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Deadmanwade
16-02-2010, 14:31
Hey warseer,

So, I have a problem. I play marines. I play a LOT of marines. I have a Dark Angels army, a Crimson Fists army, a Raveguard army, a Space Wolves army (all over 2k) and I want to play White Scars, Blood Angels, Black Templars and Salamanders.

I only play maybe 2 games a month on average, and with an upcoming marriage, limited space in my games room and other considerations, I can't afford to buy enough models to play everything I want to.

Essentially, I am left with three choices.
1.) Spend all my money on buying, modelling and painting 4 more armies
2.) Limiting myself to buying 1 of the above mentioned armies
3.) Add a few unique units (like Baals or Vulkan) to one of my existing armies and using them as the army I would like to play.

Option 1 is very expensive and time consuming, though very pleasing to the eye and avoids a55-hat-ery from my opponents who say I cant play Blood Angels with models in another chapter's colours. (yes, I do know people like this)
Option 2 is do-able but not so much fun for me. Variety is the spice of life.
Option 3 works with my guard and nid armies, but for marines is less aesthetically pleasing. It also makes the most sense I guess.

What do you think warseer? What would you do?

Lostzilla
16-02-2010, 14:41
"Option 1 is very expensive and time consuming, though very pleasing to the eye and avoids a55-hat-ery from my opponents who say I cant play Blood Angels with models in another chapter's colours."

Seriously. Are there people like that??!! I hope not.

"Option 2 is do-able but not so much fun for me. Variety is the spice of life."
"Variety" ??!! Do You say variety playing 4 space marine armies and planing to make another 4? Is this a joke?

"Option 3 works with my guard and nid armies, but for marines is less aesthetically pleasing. It also makes the most sense I guess."
The space doesn't need more space marines. Go for guard and tyranids.

Prokrustes
16-02-2010, 14:51
I voted for option 3. I personally dont see the point of option 1 considering your situation. You dont sound convinced about option 2. Therefore go for 3! And because it makes sense ;-)

Lord Cook
16-02-2010, 14:59
I hardly think having eight different Marine armies could be called 'variety'. :rolleyes:

Anyway, the question was what would I do? I would pick option 1, because I think it's better to put the work and money into something you can truly be satisfied with than to save money and end up with something that you will never quite be happy with.

That said, the intelligent choice would be option 2, in my opinion. Think about which of these other armies you actually want and which are just a passing fancy. While I certainly wouldn't refuse to play someone using Space Wolves to represent Blood Angels (for example), I would consider it a little... cheap?

Alternatively, what about collecting all the other armies you want, but only taking them to about 1,000 points? Surely that would be enough to sate your desire for different Marine forces without spending a fortune? I would genuinely be happy to play a mixed force of Ravenwing and White Scars, so long as each of their special rules didn't affect each other. That would be far cooler to me than playing a "White Scars" army where all the models are in fact Dark Angels.

Bunnahabhain
16-02-2010, 15:00
Use sensible counts as, in a crusade force. They're well established in the background, and done well, they look good.
Make sure the painting is a good tabletop standard at least, and keep things consistent where possible - ie the squad and dedicated transport from the same chapter, but the support elements are from another, and it works.

You want to use that lot as Blood Angles? Blood claws are very similar to Death company. Repeat as needs be throughout.

With 8K+ of marines, you don't really need more complete marine armies. A few of the hard to proxy units will be sufficient. Saves you both money and space.

laudarkul
16-02-2010, 15:19
I voted 1. But please if you start then finish them (painting/modelling) in batches of 1,000 pts followed by 500 pts. Otherwise ... Because in the end, the army aspect is one of the most important thing in 40k universe. Of course this should not stop you from proxy 'till you finish at least 2,000 pts but with patience (and understanding from your future wife:) ) you'll have all those 4 amazing armies.
I play Guard but I started slowly DH and soon WH and DE. I learn it from my guard experience that if I paint in batches of 500-1,000 pts then I can "finish" (no more 500 pts unpainted it) them and slowly playing them.

