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Minibull
11-03-2010, 04:51
While I never have been a huge Blood Angel fan, I do love 40k dreadnoughts. From what I hear, you can make a BA army that is mostly dreads - correct?

HQ - ?
Heavy - 3
Elite - 3
Troop - 5, if you have a Death Company of 25 models

So this puts atleast 11 of them in the army, which would be interesting. Could this actually be a viable army?

Btw, does a standard BA dread come equipped with lascannon and dread CCW?

Thanks!

williamhm
11-03-2010, 04:55
It might work, but for my tastes would be way too slow moving. Also from what little I know DC is expensive point cost wise.

Znail
11-03-2010, 04:58
You also wont have any scoring units. But if you moderate things a bit and take some basic troops for scoring and use the rest of you points for assorted dreads so could you have a fun army atleast.

TheWarSmith
11-03-2010, 05:08
That army would get screwed over so bad!!

Technically the DC ARE a scoring unit, but they'll never park their ass on the objective since they have rage.

HQ and fast attack have no dread choices, unless you can convince your opponent to let you take Chaplain dreadnoughts, something that would be EXTREMELY in character for Blood Angels.

someone2040
11-03-2010, 05:11
Death Company aren't scoring. Their Black Rage rule specifically states they don't.
So yeah, good luck winning without anyone to caputre objectives :)

CushionRide
11-03-2010, 05:14
um why cant the troop dreadnaughts capture objectives, my troop tervigons in my nid army can???

Znail
11-03-2010, 05:17
Because Vehicles cant score while there is no rule against Monstrous Creatures scoring.

Hoodwink
11-03-2010, 05:18
As a general BRB rule, swarms and vehicles can not cap - even as a Troops choice. This is why the Tervigon can. Unless they have specific rules that allow it, the Dreads can't cap since they are vehicles.

EDIT: Ninja'd :(

avatarofportent
11-03-2010, 06:35
librarian dreads for HQ as far as I know, but troop dreads don't score unfortunately.

avatarofportent
11-03-2010, 06:36
blood angels don't need to take objectives when they can just wipe the opponents army off the table in a smear of plastic and glue.

Frgt/10
11-03-2010, 06:54
librarian dreads for HQ as far as I know, but troop dreads don't score unfortunately.

libby dreads are elites

as stated already, you can take 11 dreads, but no scoring units, so its not really worth it imo...

Rydmend
11-03-2010, 07:51
Now taking 6-7 dreads and some quick moving assault marines for grabbing objectives could be interesting.

meno1
11-03-2010, 07:53
blood angels don't need to take objectives when they can just wipe the opponents army off the table in a smear of plastic and glue.

Most armies I can think of pack enough power to take out 11 dreads. IG would be the best. Then there's SoB with heaps of melta, DE with all their often overpowered guns, Tau with railguns and missile pods, Orks with PKs and such...Dreadnought armour isn't that strong.

Would be an interesting list however.

Znail
11-03-2010, 07:56
You could even combine Dreads with Sanguinary Guard (as Troops with Dante) as that will give the opponent some hard choises on what to use his high powered weapons on :) SG with a Priest for FNP (and FC) would be difficult to handle without using anti-tank weapons that you also need for the Dreads and thus overloading the opponent with such targets.

3 0f 6
11-03-2010, 08:04
You could even try a mass dread spam, and include 3 baal preds in the list for pure over kill with a cheap commander backing up a couple troop choices.

Cerraand
12-03-2010, 14:30
Because Vehicles cant score while there is no rule against Monstrous Creatures scoring.

Can you tell me where you saw that please? I can't find it. :(

marv335
12-03-2010, 14:40
It's a nice theme.
It sucks gameplay wise though, and you'll be smacked up real bad by just about anyone.

Karhedron
12-03-2010, 15:10
Can you tell me where you saw that please? I can't find it. :(

It is in the main rules (somewhere around page 90 I think). It is in the missions section where it explains that only Troops are scoring in the first place.

Knifeparty
12-03-2010, 15:14
Well Librarian Dreads are Elite choices and can also use the Wings of Sanguinius Psycic power, so right there you have flying Dreadnoughts.

And while Death Company specifically say they never count as scoring units, the Death Company Dreadnoughts do not actually say "Death Company" in their special rules selection, arguably making them a scoring unit? I'm sure you'd get a few arguments from people but they do have the Rage special rule meaning you can't really park them on an objective anyway.

