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VanDoo
08-03-2010, 20:58
Well hello there, Warseer!

Some of you may remember me from some years back. I had stopped playing 40k for a lack of opponents, and thus had stopped reading Warseer. Now in a new city, with actual people to play with, and after reading the last two Uriel Ventris novels on a whim, I’m hankering for some (tabletop) killing.

As I dust off (and repair… *sigh*) my old minis, some questions have popped in my mind:
-Has the “feel” of the game changed much since 4th ed? Seems like the increased cover saves would really force you to get in close and assault a lot more than previous editions, and the cheaper transports seem to encourage this. Also, due to the (rather dumb, imo) way wounds are allocated, do games take longer on average to play out? Also, is there lesser or greater emphasis on herohammer? I thought it was less prevalent when I read the options for Chaplains/Librarians in the SM dex, but having read the Nid/SW dexes, and the BA rumour summary, I’m not so sure anymore.
-Am I imagining things or have GW retconned a lot of the fluff in this ed? It seems to me they really went a completely different direction with Necrons, for example.
-Am I reading it right that you need to pay for 2 powerfists/thunderhammers just to get the extra CC attack now?
-Storm Shields are actually useful now?(!)
-You can’t hide behind area terrain anymore?
-Am I understanding it right that Chapter Masters/Captains don’t have to stick with their Honour Guard/Command Squads, and that in effect, they are simply “extra” units in the org chart? If so, do they deploy at the same time as the char they were bought for?
-Conversely, am I right in saying that you can take a transport vehicle that has a transport capacity smaller than the squad you bought it for? (i.e. 10-man Termy squad purchasing a LR or a 10-man Tac Squad purchasing a Razorback).
-I am unclear as to whether you deploy dedicated transports at the same time as the unit it was purchased for. Maybe I misread, but I didn’t see anything suggesting this was the case.
-The Ironclad dread (I think that’s the name anyway) can have a chainfist instead of the hammer-thing. Does that mean it strikes at I1, like a normal chainfist (seems dumb that it would…)?
-Do all Space Marines have a bolt pistol? I.e. can my tac squads now actually fire before assaulting?
-Related question: has anything been happening with BFG?

TIA

LonelyPath
08-03-2010, 21:13
I'll address what I can of your questions (but looking in the current Codecis and BRB will answer your questions also).

1. I find games of 1500 - 2000 take roughtly 2 hours to play out, so not that long.
2. They do appear to retconn fluff whenever they feel like it, but it's their prerogative.
3. Yes, to get the extra attack you need to pay for another one.
4. Yep, very useful indeed :)
5. Yes you can, the BRB goes into this, you just get cover saves if the terrain doesn't completely hide the models.
6. They may wander about freely and don't have to stay with them (so the HG and CC are bonus units that do not take up slots in the FOC).
7. Yes, a 10 man squad can take a Razorback and 10-man termie units can take a LR transport even if they'd normally be to big to fit inside it.
8. Transports count as seperate units for kill points, but if deploying in Dawn of War my group normally count them as a part of the same unit for deployment. I'm not 100% certain if that's also the official ruling though.
9. I imagine the Ironclad (you got the name right) would strike at I1.
10. Yep, they all sport bolt pistols, so yo ucan open fire and then assault as much as you like.
11. No idea...

Mini77
08-03-2010, 21:36
8. Transports count as seperate units for kill points, but if deploying in Dawn of War my group normally count them as a part of the same unit for deployment. I'm not 100% certain if that's also the official ruling though.

The dedicated transport and the squad are separate units. I was unsure of this myself so checked it out in the rules forum.

MadHatter
08-03-2010, 21:47
welcome back to the 40k universe. and warseer.

Dangersaurus
08-03-2010, 23:28
-Related question: has anything been happening with BFG?

TIA

Nothing official. All the Specialist Games are pretty much fan-driven now.

VanDoo
09-03-2010, 01:54
3. Yes, to get the extra attack you need to pay for another one.

Seems a little harsh, but I guess that must have been brought about by the x number of SM armies, with every character packing a PF.