TrooperTino
16-02-2010, 15:39
Proxy like hell I say :D

Culven
16-02-2010, 15:59
I voted for option 2, let me explain my thinking.

Buy a new Space Marines army (or reuse what you have for an even cheaper option). Choose a chapter with little to no background and paint all of your Marines in this new colour. Then you can add units/models as needed in order to field any Marine army. All you will need to do to is inform your opponent of the codex you are using that game. If you want to field the Assault Squad based 8th platoon, use the Blood Angels codex. First Company, use the Dark Angels Deathwing army, and so on.

This is how I intend to play my Red Hunters, once I get around to working on the army again. I already have my Lysander, Sicarius, Telion, and Cortez (actually converted to be my Deathwatch {Sternguard} contingent commander) figures converted for the army. Need to make a Vulkan and Belial.

As to option 3, I didn't go for that as I don't care for proxies. In my mind, proxies are salt shaker = Marine with Plasma gun, Coke Bottle = Carnifex, and so on. If you want your Green Marines to count as Blood Angels, then that is different. However, It can get a little confusing if one has recognizable colour schemes on units, but you are using different rules. This is why I suggest the unknown chapter which can use different rules.

Chem-Dog
16-02-2010, 16:15
Option 1 is very expensive and time consuming, though very pleasing to the eye and avoids a55-hat-ery from my opponents who say I cant play Blood Angels with models in another chapter's colours.

Ask them exactly where in the rules it says you can't use Blue/Green/Purple/Black models to represent different models from various Codexes. Even Jervis has said he's used his "Grey Marines" as practically every flavour of Marines available.

Multi Codex, paint them any colour you like and just be clear with what Codex you're using, if your opponants are that anal, I'd go as far as producing a crib sheet for them.

gwarsh41
16-02-2010, 16:31
I voted for 3. I did this because I dont think anyone should ever get their panties in a bundle If my blood angels are light blue, or if my smurfs are black. They are all marines. They all look pretty similar too, space wolves and chaos are the only ones who are drastically different. but they are still in meq.
I will probably be trying a few games with light blue blood angels because I hear they get a lot of dreadnoughts. I would have said get them all, but you mentioned a marriage. I am guessing you'll be strapped for some cash, go the safe route of proxy. then over time buy the models.

Wolf 11x
16-02-2010, 17:03
Option 2, which is not boring.

Leading options...

Znail
16-02-2010, 18:01
Using diffrent paint scheme is hardly proxying. Anyone that will forget wich army he is playing against due to paint scheme has problems of his own to deal with.

sabreu
16-02-2010, 18:08
Problem is, paint schemes offer new codex books. so the case can be made.

Bunnahabhain
16-02-2010, 18:16
Problem is, paint schemes offer new codex books. so the case can be made.

Only for marines.

Everyone else, Army X is Army X, regardless of what colour they are. Why should there be exceptions for one army? A marine is a marine is a marine....

Eldoriath
16-02-2010, 18:26
Go for third option, using same models throughout many armies. A bit more boring, but a lot more economical, both in $$$ and in time. Do the option that gives you most fun of the hobby.

sabreu
16-02-2010, 18:55
Only for marines.

Everyone else, Army X is Army X, regardless of what colour they are. Why should there be exceptions for one army? A marine is a marine is a marine....

No, their not. Blood Angels are Blood Angels. They use Codex: Blood Angels. Random ass generic codex not using any iconography or primary color schemes of the Codex-worthy chapters can use whatever the hell they feel like for rules. If you have Blood Angels, Space Wolves, or Black Templars, then you have one and only one codex to work with.

Radium
16-02-2010, 19:00
No, their not. Blood Angels are Blood Angels. They use Codex: Blood Angels. Random ass generic codex not using any iconography or primary color schemes of the Codex-worthy chapters can use whatever the hell they feel like for rules. If you have Blood Angels, Space Wolves, or Black Templars, then you have one and only one codex to work with.

Bah, who cares? As long as it's perfectly clear which codex he's using it's all good. Maybe the blood angel's armour painter is colour blind, or a shipment of power armour got sent to the wrong fortress monastery?

