. Flamers with a Pyrocaster in them
6. Flamers without a Pyrocaster in them
7. Flamers in cover
8. Flamers in the open
9. Flamers in a building
10. Flamers on a hill

The SkaerKrow
14-02-2010, 17:21
Ok, this

All the Stegadon hate really makes me chuckle inside. They are not nearly as bad as everyone makes out.
and this

Of course, I usually only field one unless it's a 3000 point or better game, because I'm not a complete douche.cannot coexist with one another. If taking two Stegadons at 2K automatically makes you a "complete douche" then, yes, they are in fact that bad. :p

Not that I hate Stegadons any more than I hate everything else in the game (except High Elves! Silver Helms and Archers fill me with ETERNAL AMOUNTS OF HATE!).

edit: Yes, I know that "Eternal" isn't an amount, it's a duration.

Bodysnatcher
14-02-2010, 17:55
1. Flamers in a mono-Tzeentch army
2. Flamers painted Green to be 'Nurgle flamers'
3. Flamers painted Red to be 'Khorne flamers'
4. Flamers painted Pink to be 'Slaanesh flamers'
5. Flamers with a Pyrocaster in them
6. Flamers without a Pyrocaster in them
7. Flamers in cover
8. Flamers in the open
9. Flamers in a building
10. Flamers on a hill

Time for me to get those buggers sprayed up then...

ShaggothLord
14-02-2010, 17:56
I hate Bretonnian deathstars, steam tanks, doomwheels, and the Varghulf.

Foegnasher
14-02-2010, 17:56
as a skaven horde player i hat ethe runed up stonethrowers with the rune of accuracey.

and anything that shoots the pieplate. empire mortars, trashbuckets, you nameit.

O&G'sRule
14-02-2010, 18:01
Night Goblin regiments. You can't get near the things for fear of them releasing fanatics and when you do get into combat your caught by netters reducing your strength.

Ha ha, I love that, scared of goblins.

bnrweimann
14-02-2010, 18:04
Pretty much everything in Vampire Counts. I really dislike the fact that large Dwarf infantry blocks melt away because they lost a combat by one point, and are outnumbered by.... zombies.... A race that has fought the worst that Orcs, Skaven, and Chaos could through at them for millennia. And they run away because there's one more zombie than dwarf in the combat.

Not so much the Vampire Counts fault as the fault of a bad rule, but VC really brings it out since everything causes fear, and it's easy to get outnumbered because they raise dead so well.

colmarekblack
14-02-2010, 18:04
Ha ha, I love that, scared of goblins.

Its not the Goblins perse, its the flaming fanatics stopping you going anywhere near said Goblins.

sergio
14-02-2010, 18:10
Are there 10 units in the Skaven army?

That would be my top ten most hated units right there.

Put them in any order you like. I hate them all the same.

in my last game, 3 units of skinks with blowpipes took down my treeman ancient in a single round of shooting.

*closes eyes, rubs temples*

Maoriboy007
14-02-2010, 19:11
1. DE Assasins
2. Hydra
3. Flamers
4. HPA
5. VC Bunker Caster Helm Lord
6. Bloodknights & Chaos Knights
7. Greater Demons in General, but especially Kairos.
8. Harpies
9. Teclis
10. Vampires with MotBA

Tae
14-02-2010, 19:27
Time for me to get those buggers sprayed up then...

Don't make me crack out the unkillable lord with ring of hotek on.

Jind_Singh
14-02-2010, 19:40
Hydras - bad enough its a tough monstor but:

1) Moves like a bloody skirmisher
2) handlers have crazy number of attacks
3) can be affected by cauldron of blood (which is plain stupid)
4) hatred on monstor
5) regen AND armour save
6) is CHEAPER than my O & G Giant - who is a total lard ass for his points!

badgeraddict
14-02-2010, 19:43
Currently I do not have a most hated unit.
In the last edition it was Night Goblin Fanatics. *Shudders*

Gork or Possibly Mork
14-02-2010, 19:48
Hydras - bad enough its a tough monstor but:

1) Moves like a bloody skirmisher
2) handlers have crazy number of attacks
3) can be affected by cauldron of blood (which is plain stupid)
4) hatred on monstor
5) regen AND armour save
6) is CHEAPER than my O & G Giant - who is a total lard ass for his points!

Those two would be my biggest gripe. The rest Im fine with.

Malice&Mizery
14-02-2010, 20:09
Ha ha, I love that, scared of goblins.

Never underestimate the humble Goblin ;)

As far as hated units go it's gotta be the Shade Star.

Even though I play Dark Elves, I think it's such a ***tish thing to use.

Maoriboy007
14-02-2010, 20:14
Hydras - bad enough its a tough monstor but:
1) Moves like a bloody skirmisher
3) can be affected by cauldron of blood (which is plain stupid)
4) hatred on monstor


Fixing these three would go a long way to making the Hydra a lot more reasonable.

StarFyreXXX
14-02-2010, 20:17
That's funny...so far, my engine has never lasted more than turn 3 in any game I have played...

I find it indiotic that people complain of stegadons. You haven't faced many vampire lords on dragons, or archaon knight armies, or kairos magic lists have you?

Sanjay

Sygerrik
14-02-2010, 21:04
1. Flamers










2. Flesh Hounds
3. Horrors
4. All Daemonic characters of any description, mostly SCs, Greater Daemons (except for GUOs and herald BSBs.
5. Black Guard
6. Hydras
7. PCBs
8. Treemen
9. Doomwheel
10. Giant unbreakable blocks of Clanrats, Stormvermin and Plague Monks with a Bell or Furnace

Lordsaradain
14-02-2010, 21:08
Treeman.

Too difficult to break or kill, and because of the stupid strangle root attack.

Volker the Mad Fiddler
14-02-2010, 21:16
I play Empire [as my first army] and there is nothing I hate more than Steam Tanks. Get rid of it already and bring back the cosmopolitan Empire [with Halflings, Kislevities, Ogres, etc.] where the Empire troops were men, not steam punk pansies hiding behind tanks, pigeon bombs, and mechanical horses.

H33D
14-02-2010, 21:18
As a Dwarf player, these are my top hated units (in no particular order)

1) All Demons
2) High Elf Swordmasters (great weapons that always strike first? are you serious?)
3) Dryads (core? 2 attacks? 5+ ward? cause fear? skirmishing? shouldnt this be in the demon book?)
4) Great Eagles (only because the high elves can bring almost half a dozen of them in a 2000 point game and they completely nullify my war machines by turn 2).
5) Terradons (because they fly from wood to wood dropping rocks on me, and end their turn out of line of sight because they are in woods!)
6) cheap, large, fear causing units. If they cause fear they shouldnt be cheap.

...
thats about it actually. I have no problem with other units. The ones I listed are a pain because I played them recently. I guarantee no terradons will be doing that again. Cheap fear causers will always be on my list.

The Red Scourge
14-02-2010, 21:18
Hellpit abomination. This thing is freaking insane. In small games it can kill everything all on it's own.

It really doesn't need to be small. Record stands around 1200 points of empire troops in a 2K battle - the skaven player then chose to retire the thing, as it was just too ridiculous :p

Maoriboy007
14-02-2010, 21:20
At least stegadons and HPA are relativly reasonably priced, unlike a hydra which is 50 points too cheap.

crushinbeats
14-02-2010, 22:21
1. Stegadon Engines of the Gods---- Its not the fact that its a giant monster with a bunch of wounds, or that it has a bunch bonus attacks from the people riding it. Or the crazy high armor save. Its the ablity that vaporizes nearly all small units within 2 d 6 inches, in close combat AND can't be stopped or dispelled in anyway. I mean really??? 2d6 st 4 hits, NO armor save... to EVERYTHING? ??!?! and it can't be provented, other than the death of the giant thing? And how many can you take?!? in a 2k list? My fun has been wrecked by 2 of these in multiple turnies.

2. Tzeench only DoC lists, with the 2 headed lord bird thing flying around.

3. Hydras

4. Stanks!

5. Black Coaches... uggg..

6. Infernal Gateway Deamon princes that hide behind things because they don't need line of sight.

Gaargod
14-02-2010, 22:22
Flamers.
I mean seriously, ignore the rest of the list (although there are enough...). I hate these guys because there's just no easy way to deal with them. T4 skirmishers with 2 wounds, 5+ ward and daemonic instability/ItP means they're nigh on unkillable by most things - 2 S5 attacks each means they wipe the floor with most missle-unit-hunters too. Their shooting is more than sufficient to burn a unit to death/uselessness too.

HPA - i don't care how expensive it is - T6 W6 and regen means its a nightmare to deal with. Combat, unless you're talking some super fighty character, does't work well either. And it can come back...

Doomwheel - a good 50pts, minimum, underpriced. And that's assuming no insane rules (i.e. treating it like a spawn who an turn, so no charging things in different charge arcs). If it had normal chariot rules with random movement, wouldn't have been so damm annoying, but a few things really irritate me about it:
D3 S4 hits for going through terrain, on a T6 4+ unit? Erm, why? Might as well not.
Surviving S7 (because its clearly built so much better than, say, a chaos/elf chariot...)
Never needing LoS for anything. Shooting, charging, movement, none of it
Misfire table being ridiculously kind - at worst, it'll take an average of one misfire a game. When it rolled a misfire, then got a 1 i assumed the best and was happy - till i discovered its just -1D6 movement. Say what? Its a misfire... he rolled a 1... how is that war machine not dead?

