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srgt. gak
16-07-2010, 00:59
So hey guys im redoing my space marine army and im having trouble deciding on which chapter i wanna base it on. For some reason im really into the founding chapters.

Now each of these 5 chapters has something that draws me into them. White scars have the biker feel. Raven Guard are like fast moving spec ops marines. Imperial fists have Lysander( aka Anus McFearsome for you DLT fans). Salamanders have the ability to have their meltas and thunderhammers twinlinked and master crafted. and Lastly the Sons of Macarrage just have more fluff and special characters for inspiration than you can shake a stick at.

so heres what id like from you guys, if youre willing that is. I'd like you to sell me on one of the founding 5.

any help on my identity crisis would be much appreciated
thanks,
ian

GrogDaTyrant
16-07-2010, 01:09
Hi.

I'm not a marine player, and generally speaking I'm not fond of them. But I will say this. If you're going to do a marine army, do something interesting that few (if any) do. There's seemingly billions of Salamander copy-cats or other armies pretending to be Salamanders, thanks to the current meta-game. Shrike is less common, but not any more welcome from players who've been on the receiving end of infiltrating fleet TH/SS nurminators. And while Kahn is an interesting prospect, I still see people using him or running counts-as Kahns all the time.

So here's my idea... Build an Iron Hands army. Run a Master of the Forge, pile in about 4 or more dreads, and focus on lots of infantry with some solid vehicular support. Make a themed list, and it will look snazzy. Typically I dislike/hate all marine chapters fairly equally... but the Iron Hands are the only ones that I actually think are pretty cool and decent.

Hicks
16-07-2010, 01:16
All of those are good choices, but I'd pick White Scars:

- Tons of bikes is a striking sight and it's a really fun and different way to play. Bikes as troops and the combat squad rules allow the WS to be pretty effective on the battlefield.

- Adding a Mongol touch to the miniatures isn't all that hard and gives them lots of character. GW even makes bitz for them.

- Very few people play White Scars.

- Cool fluff, they played a huge role during the siege of Terra and in the 3rd war for Armageddon.

- With the Ravenwing battle forces, the army is actually not that expensive for something so specialized (a Saim Han army is going to cost tons more in comparison).

- A white army looks stunning, but is hard to paint. White Scars have a big advantage here, since they are Mongols on armored bikes from hell, wheatering looks really good on them and makes it easier to hide painting mistakes.

Corax
16-07-2010, 01:22
Well, given my userid, I guess I'd better put in a vote for Raven Guard.

Personally, the thing I like about the Raven Guard is that they are all about fighting smart, not hard. Their battle philosophy seems to share a lot in common with some of the zen (and zen-like) ideas of the soft style martial arts, such as aikido. In such a system, one does not defeat the enemy with brute strength, but by using his physical attributes against him. So whereas some chapters charge screaming bloody murder at the enemy (I'm looking at you, Space Wolves), the Raven Guard reconnoiter the terrain, establish a route of infiltration, take the enemy by surprise, and kill them before they even know what is happening. For me, the Raven Guard MO is best defined as: the precise application of the minimum amount of force, in the right time and place, to achieve the maximum effect.

There is some good material in The Chapter's Due by Graham McNeill that seems to indicate that the Raven Guard operate in a manner not terribly dis-similar to present day special forces (focus on recon, infiltration, rarely engage in pitched battles, etc.), so if the sneaky sort of thing appeals to you, they are the one to go for.

Otherwise, go for White Scars, they're rarer than hen's teeth.

Sunfang
16-07-2010, 01:34
Hi.

I'm not a marine player, and generally speaking I'm not fond of them. But I will say this. If you're going to do a marine army, do something interesting that few (if any) do. There's seemingly billions of Salamander copy-cats or other armies pretending to be Salamanders, thanks to the current meta-game. Shrike is less common, but not any more welcome from players who've been on the receiving end of infiltrating fleet TH/SS nurminators. And while Kahn is an interesting prospect, I still see people using him or running counts-as Kahns all the time.

So here's my idea... Build an Iron Hands army. Run a Master of the Forge, pile in about 4 or more dreads, and focus on lots of infantry with some solid vehicular support. Make a themed list, and it will look snazzy. Typically I dislike/hate all marine chapters fairly equally... but the Iron Hands are the only ones that I actually think are pretty cool and decent.