Option 3.

sabreu
16-02-2010, 19:41
Between his mates, he can do whatever he feels like and their comfortable with. But if he runs into someone like me, who does care, at a tourny, he runs the risk of having his comp scored lessened for such transgressions.

RichBlake
16-02-2010, 21:35
No, their not. Blood Angels are Blood Angels. They use Codex: Blood Angels. Random ass generic codex not using any iconography or primary color schemes of the Codex-worthy chapters can use whatever the hell they feel like for rules. If you have Blood Angels, Space Wolves, or Black Templars, then you have one and only one codex to work with.

Here is my successor chapter of the blood angels, they are called "The Royal Angels".

They paint their armour blue instead of red, to represent the royal blood of their new homeworld from which they now draw their recruits. They trim their armour with gold to represent their opulent background.

Here is my first chapter of Ultramarines. They are blue with gold shoulder trim as per the Ultramarines chapter.

Here is my successor chapter of the dark angels, they are called "The Royal Angels".

They paint their armour blue instead of green, to represent the royal blood of their new homeworld from which they now draw their recruits. They trim their armour with gold to represent their opulent background.

Here is my successor chapter of the white scars, they are called "The Kraken Deepers".

They paint their armour blue to represent the water that covers the majority of the surface on their homeworld. As there is not much landmass present they focus on using skimmer technology to move about the battlefield quickly and attack from every direction. As it is the first company they paint their should pads with a gold trim.

See? Easy.

sabreu
16-02-2010, 21:45
Richblake, please don't be a twit. My objections are based solely on recognized, established chapter colors and iconography. As I said before, generic coloured, diy marines can use whatever they feel like. However, if you have Space Wolf marines, and they have space wolf colors, and use space wolf iconography, then I'm not going to let you get away with using Blood Angel or Black Templar rules. It just defeats the purpose of getting that far.

Tiu
16-02-2010, 22:03
"Option 1 is very expensive and time consuming, though very pleasing to the eye and avoids a55-hat-ery from my opponents who say I cant play Blood Angels with models in another chapter's colours."

Seriously. Are there people like that??!! I hope not.

"Option 2 is do-able but not so much fun for me. Variety is the spice of life."
"Variety" ??!! Do You say variety playing 4 space marine armies and planing to make another 4? Is this a joke?

"Option 3 works with my guard and nid armies, but for marines is less aesthetically pleasing. It also makes the most sense I guess."
The space doesn't need more space marines. Go for guard and tyranids.

What he said. 8 flavors of smurf? And 4 (FOUR!) of them using the same stupid codex? Youve got to be kidding...

totgeboren
16-02-2010, 22:10
Having more then two different marine armies is beyond me (have one CSM army). Most people don't want to start Nids if they have an IG army "because they are both horde armies"...

And you are contemplating 4 more SM armies, when you have 4 already?

I think you should widen your horizons abit and start some army you don't have, like Tau or IG or something like that. :P

Askari
16-02-2010, 22:18
I have to chime in like most of the others and say:

"Another, non-Marine, army... or at the very least Chaos Space Marines or Grey Knights for some change of scenery"

Lostzilla
16-02-2010, 22:22
both horde armies?
you can do a melta vet army. Valky/vendetta army, armoured company...
Or you can go for nidzilla (trygons, tervigons, zoans.. etc).

I have 2,000 points of Imperial Guard and I'm going for tyranids when I finish my paint work.

Deadmanwade
16-02-2010, 23:20
Having more then two different marine armies is beyond me (have one CSM army). Most people don't want to start Nids if they have an IG army "because they are both horde armies"...

And you are contemplating 4 more SM armies, when you have 4 already?

I think you should widen your horizons abit and start some army you don't have, like Tau or IG or something like that. :P

I have 7k of (4th) nids and over 10k of guard, which I can field in a variety of ways. My Dark Angels were my first MEQ army and I used to have over a full battle company. When Codex marines came out, I switched most of my scouts over to make a Crimson Fists force (which contains 50+ scouts). I moved most of my assault troops into Ravenguard (which contains 30+ assault marines). The Space Wolves were an ebay win 75 marines and 4 rhinos for 50! Its not so much that I want 4 more armies, just that I want my armies to fit the fluff and to match whatever I am playing. Using all bike, outflanking crimson fists, or black raging dark angels just seems....wrong.