Obviously you then have the normal stupid things (hydra, greater daemons, etc) but these things just irritate me - the designers were clearly on the same stuff the modellers were enjoying when they designed some of the beastmen models.



@ crushinbeats: methinks you mean 1D6 S4 hits. Otherwise, someone is s***ing you. Also, kill the squishy priest, it stops.

Sygerrik
14-02-2010, 22:33
HPA - i don't care how expensive it is - T6 W6 and regen means its a nightmare to deal with. Combat, unless you're talking some super fighty character, does't work well either. And it can come back...

Doomwheel
Never needing LoS for anything. Shooting, charging, movement, none of it
Misfire table being ridiculously kind - at worst, it'll take an average of one misfire a game. When it rolled a misfire, then got a 1 i assumed the best and was happy - till i discovered its just -1D6 movement. Say what? Its a misfire... he rolled a 1... how is that war machine not dead?




HPA is T5. BIIIIIIG difference there, especially since most flaming attacks in the game are S4.

Doomwheel needs LOS to shoot. And it also takes a bunch of wounds if it rolls a 1 on the Misfire table.

Stegadeth
14-02-2010, 22:49
Ok, I am going to give everyone here the secret to defeating that great, big, terrible, mean, nasty, apparently underpriced Engine of the Gods. Sorry fellow Lizardmen players. The level of whining is simply too much.

Charge the Stegadon with any unit of cavalry you have with a character in it. Now say, "My character challenges the Skink priest." Congratulations! You'll pretty much win every time. He's T2, WS2, has 1 attack and two wounds. No priest means no more Engine of the Gods. Sure, your character might not fare too well once the Ancient Stegadon attacks (on initiative 1 mind you) but from all the complaining about how terrible this combination is, surely sacrificing a character in a small unit is worth it to you.

Keep in mind, the Lizardmen player spent nearly 300 points for that mount.

crushinbeats
14-02-2010, 23:09
Ok, I am going to give everyone here the secret to defeating that great, big, terrible, mean, nasty, apparently underpriced Engine of the Gods. Sorry fellow Lizardmen players. The level of whining is simply too much.

Charge the Stegadon with any unit of cavalry you have with a character in it. Now say, "My character challenges the Skink priest." Congratulations! You'll pretty much win every time. He's T2, WS2, has 1 attack and two wounds. No priest means no more Engine of the Gods. Sure, your character might not fare too well once the Ancient Stegadon attacks (on initiative 1 mind you) but from all the complaining about how terrible this combination is, surely sacrificing a character in a small unit is worth it to you.

Keep in mind, the Lizardmen player spent nearly 300 points for that mount.


Thanx for the tip, but doesn't the skink preist still get his "howida" armor save? And if you don't kill him in the very first charge, can't he do the Engine of the gods trick and evaperate the unit in hand to hand with him ? 2d6 str 4 hits no armor save at point blank range?

And you can kiss that hero good by if he doesn't kill the skink in one round of combat, that Steg he is riding will eat your face in a 1 on 1 combat.

And even if you do manage to kill the priest by giving up one of your mounted heros... ... You stil lhave a stegadon running around after it finishes up with your sacrafical hero.

No no.. your not getting off that easy mr lizard man info giver... Point for point Stegadons with EoG are the best/worst unit in the game. If you need basicly Double points to even deal with 1... think how it is with 2. if not 3... plus the other steggies they take as special choices. UGGG.. it makes my bung hurt each time i think about it.

Maoriboy007
14-02-2010, 23:19
5. Black Coaches... uggg..


You are definitly in the minority of thinking that the coach is the best of the VC rare choices.
BTW I dont neccesarily disagree with you, I think its level with wraiths as far as the best choice,
People go on about the (IMO) pricey Bloodknights and Varghulfs :confused: which are way too flawed.
At least the coach isn't undercosted though.

Stumpy
14-02-2010, 23:31
1. Flamers
2. Greater Daemons (all)
3. Doomwheel
4. Star Dragons
5. HPA
6. Flying lord sorceror of Tzeentch (the gateway git)
7. Assassins
8. Engine of the Gods
9. Wraiths
10. Slaves

Caiphas Cain
14-02-2010, 23:49
1. Deamons
2. Stegadons
3. Slaans
4. GG deathstar
5. Eagles (they kill my cannons on turn 2)
6. Hydras
7. Unkillable DE lord with Hotek ring/ whatever
8. Doomwheel
9. HPA
10. Slaves

Bladelord
14-02-2010, 23:52
1. Daemons
2. Daemons
3. Daemons
4. Daemons
5. Daemons
7. Daemons
8. Daemons
9. Daemons
10. Steam Tank

Bladelord
14-02-2010, 23:52
Ah forgot, 10. Daemons not Steam Tank!

AlmightyNocturnus
15-02-2010, 00:01
I`ll add a little different flavor into this argument. My most hated unit in the game is the great cannon. It`s more accurate than any sniper rifle ("I want to hit that model right there...and the one behind it...done") and more deadly than a lascannon ("6 wounds to your Giant!") and it`s cheap and every Empire player I`ve EVER met takes 3-4 even at 2000 points. I`m praying they change cannon rules in the next rulebook.

Almighty Nocturnus

StarFyreXXX
15-02-2010, 00:11
I tell my opponents that don't worry too much..just challenge the damn priest...and then everyone is like oh wow...that wasn't so bad.

And then they realize my army with 1..and rarely 2 stegadons isn't cheesy or anything....

*sigh*

Sanjay

Stumpy
15-02-2010, 01:26
I'd disagree with the great cannon, as they're prone to missing on perfect shots and are very easily taken out (due to being squishy humans). And for the record, I use empire and never use more than one, no matter the points size. Actually, I can see why you'd get annoyed if you're using a giant and the enemy has 4 cannons. That's just silly.

Ascendant Conscience
15-02-2010, 03:07
Is the Skink priest on the Stegadon the only character aboard the howdah? If not, any character can accept the challenge. I only ask as I'm a lifelong player of solely High Elves, so I know squat about the Lizardmen.

If I had to pick and I didn't play High Elves myself, I would probably hate Tyrion the most. HPA is T5 with regeneration? Okay, Tyrion's strength 7 and has flaming attacks. And I love the fact he has a 0+ or more armour save, a 4+ ward save and a 4+ regen save, which he always gets because he's wearing Dragon armour, making him immune to fire. Okay, he's not perfect, and I feel he's a bit easy to break in combat (stubborn would have been nice), but for the points I think he's a bargain.

AC

sergio
15-02-2010, 04:09
i think i've killed the priest on top of the EOTG in my last 3-4 games against lizards, all by turns 3-4 at the latest. all by sending drayds, glade riders, and/or an alter noble after it, and direct all attacks on it. he's got like a 2+ save sure, but any large quantities of attacks will kill him guaranteed

but it's not like the thing doesn't destroy everything beforehand with a level 3 mage for a hero slot, protecting the entire center of the army from shooting, and blasting everything in the immediate vicinity to kingdom come (ESPECIALLY all my forest spirits), and still leaving you with a *********** dinosaur to deal with.

and god forbid if there's two of them... last time my friend brought two, i quit after they wiped out about 800+ pts of my army *just* in the second turn with that ability.

Stegadeth
15-02-2010, 04:54
Thanx for the tip, but doesn't the skink preist still get his "howida" armor save? And if you don't kill him in the very first charge, can't he do the Engine of the gods trick and evaperate the unit in hand to hand with him ? 2d6 str 4 hits no armor save at point blank range?

And you can kiss that hero good by if he doesn't kill the skink in one round of combat, that Steg he is riding will eat your face in a 1 on 1 combat.

And even if you do manage to kill the priest by giving up one of your mounted heros... ... You stil lhave a stegadon running around after it finishes up with your sacrafical hero.

No no.. your not getting off that easy mr lizard man info giver... Point for point Stegadons with EoG are the best/worst unit in the game. If you need basicly Double points to even deal with 1... think how it is with 2. if not 3... plus the other steggies they take as special choices. UGGG.. it makes my bung hurt each time i think about it.

Yes, a whopping 2+ save. What do most combat heroes have in this game for S? How about attacks? Yeah, that save is brought up and made a lot less relevant easily.


I tell my opponents that don't worry too much..just challenge the damn priest...and then everyone is like oh wow...that wasn't so bad.

And then they realize my army with 1..and rarely 2 stegadons isn't cheesy or anything....

*sigh*

Sanjay

Exactly. My WoC friend actually loves seeing me pull a Stegadon out since all of his characters have to challenge. His Sorcerer in a unit of Chaos Knights beat the Skink Priest a couple of games ago. :rolleyes:


Is the Skink priest on the Stegadon the only character aboard the howdah? If not, any character can accept the challenge.