Hypaspist
12-03-2010, 15:19
The point should be more precisely put, Knifeparty, that in that section under the Mission Rules, it specifically states that Units in the Troop Sections that are Vehicles, do not count as scoring troops.
Which is why the dreadnoughts Don't score, nothing to do with them being associated with the Death Company :)

If that clears your question up?

Cerraand
12-03-2010, 16:20
Yes, thanks!
Can't believe I missed that part... :p

MadHatter
12-03-2010, 17:31
i personally would allow my opponent to field a full dread army. he could use the the priest HQ dread if he took the time to convert one. and the dreads in the troop section could even count as scoring.

I would then laugh as his entire force was eaten alive. Dreads are easy enough for any army with gernades and melta bombs, etc, etc to uttlerly destroy them.

LonelyPath
12-03-2010, 19:13
The only exception to the vehicles can't be scoring rule that I can find in 40k are LS tornados bought as part of a Ravenwing attack squadron, as it states in the codex entry for RW that they score. Apart from that, vehicles cannot capture objectives.

Lyinar
12-03-2010, 20:51
Also, if you take that build, that's going to be 5 Dreadnoughts that you cannot control. They will do whatever they want, and can be lead around by the armour-plated nose.

CushionRide
18-03-2010, 04:35
you know i laugh at people who say a dread list is an "easy" kill. i used to run a blood angels army and had a total of 14 dreads in it. in apocolypse people had a difficult time contending with my dreads. especially since most of them were venerable. how many can be venerable in the current list? also does the new BA list allow for an iron clad?? i was just curious

also do the DC dreads have venerable?

Madgear Thundaklutch
18-03-2010, 05:52
you know i laugh at people who say a dread list is an "easy" kill.

Dont you know this is the internet? Railguns drop landraiders like they are ork trukks, every codex is broken before its released, no one plays fluffy lists, and every list/unit/whatever is beaten just by looking at it. :rolleyes:

Slightly off topic, I enjoy the tau players who laugh at my Landraiders, yet they never manage to pop them. 50% chance to hit, 50% to even glance, thats something to be proud about.

Back on topic, I used to run a 6 dread list in 4th. 5 out of 6 survived the game. There wasnt enough heavy weapons then, and there isnt now. I just dont see the heavy weapons in games, like everyone on here says they are.

Moral of the story, build the list you want, to hell with what warseer says :D

TheWarSmith
18-03-2010, 06:13
how many can be venerable in the current list? also does the new BA list allow for an iron clad?? i was just curious

also do the DC dreads have venerable?

There are NO venerable dreads or Ironclad dreads in the BA list.

To my knowledge, none of them had the "venerable" special rule...

MadHatter
18-03-2010, 08:00
you know i laugh at people who say a dread list is an "easy" kill. i used to run a blood angels army and had a total of 14 dreads in it. in apocolypse people had a difficult time contending with my dreads. especially since most of them were venerable. how many can be venerable in the current list? also does the new BA list allow for an iron clad?? i was just curious

also do the DC dreads have venerable?

While Dreads themselves may not be the easiest to pop in a standard game or even apoc when you have other support. But with this list of nothing but armor a player who knows he is going to fight this, can gear up to pop these units. We are not talking AR 14 like a land raider. we are talking AR 12. Not that hard. when you say have 12 5 man combat squads geared to take them. melta/plasma guns. Lascannons and even Missile launchers. these pop them with great effective ness. you have 12 models on the table. your odds are not going to be in your favor.

GrimZAG
18-03-2010, 09:23
I find dreadnoughts to be not as awesome as I envisioned them to be and can barely justify taking one let alone an army of them.

mughi3
18-03-2010, 09:38
I do love dreads, they alays perform well for me. we joked about just such a list, you could probably swing 9 in a 2,250 list but again it would just be for the thrill of it since nothing could score. Although you could very likely table or contest your opponant to death.

My biggest problems are with the dreads themselves, nothing can be venerable and while DC dreads get immunity to stunned/shaken results and nifty dread lightning claws with furious charge, your still just looking at AV12 for all of them. even putting them in FW lucious pattern pods they can assault out of, you will still find them only effective for a turn or 2 before they get ireprably damaged/killed, or the enemy moves out of range of them(well mabey not the libby dreads with wings).