5. Yes you can, the BRB goes into this, you just get cover saves if the terrain doesn't completely hide the models.

So for example, if I have a Pred behind a forest, but you can still see it through the trees, it can be shot, but gets a cover save, correct?


6. They may wander about freely and don't have to stay with them (so the HG and CC are bonus units that do not take up slots in the FOC).

That's kinda cool. Too bad you can't give HG jump packs.


7. Yes, a 10 man squad can take a Razorback and 10-man termie units can take a LR transport even if they'd normally be to big to fit inside it.

Also cool, if a little retarded.


9. I imagine the Ironclad (you got the name right) would strike at I1.

That's too bad, and doesn't really make sense, as the DCCW is pretty much the same size and strikes at initiative.


10. Yep, they all sport bolt pistols, so yo ucan open fire and then assault as much as you like.

wo0t. That always bugged me in 4th ed that my Marines would just cease firing when assaulting.


The dedicated transport and the squad are separate units. I was unsure of this myself so checked it out in the rules forum.

Makes sense. I like the fact that anyone can ride any transport now, not just their own. It flat out didn't make sense the way the rules for transports worked previously.


welcome back to the 40k universe. and warseer.

Thanks! Glad to be back! My wallet is less happy though :p


Nothing official. All the Specialist Games are pretty much fan-driven now.

That's too bad. BFG was/is one of the best rulesets GW came out with, imo. Simple, fast and effective. And fun!

LonelyPath
09-03-2010, 01:55
The dedicated transport and the squad are separate units. I was unsure of this myself so checked it out in the rules forum.

Thanks for that, I've often wondered what the official ruling was, which is why I mentioned the way we do it might've been just a house rule :)

@ VanDoo, I'm no good at doing all the quotations, so I'll just type as regular, lol.

I think having to pay for another PF to gain an extra attack is a bit steep myself, but I have done it wth a CF catain I have in my collection (mostly coz it looked so darn cool, lol).

Yep, you can see the predator through the trees and shoot aat it and it gets the cover save.

If HG could take jump packs some of my armies would greatly fear them, lol.

Taking transports that can't fit the entire unit is a bit strange, but at least they can combat squad, can't rememebr if termies can or not though, been a while since I last checked that part of the SM dex.

I'd forgotten the DCCW strikes at initiative, in that case I'd say the chainfist strikes at initiative (I really need to check some of these codecis more often!), sorry for the confusion.

Marines not havig a part of their staple equipment would be weird, but I never played regular SM in 4th edition, I stuck with my Grey Knights and then too up Dark Angels again.

Oh yes, and since I forgot to say so earlier, welcome back to the game and may your dice roll 6s, unless - of course - you don't want them to ;)

Zurken
09-03-2010, 02:48
Remember that the cover rules are different with vehicles. A vehicle only get a cover save if you can actually se less than 50% of it (from the firing models view), so depending on how many trees there are in the forrest you may or may not get a coversave.

It's called True Line of Sight, if you can se it from the models eyes you can shoot it! whatever you like it or not.

VanDoo
10-03-2010, 01:41
Remember that the cover rules are different with vehicles. A vehicle only get a cover save if you can actually se less than 50% of it (from the firing models view), so depending on how many trees there are in the forrest you may or may not get a coversave.

It's called True Line of Sight, if you can se it from the models eyes you can shoot it! whatever you like it or not.

Must be hard to use arty vehicles then (basi, whirlwings and the like)...

VanDoo
12-03-2010, 00:44
New question: can bikers get the +1A for 2 CCW now? Didn't see anything to the contrary in the BRB

Mini77
12-03-2010, 00:48
New question: can bikers get the +1A for 2 CCW now? Didn't see anything to the contrary in the BRB

Again, queried this myself recently. Yes bikers can get the +1 bonus for two close combat weapons.

chromedog
12-03-2010, 01:05
Ironclads are bunker busting units, essentially. Chainfists are useful against bunkers and fortified (intact) buildings - which don't dodge or move (thus are auto hit) and don't have an I value (so you will go first against them anyway).

If you want to go in I order, don't take a chainfist. If you're playing planetstrike, they're your friend.