He is indeed the lone character, which is why this works so well.


i think i've killed the priest on top of the EOTG in my last 3-4 games against lizards, all by turns 3-4 at the latest. all by sending drayds, glade riders, and/or an alter noble after it, and direct all attacks on it. he's got like a 2+ save sure, but any large quantities of attacks will kill him guaranteed

The voice of experience.


but it's not like the thing doesn't destroy everything beforehand with a level 3 mage for a hero slot, protecting the entire center of the army from shooting, and blasting everything in the immediate vicinity to kingdom come (ESPECIALLY all my forest spirits), and still leaving you with a *********** dinosaur to deal with.

and god forbid if there's two of them... last time my friend brought two, i quit after they wiped out about 800+ pts of my army *just* in the second turn with that ability.

Be fair. The Engine can only do the bubble (which is only effective against ranged attacks anyway, and from 12" away from the Engine) or the attack. Not both in the same turn. People just have to get over being afraid of it, get in there and take the Priest out. I agree, two makes it much tougher. You'd have to send a hero into two different targets and may not have two combat characters.

Even a unit of Cavalry getting the charge and directing attacks on the Priest should deal with it fairly quickly. You could charge with light infantry and do it too. Again, Lizardmen initiative sucks. And, again, I and many others have had this over 400 point model (level 2 priest cost, plus mount cost, plus a single magic item) made into nothing more than a big chariot before it has done any damage. This would also cost the Lizardmen player 3 casting dice and 2 dispel dice. A major blow to his magic phase to say the least.

Anyway, I'll leave it at that. Try it for yourself next time you play Lizardmen, just don't tell them I told you! ;)

lopezpie
15-02-2010, 05:08
I hate every unit* in every army, because I play Dark Elves.


*Except units carrying the Standard of Balance. I'm just indifferent about them for some reason.

haha this just made sig lol

umm

1.plague bearers with regen grrr
2.everything else nurgle
3.GUO
4.Grail bus with static 5 combat res not couting ranks on charge...
5.all dwarves

Volker the Mad Fiddler
15-02-2010, 07:04
I already posted my hatred of the Steam Tank, but I think I need to mention special characters as well. Most are junk which actively detract from the fun of the game [Thorek or Slugtongue for example]. There are a few exceptions [Throgg for example] which are well designed and add flexibility to an army [rather than just being overpowered versions of something the army already does, or really expensive and inefficient versions of generic characters].

bakalla
15-02-2010, 07:51
1. Dark elf supreme sorceress with focus familiar (hiding-from-any-danger-kind-of-boooooring!)
2. Any kind of dragon, especially the particularly lethal ones (all-eggs-in-one-basket-kind-of-boring!)
3. Hydras, especially multiple hydras (just-too-overpowered-for-the-points-kind-of-boring)
4. Shades in very large units, especially with assassins in them (same thing here, just plain boring AND overpowered)
5. Anything else except free company, swordmen, spearmen, dwarf warriors, clanrats, chaos marauders etcetera etcetera!

Necromancy Black
15-02-2010, 08:26
1. Dragons. **** your US5+ flying terror machine
2. Flamers. *********** ********.
3. Teclis. If I've got a Slann he's half ok since I can make him get rid of 6's. Without that ability he would own my army up due to the amount of IF he can get. Thankfully he's weak in combat but that wound on 2+ with no armour is a real killer if he gets to a steg when it's already wounded.
4. Vampire Lord with Dread Lance and Red Fury. This is just ridiculous, at least change the dread lance to only autohit on the charge, not every bloody round of combat.
5. Gyrocopters. I just ignore them now but they still give me the *****.
6. Tomb Scorpions. Charging on the turn they come on the board is ********.
7. Anyone with the ring of hotek. So underpriced.
8. More then 2 great cannons. I know Empire aren't the strongest army out there, but come on.
9. The Infernal Puppet. Especially in an army with 3 or more wizards. And 2 hellcannons, so one can misfire and make every wizard miscast. So underpriced.
10. Casket of Souls. Mostly because I can't use Cold Blooded against it (though I laugh because skaven can't use strength in numbers :D)

danny-d-b
15-02-2010, 08:46
THe guys that said that bubrus/Rune of burnining iron carn't tell a carater from a mount (thanks mate my nurgle has no even less ways to take out a dragon)

anyone who says gateway is a tactic

then to aturaly units
EOTGs- I'm sorry, make them bounds next time or something but to have my knights blown up beacuse I can't stop it there for can't get at the dum skink, while at the same time I can't even snipe the caracter off the top??

hydras- never faced one but I've seen the dammage it can do- and it never even got in to combat- just got to the flank of a empire infantry CC army, then breath and terror- mass running of empire direactly away from hyrdra- ends up in one very clumped up empire army in the corner, which is easy enough to just land a dragon in and send them all fleeing in terror some off the board, most forward to get flanked by knights and dark riders

Tokugawa100
15-02-2010, 08:53
Night Goblin regiments. You can't get near the things for fear of them releasing fanatics and when you do get into combat your caught by netters reducing your strength.

Thats my best tactic for my Night Goblin army, scare the bajeezers out of the enemy army and hope to god they dont attack the wrong unit.

Its one me more then one game.

I dont really hate many units but I have to say I dislike vsing Daemon Princes, everytime I vs these guys they shred my army to pieces and seem to single handedly cost me the game.

Oh and Flamers!:)

Poseidal
15-02-2010, 09:24
Re: challenging the Engine priest.

Wouldn't the entire Engine (Steg included) get to fight seeing as it's basically a mount for the skink priest? I think many heroes don't fancy a 1v1 with the Stegadon.

WarmbloodedLizard
15-02-2010, 12:34
woah, that's a lot of EotG-hate there. the book is now one year old and people still don't know how easy it is to take out a priest on top, leaving an overpriced stegadon? you probably forget that the EotG is 400 points. If you use 400 points of your army to get rid of the EotG, it shouldn't be a problem.

yes, a slann and 2+ engines (or 3+ if no slann) can be extremely strong (also depending depending on your magic defense and the spells the skinks get). not against all armies, though. any army with semi-decent War Machines doesn't have to fear stegs/engines (except spam).

OldMan
15-02-2010, 13:11
Why is doomwheel so bad?
I know, that if we take seriously everyhing GW wrote about it, it would be even worse than HPA, but nobody sane does it.
So when decide that it normaly declares charges, throwing out of window all this compulsolary move/no LOS needed nonsense we got damn good but definetally not broken unit.

King_Pash
15-02-2010, 15:03
Is the Skink priest on the Stegadon the only character aboard the howdah? If not, any character can accept the challenge. I only ask as I'm a lifelong player of solely High Elves, so I know squat about the Lizardmen.

If I had to pick and I didn't play High Elves myself, I would probably hate Tyrion the most. HPA is T5 with regeneration? Okay, Tyrion's strength 7 and has flaming attacks. And I love the fact he has a 0+ or more armour save, a 4+ ward save and a 4+ regen save, which he always gets because he's wearing Dragon armour, making him immune to fire. Okay, he's not perfect, and I feel he's a bit easy to break in combat (stubborn would have been nice), but for the points I think he's a bargain.

AC

This post made me think - let's turn things around a little. What unit in YOUR army do you hate the most? This is from an opponents perspective not from yours, i.e., the unit YOU would hate to face across from you on the battlefield.

I'll start. I play High Elves and the units which i'd hate to face Swordmasters with protection (Shield of Saphery etc.), large units of Dragon Princes with characters (possibly Noble with Battle Banner or Banner of Ellyrion), and probably Teclis. The last being quite expensive but he does just laugh at any attempts at your magic phase.

Anyone else wish to contribute?

danny-d-b
15-02-2010, 16:17
well in my army- I'd suppose I'd hate to see 3 burbos being thorwn at me- but then again I'm not the berdyist guy in the club- a guy turned up with thorc for a freandly

Dantès
15-02-2010, 18:21
i'd hate to face Swordmasters with protection

With or without protection, id hate to be facing their huge swords ;)

Stegadeth
15-02-2010, 19:11
Re: challenging the Engine priest.

Wouldn't the entire Engine (Steg included) get to fight seeing as it's basically a mount for the skink priest? I think many heroes don't fancy a 1v1 with the Stegadon.

Yes, the Stegadon gets to fight as the mount. The four skink crewmen do not. I admit the Stegadon is a tough nut to crack. This is why I said charging it is a great option. Here's the thing, if the Skink Priest dies, no more Engine of the Gods, which is what everyone seems to think is crazy overpowered. Of course, the Steg is WS 3. That's average, not stellar. Read the tactics I posted above, but here is the recap.

Charge. Challenge Priest. Priest must accept. Here's the key so pay attention: Lizardmen have terribad initiative. You will almost always beat the skink to the punch and unless you suck as bad as lizardmen you will always beat the Stegadon with his abysmal In 1. Yes. In 1. Say it with me, In 1. Killing the Skink Priest is easy. He is weak. Once he is dead you are fighting an overpriced chariot which can no longer cast a single thing and the Lizardmen player is doing mental calculations trying to figure out how his magic phase is still viable since he lost 3 casting dice and 2 dispel dice.

As someone mentioned above, this unit costs over 400 points! If you put that many points up to match it and challenge, you're pretty much going to tear it up. And, even if you throw a single character at it, or a character in an infantry unit who challenges, you are still taking out the Engine of the Gods, which seems to be the bane of some peoples' existence. I only assume this is because they have no idea how easily it is stopped because they have never really tried or had the right tactics.

