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View Full Version : The plastic Valkyrie from GW?? And other drop troops Q's



ShogunRua
14-02-2010, 23:48
Hello fellas. I have taken a very long break from the GW world of games. I guess its about five or more years now. In that time I just read the fiction and occasionally checked out some new models on the site.
Anywho, my time in the military is finally drawing to a close and my project car is almost completed so I was really thinking about getting back into the game. Before I quit I was seriously considering building a large drop troop IG force. I'm big on conversions to fit my own fluff and I think there is alot of potential there.
Just a couple questions...

First of all I see that GW started producing a plastic Valkyrie. Hows the quality?? Can you still have a door gunner? I thought that was a neat touch.

How are the FG rules for the Elysian list?? I would like to convert some heavies to be autocannons using the tallarn weapons and elysian troopers. Do the rules allow for autocannons?? I just feel they fit the theme very well.

Also, how are flyers handled now? I mean in a brief summary. The last time I played things like that were governed by the design your own vehicle rules. That might give you an indication of how long its been since I played.

In general how has 40k changed?? Has the timeline progressed at all? Is the Emperor dying more, or less? j/k.

I apologize for the lengthy post and all of the questions and I appreciate your taking the time to read it and provide any input.

Vaktathi
14-02-2010, 23:51
First of all I see that GW started producing a plastic Valkyrie. Hows the quality?? Can you still have a door gunner? I thought that was a neat touch.

The only difference 99% of people will be able to tell is the weight. Yes it comes with 2 door gunners.



Also, how are flyers handled now? I mean in a brief summary. The last time I played things like that were governed by the design your own vehicle rules. That might give you an indication of how long its been since I played. They just call the Valkyrie a fast skimmer and leave it at that. Any future flyers that are included in codex's I would expect to also be treated as fast skimmers.



In general how has 40k changed?? Has the timeline progressed at all? Is the Emperor dying more, or less? j/k. Nothing has really changed since the Eye of Terror campaign.

Caiphas Cain
14-02-2010, 23:51
The Valkries quality is fantastic, definently the best vehicle sprue out there. You can have not only one, but two (!) door gunners. Timeline is the same. And flyers are pretty much fast nusances.

ShogunRua
15-02-2010, 00:00
Oh wow they're fast skimmers now?? Didn't see that coming. That does simplify things I suppose.

ehlijen
15-02-2010, 01:39
You get the door gunners, yes. Their rather poor firing arcs mean that generally people don't bother with them though :(

The kit quality is very good, though there's one tiny hitch with the instruction manual (at one point it tells you to add to tiny bits over the doors under the wings that exist nowhere on the sprue, hardly a big problem though).

RichBlake
15-02-2010, 05:47
Nothing has really changed since the Eye of Terror campaign.

Not true!

Tycho is still alive somehow, Eldrad died in EoT then everyone is forgetting to talk about that and the Golden Throne is broke :p

Mewy
15-02-2010, 07:28
The kit is very nice, probably in the top 10 GW kits for overall finish, amount of bits to glue together and the sturdiness and ease of construction.

Cresistauead
15-02-2010, 08:28
Oh wow they're fast skimmers now?? Didn't see that coming. That does simplify things I suppose.
Well, valkyries are fast skimmers that either get a free move before the start of the game or get to deep strike. The transported squad can get out of a speeding valkyrie as per deepstrike rules (in fluff they are using grav-chutes).

But according to fluff valkyries and vultures aren't that fast. 'True' fliers like fighters did get updated flying rules in apocalypse-supplement. Apocalypse is a mode for for speeding up the gameplay when playing mega-games. Rules for very large specialist formations, titans, etc.

AndrewGPaul
15-02-2010, 08:38
The timeline is at 999999.M41*, and has been since 1999. Barring the next edition of the game being called Warhammer 41,000, I don't see this changing any time soon. New material is either "historical" (Dan Abnett's Sabbat Worlds Crusade in the 700s, Space Hulk in the 600s) or just crammed into the evening of December 31 40,999 AD.

*except the footnotes in the Ciaphas Cain novels; they're dated early 42nd millenium.

Bingo the Fun Monkey
15-02-2010, 10:28
I always thought it was 39,999 CE.

AndrewGPaul
15-02-2010, 11:25
41st millennium is 40,xxx. Same as the 20th century was 19xx.

Hunger
15-02-2010, 13:00
Yes Valkyries are treated as fast skimmers if you are playing a regular game of 40K.

However if you are playing a game of Apocalypse (3000+pts per side, many limits removed, can make use of lots of 'strategic assets' and other things not in the immediate theatre of battle, to give more of a sense of the war outside the table edges than you get with a normal game of 40K) then flyers are handled more like those in the Vehicle Design Rules from aeons past that gave me so many hours of enjoyment, and which you refer to in the original post.

Now you place the flyer anywhere you like on the table when it becomes available from reserves, and each turn it most hop anywhere else on the table that is more than 36" away from the previous position.

You can make a bombing run at any point along the straight-line between the two points if your flyer is equipped with bombs.

We have missiles that function just the same as in the VDR rles.

You can land on the table and drop off passengers just like the Orbital Lander feature in the VDR (if you're flyer has transport capacity), and Valkyries can do a 'grav chute insertion', dropping the squad at any point along their move while remaining in the air, just like a parachute deployment, however there is a chance that each squad member may die when they hit the ground (dangerous terrain test).

Hope that helps with the rules side of things.

ShogunRua
15-02-2010, 15:38
Not true!

Tycho is still alive somehow, Eldrad died in EoT then everyone is forgetting to talk about that and the Golden Throne is broke :p



Say whhhhhat??? Someone care to elaborate?