Agreed. If I could turn back the hands of time my Crimson fists would instead be Iron Hands with stacked Dreads.

Triple7s
16-07-2010, 02:06
It honestly depends what kind of tactics you go for on a battlefield, which is one of the advantages of the marine 'dex - its customizable to your needs. Ultramarines probably have the best all round special characters simply because theres more to choose from, but Salamanders have Vulkan and lots of flamers/meltas, White Scars have some great fast attack and have a bit more toughness thanks to the bike.

What I would personally say is this:
If you like a shooty army with lots of twin linked anti vehicle/horde/TEQ - Salamanders
If you like a fast, tough and mobile army, but accept it may be low in models - Scars
If you like versatility, firepower and special characters for bonuses - Ultramarines
If you like a somewhat mech based army that can deal a lot of damage - Fists
If you like taking the battle up close with stealthy units and deep striking - Raven Guard

It really all hinges on your playing style sir. Best of luck and let us know which chapter you go with!

Gutted
16-07-2010, 03:35
Do you want to be build a force based on the special characters or do you want to build a force based on the chapters and fluff? Because that will make answering your question a lot easier?

srgt. gak
16-07-2010, 03:37
Im more of a fluff guy but im also trying to slap in as many cool models as possible, and thanks for the advice guys im still thinking hard though

WigglesNY
16-07-2010, 06:54
I would do salamanders cause the modeling and painting possibilities are just too cool. And plus Twin linked meltas are just the nuts!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Asurman
16-07-2010, 06:56
I vote Sable Swords. Dorn as your Primarch; all while being vanilla codex, and getting the Templars color scheme.

srgt. gak
16-07-2010, 21:59
So ive been giving it some thought, and right now im torn between the Salamanders and the ultramarines.

I really like the looks of an ultramarines army, especially when its done right (i.e. http://www.warseer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=146205) and the picture of Calgars personal landraider are really inspirational. Plus i i like the Roman feel to the men in blue. The only problem with these guys is that though ive personally only seen one army of ultramarines, they are one of the most used army themes in gw.

The salamanders are also really awesome. I like the green and black with the flames look. Add in Vulcan twin linking the crap out of some of my favorite weapons is just awesome. but i feel like i see Vulcan way to much, and im having trouble finding a "feel for these guys", other than just killing everything in their path. Can anyone tell me what their theme is? or like what gw used for inspiration when they created the Salamanders chapter?


What do you guys think?

and if this helps i plan on using a lot of tac squads with a couple rhinos, a land raider, and maybe some th termies; commanded by a librarian and a captain.

Thanks for the help guys i really appreciate it

FabricatorGeneralMike
16-07-2010, 22:38
So ive been giving it some thought, and right now im torn between the Salamanders and the ultramarines.

I really like the looks of an ultramarines army, especially when its done right (i.e. http://www.warseer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=146205) and the picture of Calgars personal landraider are really inspirational. Plus i i like the Roman feel to the men in blue. The only problem with these guys is that though ive personally only seen one army of ultramarines, they are one of the most used army themes in gw.

The salamanders are also really awesome. I like the green and black with the flames look. Add in Vulcan twin linking the crap out of some of my favorite weapons is just awesome. but i feel like i see Vulcan way to much, and im having trouble finding a "feel for these guys", other than just killing everything in their path. Can anyone tell me what their theme is? or like what gw used for inspiration when they created the Salamanders chapter?


What do you guys think?

and if this helps i plan on using a lot of tac squads with a couple rhinos, a land raider, and maybe some th termies; commanded by a librarian and a captain.

Thanks for the help guys i really appreciate it


What it really boils down to is two things. What kind of army do you want to run. And what colours do you like to paint.

I think a Ultrablingers army looks fantastic when done properly. If you can and like to put in the work then this might be the army for you.

If you would like a little more -power- in your army, then the salamanders are for you. Again if you put the time into it, it can look freaking sweet also.

Personally, I would go with Iron Hands, I have always loved the Ad-Mech, bionics, dreadnoughts, etc etc etc. So they 'do it' for me. I loved the Iron Hands book, they are easy to paint for the most part and you can go nuts on bronic conversions. Now what floats my boat might not float yours. I am also thinking about doing a Crimson Fists army. I would like to do a 'tough as nails' ( never understood that terminology personally -shrugs) vet force that has fended off the worst the Ork's can throw at them and survived. I think it was the picture of Cantor and his mob on page 46 that made me want to do a army like them. I love the pic of the Vet Marine on the bottom left.