Maoriboy007
15-02-2010, 19:19
This post made me think - let's turn things around a little. What unit in YOUR army do you hate the most? This is from an opponents perspective not from yours, i.e., the unit YOU would hate to face across from you on the battlefield.


1. Vampires with Master of the Black Arts: Gives the rest of us a bad name
2. Bunker Lords (Skullstaff Helm etc.):up there with Gunlines and avoidance lists for boredom factor. Still with the stupid crumbing rule its hard to blame em.
3. Bloodknights:just for being so overrated
4. Wraiths: They're a pretty good, not cheap at 50 points a pop and a rare.

Cambion Daystar
15-02-2010, 19:44
As someone mentioned above, this unit costs over 400 points!
No it doesn't. The engine itself costs less then 300. Even combined with a lvl2 priest it still doesn't cost 400 points

klini
15-02-2010, 19:57
Terrorbombs - as i play an all goblin army...

Stegadeth
15-02-2010, 19:58
No it doesn't. The engine itself costs less then 300. Even combined with a lvl2 priest it still doesn't cost 400 points

Um, hate to break it to you, it is ten points under 400. I don't know anyone that leaves it at that, not even taking a scroll or single other magic item which would indeed make this unit cost over 400.

I don't know about your local meta-game but even online I have seen few Lizardmen lists that do not take this as a level two Skink Priest on Engine without a single magic item.

yabbadabba
15-02-2010, 20:01
Anything that has a bell end rolling the dice for it. Otherwise I am not too bothered, as long as we have a laugh!

StarFyreXXX
15-02-2010, 20:01
My engine, I take the engine (290), skink priest (level 1 or 2 depending on pts left - 65 or 100), and cube of Darkness (40). I refuse to take dispel scrolls so all I ever have is a Cube of Darkness (love that item...so cool and fluffy).

Sanjay

barlio
15-02-2010, 20:04
In no particular order:
1. Engine of the Gods
2. Waywatchers (against my WoC at least)
3. Plaguebearers with a Herald leading them
4. Nightgoblins with Fanatics
5. HPA
6. Plague Furnace
and other stuff...

Skyros
15-02-2010, 20:38
HPA
Hydra
Doomwheel (could be well balanced, but wtf knows? Thing needs like 2 pages of FAQ to return to the realm of reason)

Jack of Blades
15-02-2010, 20:46
Hydra


It just struck me that this thing costs 10 points more than a Gnoblar Scraplauncher... which is a much more expensive, worse version of a Stone Thrower :rolleyes:

Nicha11
15-02-2010, 20:53
Just like to point out the the EOTG "Burning Alignment" is only 1D6 Str4 hits, not 2D6 as some posters have mentioned.

Most hated unit?

Thorek, my first 2000 point game ever was against Thorek, I still one though:D

Bodysnatcher
15-02-2010, 21:27
Most hated unit?

Thorek, my first 2000 point game ever was against Thorek, I still one though:D

Thorek in a Dwarf gunline makes for pants on head insanity inducing boredom. You move, dwarf player spends half an hour shooting, you half move your depleted army etc. Turn 5 and several hours later two models reach the dwarf gunline and go 'meh' then go home.
Rune of wrath and ruin with ancient power is stupid good.

Primogenitus
15-02-2010, 21:47
Mine is grave guard...great weapons, asf (from the pretty mandatory corpse cart/vampires nearby) and banner of the barrows :(

This + helm of commandment and wight king w/ sword of kings. They just scare the hell outta me. And my WoCs are supposed to be badass fighters :rolleyes: Well, at least that bunch of wraiths suddenly seem a lot less nasty.

Kornath
15-02-2010, 22:02
HPA, Greater Daemons, Dragons...

All of the stuff that everybody else hates, but I don't hate the stegadon. I've killed it every time my friend fielded it. I've gated it, ran my Chaos Knights into it (Took one round, then it was gone) and I've had a lone chaos lord slaughter it.

Minimal losses of course

Slashattack
15-02-2010, 22:28
Bloodthirster
Great Unclean One
Plaguebearers too much regeneration arghh!
Skulltaker
Hell Pit Abominations, I haven't had any problems with doom wheels yet.
Plague Censer Beaers
Steam Tank
Star Dragon with Lord ontop.

tezdal
15-02-2010, 22:35
Big Blocks of Chaos warriors, not really hate........but I do respect them, hate it when even flank charges bounch of 'em

Conotor
15-02-2010, 23:58
Tanked up combat heroes.

Necromancy Black
16-02-2010, 04:46
If there is one thing in my army I would hate to face it would be the solo Slann. They are just near invincible. I honestly find them worse then Slann with TG as they can't pivot to constantly get the right direction for LOS (even without the large target LOS) and with because they don't have to spend the points for TG the rest of the army is much bulkier. A unit of TG can be avoided or led around a bit while you deal with the rest of the army.

Vermin-thing
16-02-2010, 05:06
Chaos knights of any form.

Stumpy
16-02-2010, 08:16
In my own army? Of my lizardmen, I would hate to fight either my oldblood or my BSB for lizardmen. The BSB can go toe to toe with regiments due to his abilities, leadership, fear causing and static combat res. The oldblood is just unkillable, which could get annoying.
For empire... probably the popemobile and steam tank but neither would give me that much bother. They aren't really that hard to handle (even with no slann, no steg lizzies).

Alathir
16-02-2010, 10:57
I play High Elves, Bretonnians and Skaven.

Flamers are ridiculous.

The Black Coach is ridiculous.

Any tough Stubborn unit is ridiculous

Grave Guard with the Regeneration banner are ridiculous.

Questing Knights are ridiculously bad.

Poseidal
16-02-2010, 11:07
I guess I'll post my bugbears now: I play WoC, Wood Elves and Empire.

I do not like seeing the HPA on the other side of the table. After that, probably usual things like the Hydra, Flamers and possibly the Engine but at least I have some chance of outmanouvring them (well, not flamers but those generally don't try and fight me) due to hem having charge arcs, rather than an effective 10.5 inch (and possibly higher) zone i don't really want any unit in.

tezdal
16-02-2010, 11:17
I also hate anything thats not wiped out in the first charge that happens to carry can openers.

Czarnoi
16-02-2010, 12:07
Hydra
DE with hotec and pedant
Harpies
All units in demon army
Stegadons in number 4 or more
Wampires with unlimited creating hordes of ghuls and zombies
Two or more abominations

blackjack
16-02-2010, 20:33
Yea i don't get the steg hate either. Put a steg up against a hydra that costs more than 60pts less, give the steg the charge and the impact hits and the Hydra still clocks the steg every time.

EOTG with priest and tepok costs more than 400pts show me a 400+pts unit that is not tough.

The laughably cheap hydra and HPA on the other hand....

"The Black Coach is ridiculous"

What? Black Coach sucks hardcore. A 200pt unit that dies to any str 7 attack and sucks friendly power dice?

Lijacote
16-02-2010, 20:52
Whineseer lives up to its name, as per usual. Hate is a strong word, and many of these posts are deluded.

Razakel
16-02-2010, 22:28
Whineseer lives up to its name, as per usual. Hate is a strong word, and many of these posts are deluded.

Many of them show a deep resentment for units that are, by popular agreement too powerful, go troll elsewhere. It's just a thread, and you are under no obligation to read it.

Personally, I've always disliked the Plague Furnace or Screaming Bell (I hate the Furnace more), I don't mind the Toughness of both, but both units being Unbreakable is quite painful.

I also hate seeing Dwarf players who go solo-gunline. It can be interesting to play one game in 20, and I certainly have the models to do so myself. But it isn't a fun playstyle by any means on a regular basis. The few times I have done a proper gunline with Thorek / double Gyrocopter with mass Thunderers I've won by a country mile, and every game was, without exception, boring as hell.

Necromancy Black
17-02-2010, 02:28
Personally, I've always disliked the Plague Furnace or Screaming Bell (I hate the Furnace more), I don't mind the Toughness of both, but both units being Unbreakable is quite painful.


I find myself unable to hate any unit with 0 leadership when I've got a Blade of Realities in my army :D

StarFyreXXX
17-02-2010, 03:05
It has leadership 0???

Sanjay

Vermin-thing
17-02-2010, 03:44
Lets see...

Wild riders, Black gaurd, Hydras, Flamers, dragon princes, chaos hounds, slaan, pistolears, and thunderers.

Necromancy Black
17-02-2010, 04:00
It has leadership 0???

Sanjay

It has a - for it's leadership which as per the rulebook equals a 0. And as per the rulebook it'll fail any characteristic test automatically if it's got a 0 for that characteristic.

Even the Rat Ogre on the bell has leadership -. Hopefully the FAQ will give the rat Ogre some form of leadership but until then one hit from the BoR means bye bye screaming bell and hello +6 to combat res :D (insane courage only applies to break tests!)

Dantès
17-02-2010, 04:24
I used to hate flamers, until it took them 3 turns to wipe my globadiers shielding my monks. I think that's all I hate. Cept the ring of hotek, that thing murders me. Oh, and focus familiar. Makes my life hard...putting in gutter runners just for that reason.