Vexbane
16-02-2010, 23:39
You already have a ton of armies and I do not think you need more marines IMO. I would buy a few units for the established armies you have especially since you only play 2 games a month. If I only played 2 games a month I would not spend a lot of cash on warhammer models I barely use especially with a new wife (congrats BTW). That makes the most sense economically.
If you get really bored for some reason you could always move units around within your marines and repaint them or like others suggest just proxy some different color marines for 1 game. That will not be a big deal. If you played every week or 1/2 dozen or more games a month I could see getting more armies. As you are a casual player I would not.
You could also narrow down what army styles you like the most (space wolves, dark angels etc..) and sell some models/armies/units to support your habit financially. I have done that before I am sure a lot of us have. That is my 2 cents.

RichBlake
18-02-2010, 02:05
Richblake, please don't be a twit. My objections are based solely on recognized, established chapter colors and iconography. As I said before, generic coloured, diy marines can use whatever they feel like. However, if you have Space Wolf marines, and they have space wolf colors, and use space wolf iconography, then I'm not going to let you get away with using Blood Angel or Black Templar rules. It just defeats the purpose of getting that far.

The Ultramarines first chapter IS blue with gold trim, so that is recognised and my point still stands.

The iconography I have to half agree with, if you're going to proxy because you have 10K of marines then thats fair enough, but dont plaster chapter symbols all over them.

Saying that i couldnt care less personally, though it would make me frown.

sabreu
18-02-2010, 02:45
The Ultramarines first chapter IS blue with gold trim, so that is recognised and my point still stands.

The iconography I have to half agree with, if you're going to proxy because you have 10K of marines then thats fair enough, but dont plaster chapter symbols all over them.

First off, I want to apologize for being quite rude. I wrote my last post in this thread at work and after re-reading my post I feel as I may have transferred my aggrivations into that.

I just want to explain my point a bit better, because I dont think I'm coming as clear as I could be. A marine army that is just a color scheme, I have no problems with using any sort of rules, even if those colors are "recognized" as another chapters. Using the primary colors as a base is already well represented with the founding legions after all.

What I do not stand for is, a clearly Crimson Fist army, with the appropriate right handed red fist and chapter symbol, using space wolf rules. It just defeats the purpose of getting that far model wise to just try to jump ship to reap some rules benefits. Any major chapter with representable rules (Any chapter with a legit codex, the examples of the main codex such as Salamanders and Crimson Fists, etc) should use their respectful rules.

And just to further define myself, I guess, is I had problems with fellow Ork players with Deffskull models using the Goff rules when the Klan rules were permissible!

I don't know, I'm wierd I guess.

Culven
18-02-2010, 04:25
I don't know, I'm wierd I guess.
Some people want or need the "total experience" when they play. If they see a Crimson Fist army, they expect and want to play against a Crimson Fist army. I like this in my own games, but I am not going to risk losing opponents over which rules they are using and how the army appears. I understand that some people want the more powerful army, so they change to the codex that gives them that sense of power. For my own armies, I will do my best to represent the army with models, conversions, colour and rules. However, I also get around this limitation by using non-codex armies. My Space Marines are Red Hunters. As there is no Red Hunters army list, I can use any codex I wish depending upon which company or units I wish to focus on. Most of the time, they are 5th Company with a contingent of Deathwatch (Space Marines with Sternguard). If I want to field the first company, I can use the Deathwing rules. For the 8th company, I would use Blood Angels rules.

MajorWesJanson
18-02-2010, 07:55
Either Crusade force or a home-brew chapter.

I go with the second. I have my own fluff and names for characters, but if I feel like playing a different marine codex, I just have to reorganize some units rather than build/buy new ones. As long as you only play 1 Codex at a time, it works fine.