I really think it boils down to, do you want a nice looking playable army thats finished quickly. OR do you want to do a modeling and painting project that might take a while but will be a labour of love?

Im really leaning towards the Fists, but damn I love that Iron Father model I got....:confused:

orlando davion
16-07-2010, 22:42
The theme for the Salamanders is that they are the most humane Chapter.

They are unusal in that they are not segerated from the human population of thier homeworld (which is a deathworld).

Try http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Salamanders for more information.

Although I have used Vulcan in general I do not (most players do; I want to be different; I get a lot off; what no Vulcan?).

Argos Master of the Forge leads my Salamamnders (mostly Third Company) using counts as rules for Lysander.

This gives the army stubbern which really fits the fluff.

The key is to pick an Army that appeals to you (5th ed metagame may be totally different in 6th when we get it).

i hope this helps.

SockMonkey
16-07-2010, 22:56
Ravenguard for one reason... Forgeworld. but then again I loves my forgeworld.

Garven Dreis
16-07-2010, 23:56
Imperial Fists, I don't see enough of them. They are kickass siege experts, and while I'm a big Iron Warriors fan, Imperial Fists have some nice background.

FabricatorGeneralMike
17-07-2010, 01:16
Ravenguard for one reason... Forgeworld. but then again I loves my forgeworld.


HA HA HA , how did I know you would say that bro....LOL...yeah, I loves my FW also...I also loves your FW...;)...Gotta love those Eaters of Worlds..:)


PS, you need a Avie bro...maybe some FW RG or Eylsians...??

Billy
17-07-2010, 10:22
You should check out Crimson Fists. I think their colour scheme is stellar. And their fluff is really cool considering there is only a handful of them left (in the range of 120?) after orks destroy their homeworld of rynn.

You could base your army around a beat-up group of gnarled veterans and their struggle to maintain their chapter's heritage.

They aren't the most powerful possible list, with that salamander's character running around. But they are still marines that get stubborn and scoring sternguard if you take Pedro.

I would personally start them if i didn't have my wolves already. What is the sense in have two marine armies anyway?

Commissar Davis
17-07-2010, 11:09
Go Imperial Fists.

They get you any flack (smurfs) and have excellent fluff, and if things get tricky just throw Lysander at it. He's nails sandwiched between old boot leather, have your enemy munch down on that.

The only thing is painting yellow.

AndrewGPaul
17-07-2010, 11:55
To be perfectly honest, any Space Marine chapter can do any of the things you mentioned above (with possibly a very few exceptions). Pick the one you like the look of, or feel you can paint well.

mrun0riginal
17-07-2010, 11:58
I'd go with White scars. They are my second favourite chapter, after Space Wolves.

Malice313
17-07-2010, 16:14
Steer clear of Imperial Fists. Painting that much yellow will destroy your mind... further...

Charistoph
18-07-2010, 04:40
5 Founding Chapters?

I thought that there were 9 at the beginning of the Codex Astartes.

Of course, 3 that haven't been mentioned have their own codecies, and Iron Hands were left completely out in the cold, barely even mentioned in the Blue Boys codex.

srgt. gak
18-07-2010, 04:54
hey thanks for the respones again guys and im thinking that im going to go with the ultarmarines...

Corax
18-07-2010, 11:42
hey thanks for the respones again guys and im thinking that im going to go with the ultarmarines...

:eek:

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!

:cries:

:angel:

Flying Toaster
18-07-2010, 13:04
Well, given my userid, I guess I'd better put in a vote for Raven Guard.

There is some good material in The Chapter's Due by Graham McNeill that seems to indicate that the Raven Guard operate in a manner not terribly dis-similar to present day special forces (focus on recon, infiltration, rarely engage in pitched battles, etc.), so if the sneaky sort of thing appeals to you, they are the one to go for.



Well the last major pitched battle that the Raven Guard fought in was Istvaan IV and we all know what happened there...

Never a better time to start Raven Guard since forgeworld have just released several new models for them as well as transfers!