Peregijn
17-02-2010, 10:18
i dont like goblins... with the folowing set up in a 2000p armie:
4 shamans in chariots
6-8 boltthrowers
lots of verry fast moving wolves
pumpwagons...
big block of orcs with banner of dispeldice-ines

what unit can witstand 4d6+4 str5 hits and stil has 1 model standing to strike back?
what uniit can witstand 6-8 boltthrower hits? a turn
what armi can withstand 12 green casting dice, without going magic havy?

well... its yust to much...

Gaargod
17-02-2010, 11:59
Seriously? Tht' about as hardcore as a goblin army can get (ish), and its still not that strong. 4 chariots are hard hitting and all... but they're T4 5+ W3 chariots. Arrows can kill them! Pump wagons are fairly cool, but again not exactly difficult to kill, and random movement, and fairly slow comparatively.
The black orcs are not hard at all. Sorry, but without characters to back them up, there's way too many things that run over them without problems.
Bolt throwers are probably the best point-for-point units in the goblin army, but they're still bad LD and average BS, and rubbish crew. Terror, fear, anything in combat...
12 power dice is heavy magic, but then again, most competitive builds these days pack around that much anyways, or lots of defense. Plus, they're on chariots - goblin shamans, in combat. Hmmm.


And yeah, plague furnaces are irritating, unless you have Blade of realities. Or cannonballs/stone throwers, then they're not too bad :D

Sygerrik
17-02-2010, 16:31
I can't believe anything from the OnG book made it into anyone's "most hated" list.

Volker the Mad Fiddler
17-02-2010, 19:13
I can't believe anything from the OnG book made it into anyone's "most hated" list.

What else would you expect if you asked a Dwarf?

t-crane123
17-02-2010, 20:23
Hydras absolutely ridiculous for there points. If you don't have anything flaming they are extremely difficult to kill. It Also moves like a skirmisher! :O

Midevil216
17-02-2010, 21:16
What about Black Guard with the ASF Banner

Jack of Blades
17-02-2010, 22:02
What about Black Guard with the ASF Banner

T3 with a 5+ armour save, my neighbour's dog can lick them to death ;)
Armies like WoC that don't have much in the way of shooting (except the Hellcannon which will make short work of BG) can stick something with a good enough save and S5 in the way of the BG. Dwarfs I would think to laugh at BG with the ASF banner, if anything in this game drops like flies and are worth dropping too with the proper measures, it's BG.

EmperorNorton
17-02-2010, 22:16
I only get to play against High Elves, so I hate Swordmasters of Hoeth, dragons, Dragon Princes and Bolt Throwers.

blackjack
17-02-2010, 22:20
Stubborn 9 with a reroll is pretty sick on top of eternal hatred. Throw in a un killable str 6 lord and ring of hotek hero and the unit is basically not going anywear.

shredshredxx
17-02-2010, 22:26
1. flamers. because they're multiwound s5 nuclear silos with a ward.

2. flesh hounds. because they're multiwound heavy knights with a ward.

3.plague censer bearers. because they're **********.

4. black orcs. because they're totally awesome models, but totally overcosted and should TOTAllY be itp. or immune to panic. or maybe just cost less.

5. the hell pit abom. because against certain armies it can literally win the game on its own.

6. magic-heavy bunker vampire lords, and their magic-heavy vampire hero lackeys. because they say so much about the character about the person playing them.

7.trolls. because mine have never actually passed a stupidity test other than turn one.

8.knights of the white wolf. because after they lost their cavalry hammers, they became magnificently neutered, and there's literally no reason to take them now.

9. black knights. mine either have an ability to whiff their attacks bordering on the supernatural, or ws3 jut doesn't cut it.

10.war hydras. the only game i ever played against them, there were two. i my deathstar was stuck for 3 turns. that's not supposed to happen.

H33D
17-02-2010, 23:06
Many of them show a deep resentment for units that are, by popular agreement too powerful, go troll elsewhere. It's just a thread, and you are under no obligation to read it.

Personally, I've always disliked the Plague Furnace or Screaming Bell (I hate the Furnace more), I don't mind the Toughness of both, but both units being Unbreakable is quite painful.

I also hate seeing Dwarf players who go solo-gunline. It can be interesting to play one game in 20, and I certainly have the models to do so myself. But it isn't a fun playstyle by any means on a regular basis. The few times I have done a proper gunline with Thorek / double Gyrocopter with mass Thunderers I've won by a country mile, and every game was, without exception, boring as hell.

I too am a Dwarf only player. I was involved in a campaign in the border princes recently and the Lizardmen were just south of the mountains where my capital was located. I didn't want to chance a loss by taking something balanced and hoping for him not to take cheese, so I brought 5 units of thunderers, Thorek, 2 cannons, a grudge thrower, 2 bolt throwers, 2 master engineers, and 2 organ guns. There was nay a skink left after turn 5 was over (not to mention both stegadons were dead on turn 2). Both of us found that the game was very boring (although I laughed hysterically at slaying his stegs) and afterwards played a game were we both came up with the most interesting lists possible and played a game with an interesting battlefield layout. He brought lizardmen units i had never seen before, and despite both units being balanced, I massacred him (with bugman and his rangers no less) and even panicked off his EOTG by charging it with the mad rangers. We both had a GREAT game though, and that is the point. Oh yes, and I hate EOTG stegs if they bubble that ward save thing before I shoot them.

Roark
17-02-2010, 23:33
Top 10:

1. Decked-out Bloodthirster - Thanks a lot, Matt Ward.
2. Skulltaker on Juggernaut - Thanks a lot, Matt Ward.
3. Masque of Slaanesh - Thanks a lot, Matt Ward.
4. Hydra Beastmasters - 3 attacks each, and they have special shoes that somehow give M6. Oh, and let's give them armour piercing! All of this on top of the points-atrocity that is the monster itself. Come on, get serious. It just feels like a particularly malicious kick in the face.
5. Flamers - Thanks a lot, Matt Ward.
6. Doomwheel - The FAQ had better be good.
7. Star Dragon - Just because I don't have anything to counter it, and it wrecks up my chariots without even blinking.
8. Dragon-ogres - Purely because of the models.
9. ASF Blackguard - Annoying. Break, damn you!!
10. Harpies - Annoying. No Mark of Khorne for me. :-(

Kerrahn
18-02-2010, 03:32
For me personally, just about any Skirmishing shooter unit and flyers, mostly because I play WoC and don't have many ways to deal with them.

Oh, and I hate many of my own characters because I'm usually stuck challenging Unit Champions that don't give me EotG rolls when I could get more CR if I hit the unit instead (possibly more casualties than over-kill wounds due to the cap, and reducing enemy numbers in hopes of gaining outnumber or denying them outnumber).

I can tell you what 1 of my mates will say though - White Lions. He hates the idea of Elves that strike as hard and faster than his Kroxigors

orkz222
18-02-2010, 08:35
hydra... hatred 175pts? cant target handlers? lol...

ChaosVC
18-02-2010, 09:47
Is cheesy players counted as a hated unit?

That said, I hated steam tank during 6th ed.
Now I still hate them in 7th ed.
Thats why I plan to buy one soon.

Necromancy Black
18-02-2010, 12:49
Why the Steam Tank hate? The damn thing blows itself up and after a couple wounds it's useless.

Jagosaja
18-02-2010, 13:08
I won't qualify tough units as most hated ones. The one unit I hate the most are War Dancers. They just annoy me every time I play against them. And HE Great Eagles, so irritating. The rest is fine.

As for my army, the most hated unit is eight Cairn Wraiths in a strong magic defence army.

The Red Scourge
18-02-2010, 13:36
I hate the abomination.

Such a cool concept, but then they decided, it should be able to fill every possible role in the army. A terrorcausing tarpit, a super hammer, rank negating and even with the option of magic resistance and magical attacks and a 360' charge arc. It hits harder than a bloodthirster, its as tough as a treeman, and its cheaper than any of these. Why oh why??

Maoriboy007
18-02-2010, 20:40
Why the Steam Tank hate? The damn thing blows itself up and after a couple wounds it's useless.

Yeah, I don't quite get the steam tank hate myself, although I'd look at two as being a bit :shifty:

beaumontbrawler
18-02-2010, 21:20
1. Hydra
2. Any DE model with the Ring of hotek
3. Any DE model with the Pendant
4. Flamers
5. Regenerating Plaguebearers
6. Kitted out star dragon character
7. kitted out bloodthirster
8. WoC weezards
9. TK with Destroyer of eternities
10. Grey Seers that successfully cast the 13th spell :)

Wolfmother
18-02-2010, 21:41
for me it has to be units that just dont die
-plaugebearers with a herald
-regen grave guard
-temple guard and slan

Enigmatik1
18-02-2010, 21:53
1. <insert any large, insanely powerful monster here that's immune to fire>
2. <insert any large, insanely powerful monster here that isn't immune to fire>
3. <insert any large, insanely powerful monster here that's flammable>
4. <insert any large, nasty, multi-save "elite" unit here>
5. Engine of the Gods (I HATE Burning Alignment)
6. Doomwheels
7. :wtf: Bone Giants :wtf:
8. Slann in a Temple Guard bunker
9. ASF Black Guard
10. Grave Guard bunker

outbreak
18-02-2010, 23:59
Well i play my doomwheel as just random movement and can only charge if it hits someone in it's arc of sight as normal. When an FAQ states i can charge things not in my arc i'll play it that way so i find my doomwheel isn't really that good (only good at zzapping large targets), my HPA also seems to roll a couple inches short and lose on combat res after rolling up the 6 attack. Also got 1 shotted by a bolt of change last night which brings me to the things i hate the most. Daemons spells/items. Standard adding +2 to my required casting rolls for the whole game.....
Plaguebearers with t4, 4+regen,5+ward annoy the hell out of me. a unit of 5 flamers dishing out a bucketload of shots a turn

Rogzor87
19-02-2010, 02:40
Kholek and Dragon Ogre's!