I'd be more interested in a pure DC force as a themed army, not to win games but because it would look cool. 25 DC guys, lamartes upgrade, mephiston and 5 DC dreads in pods......my what a sight.

Karhedron
18-03-2010, 13:29
I find dreadnoughts to be not as awesome as I envisioned them to be and can barely justify taking one let alone an army of them.

It is worth remembering that some things get better when fielded in larger numbers. Killing a Land Raider is not too difficult, killing 2 is much harder, killing 3 is almost impossible.

Blood Angels have several ways to do armour spam (usualy fast) and Dreads are another option. It is worth noting that BA dreads have some advantages to make up for the lack of Venerable.

The Furioso and Librarian Dreads are Av13 while the DC dreads are fleet and ignore stunned and shaken. Ironically standard dreads are probably the weakest option.

williamhm
18-03-2010, 15:22
It is worth remembering that some things get better when fielded in larger numbers. Killing a Land Raider is not too difficult, killing 2 is much harder, killing 3 is almost impossible.

Blood Angels have several ways to do armour spam (usualy fast) and Dreads are another option. It is worth noting that BA dreads have some advantages to make up for the lack of Venerable.

The Furioso and Librarian Dreads are Av13 while the DC dreads are fleet and ignore stunned and shaken. Ironically standard dreads are probably the weakest option.
Yup especially when you consider the fast tanks the regular dreads are competing against. I can see myself fielding 1 or 2 DC dreads and 1 librarian dread or furioso dread in high point games but that would be it. But that's because I'm personally going to be fielding a lot of jump infantry in my army.

Madgear Thundaklutch
19-03-2010, 04:47
It is worth remembering that some things get better when fielded in larger numbers. Killing a Land Raider is not too difficult, killing 2 is much harder, killing 3 is almost impossible.


Someone posted a thread or a post about how its increasingly difficult to kill a single land raider while there are more on the board, included some nice mathhammer and formulas, im too lazy to find it. :D

Znail
19-03-2010, 05:38
It is worth remembering that some things get better when fielded in larger numbers. Killing a Land Raider is not too difficult, killing 2 is much harder, killing 3 is almost impossible.

Blood Angels have several ways to do armour spam (usualy fast) and Dreads are another option. It is worth noting that BA dreads have some advantages to make up for the lack of Venerable.

The Furioso and Librarian Dreads are Av13 while the DC dreads are fleet and ignore stunned and shaken. Ironically standard dreads are probably the weakest option.
The main strenght of the normal Dreads for BA lies in exactly that strentght you mention above. If you already take some of the CC Dreads, then having normal Dreads will take advantage of overloading the enemies options to take out Dreads. The Rifleman config is actualy cheaper then for vanilla marines too.

Setesh
19-03-2010, 05:47
Dont you know this is the internet? Railguns drop landraiders like they are ork trukks, every codex is broken before its released, no one plays fluffy lists, and every list/unit/whatever is beaten just by looking at it. :rolleyes:

Slightly off topic, I enjoy the tau players who laugh at my Landraiders, yet they never manage to pop them. 50% chance to hit, 50% to even glance, thats something to be proud about.

Back on topic, I used to run a 6 dread list in 4th. 5 out of 6 survived the game. There wasnt enough heavy weapons then, and there isnt now. I just dont see the heavy weapons in games, like everyone on here says they are.

Moral of the story, build the list you want, to hell with what warseer says :D

I play a fluffy iron warriors list ^-^

Kalec
19-03-2010, 07:09
I could see a place for Libby dreads in a heavy-metal list with Baals in FA and Preds/Vindis in HS, but even in a list like that your best troops are going to be assault squads in rhinos for grabbing objectives and sweeping away lighter troops.

CushionRide
20-03-2010, 06:16
well, i have decided to run a dread list when i have the time to make it. im gonna make my wolf pack first for space wolves. but when i get to the BA ill start with and HQ of the Sanguinor with honor guard, Astorath the Grim also with honor guard (i hope thats allowed) at least 2 librarian dreads (they will have wing conversions to go with the HQ) one more furioso, maybe, troops will consist of DC dreads, Heavy support dreads will be in the list and my fast attack will consist of vanguard vets. transports will of coarse be drop pods ^_^

mind you i do have a few other things just to change it up once in a while, a 2nd ed landraider, terminators, tac squads..... but my new army will be redone with a more professional look ^_^ i hope lol