I like the way the Apoc expansion sounds. We always liked to play more than one board that represented a larger battle going on. Sounds like a similiar concept.

My favorite type of game by far was a large stalemated land battled supported by a distant firebase, good times.

RichBlake
15-02-2010, 18:19
Say whhhhhat??? Someone care to elaborate?


Basically as far as the rulebook is concerned we join the fight literally as Abbadon launches his 13th Black crusade into the Imperium.

At something like 99997999.M41 (which works out something like days/weeks/months before abbadon launches his black crusade in the end of the year 40,999) the Techpriests find a fault in the Golden Throne that is beyond there abilities to fix.

I did discuss this from someone from Gamesworkshop, the idea of the story ever progressing. Not only is it impossible from a fluff standpoint without breaking the game but it's also not what the game is supposed to be about. The idea behind 40K is that you join this massive, on going war for survival in the 41st millenium at a juncture where everyone is on the verge of destruction/victory. The humans will be wiped out/victorious depending on the Emperor and what happens with him, Chaos looks to be victorious or crushed in Abbadons 13th crusade, Necrons seem to be waking up everywhere, the Nids are here more rpesent then ever, the Tau are speeding up their expansion and technological development, Orks are becoming ever more united perhaps for a WAAAAGH! to destroy the galaxy, the Eldar seem to be approaching their final hours too and the Dark Eldar... well no-one really knows how they will be portrayed yet as we should wait for their new codex.

Basically you join at the point where something hugely terrible/wonderful is about to happen, and your decisions and victories as a general may influence that.

To advance to story would be to take away that impending doom/victory from one/all factions.



I like the way the Apoc expansion sounds. We always liked to play more than one board that represented a larger battle going on. Sounds like a similiar concept.

Apocalypse is good and can be very fun. However trust me when I say it needs to be well thought out. For example:

Where are you fighting? Randomly arranging scenery wont do here, to make it good you need it to look like a battlefield.

Why are you fighting? There are 6 objectives used, two in each deployment zone and two in no-mans land. While using plastic markers is fine, "real" objectives (sduch as power generators, command posts etc) make the game feel more dramatic.

Who is fighting? You need to arrange the sides so they are both relatively even (in apocalypse they don't need to be even, the book says why) and that really the sides fighting make sense.

When are you fighting? You need to set aside a good time period to run this game in, everyone needs to be there on time and you need to make sure everyone knows time is a resource.

How are you Fighting? This is something you wont really know until you've played a game, but just for your information it's a good idea to ban Flank March and the stratagem that forbids the team talking during deployment. While I can see some benefits to these, ones that are story driven even, it can just end up horribly (in our 50,000 point+ apoc game we had 16 players deploying without talking to each other and 200 blood angels outflanking. It was a mess).

Planetstrike, imo, is a much easier game to pick up and play, assuming you both have lists written for it. However it does require spending a good deal of time/money on scenery to be worth while.

Battle Missions is coming out in march and personally I think this book is a must have. It provides three missions for each race.

Commissar Bone
16-02-2010, 00:30
How are you Fighting? This is something you wont really know until you've played a game, but just for your information it's a good idea to ban Flank March and the stratagem that forbids the team talking during deployment. While I can see some benefits to these, ones that are story driven even, it can just end up horribly (in our 50,000 point+ apoc game we had 16 players deploying without talking to each other and 200 blood angels outflanking. It was a mess).



You say that like it was a bad thing. :evilgrin:

Seriously, that level of havoc can be hilariously unpredictable.

Col. Dash
16-02-2010, 02:17
I have never seen that "Be quiet" stratagem. I dont think its on our ban list lol. The overall game organizer usually assigns stratagems for the sides in our multitable games, think we have had a 24 foot long board before.

As for the Elysians the new updated rules for them should be available within the next couple months. The sooner the better heheh.

Culven
16-02-2010, 14:33
Kind of takes the fun out of it if the organizer dictates what can be used by whom. If he assigns stratagems, why not assign the forces as well? Of course, I don't really like the idea of an "overall organizer", sounds too much like having a game master.

Brother Loki
16-02-2010, 14:47
@Culven - that sounds like my perfect game! ;)

I like the idea of strategems dictated by the scenario, or even better, if the Apocalypse game is the cumination of a campaign, the strategems can be dictated by the outcome of the previous missions.

Culven
16-02-2010, 15:07
If there are scenario considerations dictating which stratagems may be used, that is one thing. If someone is telling the players which stratagems they will be using, that is a different kettle of fish. I don't know how the previous poster's overall game organizer assigned the stratagems, so they may have made sense, but he may have just decided which to assign without any though to the tactics of the army to which he was assigning them. This is what I would not want.

Col. Dash
16-02-2010, 17:42
They made sense. There was no feeling of being restricted. He also only allowed even level of superheavies per side, acted in disputes, tosses in wild cards during the game, for example a strategic redeployment or what have you. Its very good and keeps the game going. I have no complaints. Each side picks a general and they go to him.

He ran a planetstrike game 3 tables long. Each table had its objectives and two people fighting for them. He would toss in bones for the players depending. My Tau and my friends eldar were whooping the crap out of two marine players and he gave them a deployable basilisk to help, it fired one shot before we captured it and he ruled we could use it to fire on one of the other tables but not out own. After we wiped the marines, he allowed us to split up and each go to re-enforce one of the other tables each. All in all a really fun dynamic game, especially when marnius calgar died to Shas'O Rymrr's flechette launcher :) Ended up being a tie overall.