I play Skaven, And all out stuff that can hurt them easily is lightning based which they are immune to. So they just walk right through me ):

chase14101
19-02-2010, 02:42
doomwheel hands down

ChaosVC
19-02-2010, 03:12
Why the Steam Tank hate? The damn thing blows itself up and after a couple wounds it's useless.

After surviving 10 archers, 24 hand guns, 2 cannons and a hell blasters...you find a freaking steam tank standing in your path...its a wtf moment no body would enjoy. If you hate beating it, buy it.

Sygerrik
19-02-2010, 04:18
Why the Steam Tank hate? The damn thing blows itself up and after a couple wounds it's useless.

One steam tank is not so bad. Multiple ones are exponentially nastier. I faced a list with 3 in 'Ard Boyz. The ability to wipe out units in one turn, combined with the guarantee that one or two will make it to your line intact (whereupon they become MUCH harder to deal with) makes them horrific.

Necromancy Black
19-02-2010, 06:09
Ah, multiples yes. But that's like multiple EotG. One can be dealt with. Multiples of them is ridiculous. Same with dragons, though they're worse as the bastards fly.

Stegadeth
19-02-2010, 15:35
I agree, Necromancy Black. A simple limit of 1 per army on some of these tough, supposedly rare, things (Doomwheel, Hellpit Abomination, Engine of the Gods, Steam Tank, Dragons) would be a welcome change that helped balance the game. In fact, it seems a lot simpler than the current rumored 25% cap on characters. Of course that is only one rule and we haven't seen the totality of changes 8th Ed. may offer. And then there are those items that are not counted as character mounts that are (so far) seemingly not affected by said rumored cap.

Condottiere
19-02-2010, 20:42
Link their presence to some other factor(s), like a character upgrade and possibly a theme.

Djekar
20-02-2010, 08:15
Most hated units?

1: Orc Boar Boyz - they blow up when I call the Waaagh! and under perform when I don't.
2: Savage Orc Boar Boyz - same as above, but at least they hit a little harder.
3: Common Goblins - It's funny how inefficient that 1 extra point makes them.
4: Black Orcs - It's not their fault, they just under perform most the other elites out there.
5: The Giant Spider for Goblin Characters - Fear?! A giant spider doesn't cause fear? I about pooped when I saw Shelob in RotK!
6: Forsaken - They are like Chosen only worse. Hey, they are faster at least!?
7: MoS Daemon Princes - could I please just be subject to panic and get ASF back?
8: The Kollosus Daemon Tower (Indy CD book) - I just think the idea is stupid.
9: Ironbreakers - Same as the Black Orcs, it's not their fault. I mean, why take them when I can fill up on Hammerers and leave these guys protecting the Underway?
10: Blunderbusses - they can move and fire with S5 at 12"? And they can S&S? And they fight like dwarves?! What the hell, I guess we know how the Chaos Dwarves have stayed alive all this time.

And don't even get me started on *other* people's armies!

Clarification: I still use all of these units with the exception of Boar Boyz - sheesh guys, stay home!

kormas
20-02-2010, 09:44
THe guys that said that bubrus/Rune of burnining iron carn't tell a carater from a mount (thanks mate my nurgle has no even less ways to take out a dragon)



umm, i was under the impression that you could pick and choose...at least that is what the ruling is for every tourni i have been to....it DOES say pick a model...


anywho my hated ones.

1. EOTG (i know this is common, but as WOC player i HATE it...i know i can deal with it, but the fact that is just needs 1 turn and some ok luck to stuff my knights is frustrating.)

2. DE gunline....hate it (includes hydra)

3. HPA (what the hell were they thinking??, and i am a skaven player)

4. gateway (never done anything to me, only versed it once BUT the treat of it is stupid)

5. daemons of all sorts

and i cant be bothered thinking of anymore :D

Necromancy Black
20-02-2010, 10:42
umm, i was under the impression that you could pick and choose...at least that is what the ruling is for every tourni i have been to....it DOES say pick a model...


Yes, and the rules say a character on a monstrous mount is a single model. The only time your noramlly allowed to pick in in close combat. You pick the guy on a monster as the target for RoBI but as per the rules you must then randomise between the parts. An FAQ confirmed this I believe.




1. EOTG (i know this is common, but as WOC player i HATE it...i know i can deal with it, but the fact that is just needs 1 turn and some ok luck to stuff my knights is frustrating.)

Make your opponent a deal. You take no knights, he take no EotG. Expecting him not to take one of the only things in the game that can counter Chaos Knights is pretty ridiculous.

TroyJPerez
20-02-2010, 11:33
Really the Engine of the gods is the only thing that can counter Chaos Knights? Guessing normal stegadons strength 6 impact hits doesn't do anything to them? Nor does the no armour save thunderbolts the skink priests throw around. Or the bolt thrower on back of stegadon? Or the cheap +1 strength no armour save sword. Or the Strength 7 Carnasour. Yeah I guess your right the Engine of the gods is the only thing that can take knights down, lol.

TheSanityAssassin
20-02-2010, 16:20
Yeah, I've really never had a problem with Stanks with any of my armies. They never seem to do a thing to me. It's just a pain to not get any VP's unless I kill it all together.

Stegadeth
21-02-2010, 03:01
Really the Engine of the gods is the only thing that can counter Chaos Knights? Guessing normal stegadons strength 6 impact hits doesn't do anything to them? Nor does the no armour save thunderbolts the skink priests throw around. Or the bolt thrower on back of stegadon? Or the cheap +1 strength no armour save sword. Or the Strength 7 Carnasour. Yeah I guess your right the Engine of the gods is the only thing that can take knights down, lol.

He said "one of" the only things. As for the rest of your complaints:

Knights have better movement, the Stegadon shouldn't be getting the charge on Knights.

The Skink Priest has to roll to even get that spell. D6 S4 hits. You can scroll it, dice it away and it still has to wound. On Knights.

The Stegadon with Bolt Thrower is the least common one. It would need to outmaneuver an opponent with better movement to get an optimal shot, otherwise it's getting one or two models.

The Blade of Revered Tzunki costs 65 points. The only logical choice for taking it is a Saurus Oldblood; a Lord choice for not just a few points. In most games I play (under 3k points) I would rather have a Slann than the Oldblood.

Sorry, the S7 Carnosaur isn't there to take on Knights. He's there for the beardy Chaos Lord on Chaos Dragon with Helm of Many Eyes, Hellfire Sword and Mark of Khorne that has 13 attacks before being bumped up even higher by a Warshrine. :rolleyes:

The Slann is far deadlier to Chaos with Lore of Metal ravaging your units.

kormas
21-02-2010, 08:04
Yes, and the rules say a character on a monstrous mount is a single model. The only time your noramlly allowed to pick in in close combat. You pick the guy on a monster as the target for RoBI but as per the rules you must then randomise between the parts. An FAQ confirmed this I believe.

ouchy....that really sucks then, but it is still an awesome spell so i wont complain :)





Make your opponent a deal. You take no knights, he take no EotG. Expecting him not to take one of the only things in the game that can counter Chaos Knights is pretty ridiculous.

......lizards have PLENTY to deal with knights (assuming i dont take somthing rediculus like 3 or 4 units) i only take 2 untis of 5, and it REALLY hurts when 2 or 3 of them die to something that is very hard to kill fully (i know i can stop the skink, but then i have a bloody dinosaur to kill :p)

and if i got rid of the knights....there goes the hitty part of my army, unless i stock up on monsters.. :D

Radium
21-02-2010, 08:28
I hate anything that can kill my Vampire Lord and his trusty rotten mount :p.

Nah, I hate deathstar units. Every. Single. One.
Other stuff is fine.

Necromancy Black
21-02-2010, 12:58
I hate anything that can kill my Vampire Lord and his trusty rotten mount :p.

I'm not a vampire player but if I was I would hate the fact that none of my vampire mounts are ethereal and can have beast cowers cast on them, even stopping a unit of Black Knights he's joined.

Since I'm not a vampire player I instead love this rule :D

Suprised no one has yet mentioned a Slann with banehead and Rule of Burning Iron. Killed a couple Vampire Lord in combat with that combination.

Mountain Realm
21-02-2010, 16:42
Dwarf organ gun and cannon. Playing WoC means I have the shooting abilities of Nintendo's "Duck Hunt", so they tend to do a bit of damage until the CC begins.

SaintofVirtue
21-02-2010, 17:33
Well I play Bretonnians, so keep that in mind.:

1. Flamers. Enough hate on these boys yet? Can't shoot them can't fight them with anything less than a full unit.
2.Greater daemons but especially the blood thirster. He's so much faster than my knights.
3. DE with ring.
4. DE with pendent.
5. Thorek. Period.
6. Dragons but particularly the Star dragon. Same reason as 2.
7. Fanatics!
8. Graveguard regen bunker.
9. Stubborn strong units like blackguard and white lions.
10. Cannons. Not saying they are overpowered or anything, I just don't like them.

What I would hate to face in Bretonnia:
1. The Green Knight. This guy is always dangerous, except when he doesn't come in and he can come back to life after you kill him. Ethereal, 2+/5+ saves, and a decent ability to put out the hurt. Teleport from terrain and enters from terrain.

Bladelord
21-02-2010, 18:37
A matge of mine would say something like this (he's a DoC player):

1. When I'm his opponent.:angel:
2. H. Elf spearelves, all of their damn attacks+ASF.
3. Swordmasters.
4. Dragon Armour.
5. My H. Elf list where every unit in my army have anti magic protection (just tried this list out once).:evilgrin:
6. H. Elves
7. Great Eagles.
8. Archmage that's immortal in close combat.
9. Cannons.
10. D. & W. Elves.

Well, he really hate to face High Elves.:p

reynor
22-02-2010, 03:36
Night Goblin regiments. You can't get near the things for fear of them releasing fanatics and when you do get into combat your caught by netters reducing your strength.

Yeah. Night Goblins are soooooooooooo broken. :P

And fanatics! they never kill the goblin units?

And there's no way to trigger them early either!

They're as bad as Daemons. WORSE!

reynor
22-02-2010, 04:06
I killed the Priest on Stegadon with Engine of the Gods with my Goblin Doomdiver Catapult once.

80 pts destroys a gazillion.

Admittedly my opponent hinted that I should do it. Nonetheless, it's an excellent tactic.

Agnar the Howler
22-02-2010, 04:35
I haven't played enough games to have a hated unit, but the Doomwheel was probably one of my worst, catching 3 misfires in 1 game. Yes, I said it was my worst cos it misfired 3 times. No, i'm not deluded, it gained 3 extra D6 of movement in total >.< it rolled lengthways across the board easily, catching my cold-ones in the flank and crushing them all with lightning and impact hits. Previously it had fried a few skinks and saurus too (admittedly he wasn't using it right to my knowledge, the lightning does D6 wounds (I think) and he treated it as D6 hits... it cost me a whole unit of saurus warriors in one damn shooting phase...).

Although that is only 1 game (although he is a cheat who can't read the rulebook and likes his daemons mixed, with a bloodthirster leading flamers and horrors at least) so I can't really pass much judgement.

The unit I hate the most in my army right now is my Slaan, who has sucessfully died in the opening rounds of both of his games due to rolling snake eyes on the mis-cast chart. In the first game he should've only caused a wound to an empire character (but instead vaporised him due to our joint lack of being able to read the RoBI rules open before us and treating it as D6 instead of a single hit) and in the second game his spells did nothing or were dispelled. I'm giving him one more game at some point, and if he fails again then he's retiring and is being replaced by an Oldblood.

reynor
22-02-2010, 06:55
i dont like goblins... with the folowing set up in a 2000p armie:
4 shamans in chariots
6-8 boltthrowers
lots of verry fast moving wolves
pumpwagons...
big block of orcs with banner of dispeldice-ines

what unit can witstand 4d6+4 str5 hits and stil has 1 model standing to strike back?
what uniit can witstand 6-8 boltthrower hits? a turn
what armi can withstand 12 green casting dice, without going magic havy?

well... its yust to much...

ha ha i'm gonna try that list. i play orcs and goblins and if there is a power list then i want to know.

seriously, dude, orcs & goblins are at such a disadvantage in this game that it's not even funny.

Bladelord
22-02-2010, 14:53
i dont like goblins... with the folowing set up in a 2000p armie:
4 shamans in chariots
6-8 boltthrowers
lots of verry fast moving wolves
pumpwagons...
big block of orcs with banner of dispeldice-ines

what unit can witstand 4d6+4 str5 hits and stil has 1 model standing to strike back?
what uniit can witstand 6-8 boltthrower hits? a turn
what armi can withstand 12 green casting dice, without going magic havy?

well... its yust to much...

1) Every unit with a champion & some bodies;)
2) Ethereal rocks for this purpose but it just makes me laugh when all those bolt throwers can't even penetrate a single phoenix guard.
3) Vamp armies relying on combat (not magic heavy:)) & tons of corpse carts with balefire:cries:

Actually I like that list.

ekalb
22-02-2010, 16:27
I don't know if I can do a top ten but the top three would be:
1-Nurgle demons. Period. Any unit that can bounce two dragons, a lion chariot and 5 Dragon princes... makes me jealous!
2-2 steamtanks ( i can deal with one)
3-1+ armor save, 4+ ward save knights with two attacks and strength 5. You know who you are.

reynor
22-02-2010, 17:42
1)
3) Vamp armies relying on combat (not magic heavy:)) & tons of corpse carts with balefire:cries:

Actually I like that list.

I like that list too! If nothing else, it takes guts to run it. I have to look through my copy of Vampire Counts to figure out how I'd even run such an army. (I don't play VC -- just have the book).

Oh. I figured out something I hate: Dwarf Organ Gun.

Sorry Dwarfs. Your fluff is cool and you're hampered in so many ways -- but the organ gun has annihilated so many of my ogres....

I don't hate it though.... would be nice if it had to roll to hit. But I'm sure I could deal with it. If I played an army with some flying units... (harpies, anyone?) or some Fast Cav (pistoliers, dark riders). Unfortunately Ogres have neither flying nor Fast Cav.

What were they thinking when they designed that book?

Stronginthearm
23-02-2010, 00:23
1) (insert obscenities here) War Altar, yes it can be killed but mein gott it pisses me off
2) Nurgle Lists, SO MUCH REGEN
3) as a dwarf player, Pit of shades, (ow ow ow)
4) as a vamp player, Cannons sniping my general
5) as a vamp player epidemus (they just rack up points soooo fast)
6) steam tanks
7) bloody pistoliers, every time I ignore them and they end up doing something nasty (this might be jsut me)
8) EoTG
9) Dragons
10) anything that is currently killing me

Oh and I would hate to face (and have faced) Blood knights, "yay I killed 3..... oh they are all back" :D

Chiron
23-02-2010, 00:50
Goblins when the player makes use of the corners of the board to castle them up while loaded with fanatics

Smacks of being a tit, of course it would bother me more if I wasnt TK and could come up and bite them in the **** with a scorpion and unleash hell on the little buggers as they go whizzing around

Stegadons and the Engine, I dislike that it cannot be dispelled... multiple stegadons is just silly, especially below 2000 points, but I can cope with one

Vampire bunkering and deathstars with regen banner

donaldtroll
23-02-2010, 05:08
Pretty much everything in Vampire Counts. I really dislike the fact that large Dwarf infantry blocks melt away because they lost a combat by one point, and are outnumbered by.... zombies.... A race that has fought the worst that Orcs, Skaven, and Chaos could through at them for millennia. And they run away because there's one more zombie than dwarf in the combat.

Not so much the Vampire Counts fault as the fault of a bad rule, but VC really brings it out since everything causes fear, and it's easy to get outnumbered because they raise dead so well.

how the hell do large dwarf infantry blocks lose to zombies loool

ChaosVC
23-02-2010, 05:36
I hate facing by proxy unpainted models field by power gamers.

ftayl5
23-02-2010, 06:32
Units I hate in no particular order

1. Skink Skirmishers- i dunno how many hunters I've lost to these buggers
2. Super huge units of _______ rats with a screaming bell
3. Stegadons
4. HPA's sound nasty but never atcually fought one yet
5. Mega Hordes of zombies

Dark_Knight
23-02-2010, 08:26
The Grey Bell. Total insanity!

Bladelord
23-02-2010, 08:54
Arch Lector mounted on War Altar... damn what it can take damage! the same goes to Steam Tanks. Even if I haven't met 2 Stanks+War Altar yet I've met double stank with griffon & that list was pretty nasty (I were lpaying a fluffy WoC list)

Stegadeth
23-02-2010, 13:27
Units I hate in no particular order

1. Skink Skirmishers- i dunno how many hunters I've lost to these buggers
2. Super huge units of _______ rats with a screaming bell
3. Stegadons
4. HPA's sound nasty but never atcually fought one yet
5. Mega Hordes of zombies

Skink Skirmishers are beasts! My regular opponent hates mine so much he actually moans when I don't flee with them but stand and shoot instead.

Skyros
24-02-2010, 17:43
Heh, I realize I've been hating on the HPA without even realizing how good it is. I'm used to seeing it win all its combats (or get killed by ranged fire/magic/cannonballs) but the other day I saw someone actually win combat against an HPA! The HPA rolled really poorly, and the multi charging high S cavalry got a ton of wounds (dragon princes I think) so that 3 got through regen and the infantry block provided a ton of CR.

Then we learned that...the HPA is stubborn! Hahaha. What a joke. Who designed this thing? You can't make unkillable combat monsters stubborn. Stubborn infantry like white lions that can be hacked down in combat is fine.

for those curious, the HPA easily made his test, then proceeded the next combat phase to deal 16 Str 6 attacks and absolutely pulverize everything in front of him, running them down when they fled. He pretty much just went around chewing up ranked up units like clockwork the whole game.

Poseidal
24-02-2010, 19:05
Then we learned that...the HPA is stubborn! Hahaha. What a joke. Who designed this thing? You can't make unkillable combat monsters stubborn. Stubborn infantry like white lions that can be hacked down in combat is fine.


Yeah, this is one I learnt the hard way too. I don't know what they were thinking when they put this one in; it almost has it's cake and eats it.

reynor
24-02-2010, 19:34
Then we learned that...the HPA is stubborn! Hahaha. What a joke. Who designed this thing? You can't make unkillable combat monsters stubborn. Stubborn infantry like white lions that can be hacked down in combat is fine.

Hmmm... GW hasn't made a model for it. Maybe that's their subtle way of saying it's cheese. (Cygor, Jabberslythe, etc).

Oh. Wait. They made minotaur models.

Nevermind.

colmarekblack
25-02-2010, 10:38
Having just read the rules for the HPA I have agree with the previous posters. This thing is off the scale, you think a Hydra is bad the HPA is even worse. Its only saving grace is that it has a chance to run into its own units on a triple, even then the likely hood of that happening is slim.

But aside from that its OP'd for its points cost. Needs to be at least 300pts, perhaps even more.

I'm glad the guy who had one of these in 750pts didn't show :).

reynor
25-02-2010, 13:48
A Hellpit Abomination at 750 points?

That shouldn't be allowed in the rules.

A giant? Sure. But some of these new uber monsters are Lord material. They shouldn't be allowed at under 2k.

Grupax
25-02-2010, 13:57
I actually - honestly- hate the manbane+rending stars even more.
It's really demotivating to use T5 chariots if you see 1 or 2 pop each turn in the unfairest way ever...
they should have capped it at 6 with the erratta

hope they don't expect to sell too much razorgors for chariots...
5 wounds each pop in the air as the opponent hits and wounds on a 2+ on one of the 3 rolls

King_Pash
25-02-2010, 14:18
I don't know if I truly hate this one but I really find the Dwarf Slayer character annoying. For a 50pt model he was able to hold up my Dragon Princes and Battle standard for 7 rounds of combat! On top of that he managed to kill my battle standard and take the Dragon Princes to half strength. Unlucky rolling on my part but DAMN he's annoying!

reynor
25-02-2010, 14:32
Slayers can be tough. I think you got the worst of it because his Strength gets boosted to the level of your character's Toughness (up to a max of T6). Plus, Slayers are Unbreakable.

Sounds like he may have had some pretty beefy Runes on his weapon.

In the grand scheme of things, I don't think Slayers are tough to play against. Not compared to Hellpit Abominations, Hydras, Bloodthirsters, Flamers, etc.

I'd chalk it up to bad dice. (Buy them some flowers and take them out to dinner. They'll still act mad, but inside they'll already be over it).

colmarekblack
25-02-2010, 14:52
A Hellpit Abomination at 750 points?

That shouldn't be allowed in the rules.

A giant? Sure. But some of these new uber monsters are Lord material. They shouldn't be allowed at under 2k.

It was a doubles tournament, supposed to be for beginners but most people took a big creature or uber unit of death.

Then again worse thing I prob faced then was a Doomwheel which was dealt with by Goblin Bolt throwers.

I agree entirely, perhaps 8th ed will place limits on the no of monsters. I already know of some non-GW Fantsy tournaments that have restrictions on large creatures.

Bladelord
25-02-2010, 14:55
The Cygor >& Jabberslythe... I just read their rules & damn, they're not as cheesy as hydra or HPA but for hell, they're rare choices giving you an anti magic beast or a small dragon!

fantasypisces
25-02-2010, 20:31
Yeah all the new monsters are getting out of hand. The day I picked up the new Skaven book and read about the HPA I almost fell over crying. I then showed it to all my mates and for the next 30 minutes we were laughing really hard, how do you beat it?

But because of the trend in the last few books, I'm starting to feel it is absolutely necessary to take a Bret lord/hero on a flying mount with Virtue of Heroisim (killing blow against large targets). Most likely a hero since it is a gamble.

Midevil216
25-02-2010, 20:37
Yeah all the new monsters are getting out of hand. The day I picked up the new Skaven book and read about the HPA I almost fell over crying. I then showed it to all my mates and for the next 30 minutes we were laughing really hard, how do you beat it?

But because of the trend in the last few books, I'm starting to feel it is absolutely necessary to take a Bret lord/hero on a flying mount with Virtue of Heroisim (killing blow against large targets). Most likely a hero since it is a gamble.

Dont have the HPA's stats in front of me but if I remember it regenerates so flaming attacks could help kill it since those negate regen.

samuraibobx
25-02-2010, 21:28
Fanatics. Always Fanatics. My friend always sneaks then in there and then proceeds to wipe out my Blackguard/Knights/Chariots etc. over the span of 2 turns with just these guys. In the words of Hank Hill "That just 'aint right" D:

Bodysnatcher
26-02-2010, 19:50
Fanatics. Always Fanatics. My friend always sneaks then in there and then proceeds to wipe out my Blackguard/Knights/Chariots etc. over the span of 2 turns with just these guys. In the words of Hank Hill "That just 'aint right" D:

That's what Harpies are for.

mythic77
26-02-2010, 20:54
1. Engine of the gods (I know how to beat it but still.. a little bad luck and a good chuck of my army evaporates.
2.HPA (faced one in a 1K game with my TK...)
3.Anything daemons (I actually havent played against them except for one small game, however just reading the rulebook makes me see red.)
4. Empire great cannons(the fact that a cannon is snipeing my charecters from across the board...)
5. Anything High elven (I play dark elves.)
6. Dwarf organ Gun(autohitting and tends to take apart my units quickly)
7.LD 9 skaven (Yes i realize that you just need to kill some off for it to drop, however having skaven testing for panic on the same LD as my dark elves is just plain wrong)
8.Lady Luck (She has abandoned me since I started my TK)
9. Murphy's Law (What can go wrong, will go wrong. This is too true for my liking.)

I didn't put anything Dark elven in as I play them, but i am pretty sure that hydra would be up there if it was generally on the other side of the table.

Grey Mage
26-02-2010, 23:49
I don't know if I truly hate this one but I really find the Dwarf Slayer character annoying. For a 50pt model he was able to hold up my Dragon Princes and Battle standard for 7 rounds of combat! On top of that he managed to kill my battle standard and take the Dragon Princes to half strength. Unlucky rolling on my part but DAMN he's annoying!

How did that happen- he has no armor save! Unlucky rolling indeed.

Disclaimer: The games balance is not responsible for you rolling nothing but 1's in every phase and test but morale.

rkuhnke
27-02-2010, 00:50
As a Dwarf player, these are my top hated units (in no particular order)

1) All Demons
2) High Elf Swordmasters (great weapons that always strike first? are you serious?)
3) Dryads (core? 2 attacks? 5+ ward? cause fear? skirmishing? shouldnt this be in the demon book?)
4) Great Eagles (only because the high elves can bring almost half a dozen of them in a 2000 point game and they completely nullify my war machines by turn 2).
5) Terradons (because they fly from wood to wood dropping rocks on me, and end their turn out of line of sight because they are in woods!)
6) cheap, large, fear causing units. If they cause fear they shouldnt be cheap.

...
thats about it actually. I have no problem with other units. The ones I listed are a pain because I played them recently. I guarantee no terradons will be doing that again. Cheap fear causers will always be on my list.


I think you need to introduce the terradons and eagles to Thorek. He will become their most hated model.

H33D
27-02-2010, 01:43
I think you need to introduce the terradons and eagles to Thorek. He will become their most hated model.

Yeah but I played against Lizardmen in a small 500 pt warband game. He had one skink priest, 4 units of skink skirmishers (about 10-12) and a large unit of terradons. It was ugly. No Thorek to save me there, but if I knew he was bringing terradons during deployment I would have deployed differently and then shot him to bits on the approach.

Bladelord
27-02-2010, 02:00
High Elf Swordmasters (great weapons that always strike first? are you serious?)

Dryads (core? 2 attacks? 5+ ward? cause fear? skirmishing? shouldnt this be in the demon book?)

Swordmasters should have more than just ASF, they're Swordmasters god damnit!

Forest spirits, the only daemons in warhammer who doesn't pop but instead run away like other mortal things. Dryads are daemons but atleast their ward save will be negated if you you magical weapons!

Stronginthearm
28-02-2010, 04:55
[QUOTE=N0th1ng c4n b34t 3lv3s;4435281]Swordmasters should have more than just ASF, they're Swordmasters god damnit!

/QUOTE]

Ya they get ws 5, why should they get asf when swinging huge swords, these are elves, I am always surprised that they dont fall over from the phoenix guard halberds and you expect me to belive that they swing claymore sized swords around faster then a dwarf (traditionally stronger then elves) can swing a dinky little hand axe?

Poseidal
28-02-2010, 09:17
Warhammer elves aren't weaklings. That's a fallacy introduced by D&D which has no place in Warhammer.

Condottiere
28-02-2010, 09:53
That was an attempt at balancing the races against one another, a Dwarf being tough but ugly. If you thought of the Elves as Far East Asian, their short stature, almond eyes, air of superiority, moon language and relative frailty made sense.