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View Full Version : So, anyone allso find that Quest is _lethal_?



Nkari
01-09-2010, 16:49
ie, do the heroes wipe more often than not unless they have that "heal whole party 1 hp for 2 power" spell.. Our group finds that this is most often the case..

??

Daemonslave
01-09-2010, 17:16
ie, do the heroes wipe more often than not unless they have that "heal whole party 1 hp for 2 power" spell.. Our group finds that this is most often the case..

??

I think the very first dungeon is the most perilous because you have very basic equipment and no provisions. If you survive, then the main priority in the next settlement is to get bandages and healing potions as they will come in very handy.

I have heard a suggestion (though I haven't tried it myself) to give each warrior a small amount of gold each and allow them to spend a short period of time in a settlement before starting their first adventure. It might make things a bit easier. :)

BigRob
01-09-2010, 20:34
Easy answer for us was give each warrior D6 Bandages and D6 Provisions in addition to starting kit. That healing potion goes awfully fast otherwise and the wizard needs the healing hands spell, anything else is an extravagant waste, especially given that the times you really need it are when you roll that 1 in the power phase and the angry minotaur pops up next to you.

Mr Feral
02-09-2010, 01:49
I like BigRob's suggestion, its simple enough to implement and will probably keep the Warriors going a little bit longer.

Shandowner
02-09-2010, 21:31
Yea, as my group found out, the game can be quite brutal...

BigRob
02-09-2010, 22:38
The game also scales horribly, a level 10 party will struggle greatly to even wound a bloodthirster or Emperor Dragon, much less defeat one, but thats same party at level 2, with a few games under thier belts, will be carving their way through the monsters they encounter with barely a scratch.

Some monsters are a joke, some are fantastically powerful and some are ludicrous. It can of course, depend on luck as well, like the vampire lord who rolls the "puff of smoke, then replace on board at full wounds" power. Vampires are not that difficult to kill, but that just gets annoying.

Shandowner
12-09-2010, 06:13
Well, 3 weeks and 8 attempts in, my group still hasn't beaten one dungeon...
God this game is tough....

BigRob
12-09-2010, 09:35
How many heroes are there? What is the party makeup? What other things apart from the "Main Quest boxset" are you using?

For example, my copy of Quest came with the three additional treasure card packs, the objective treasure card pack and the extra event card pack included. Try using the treasure tables in the roleplay book, some of the items are alot better :)

Tactics, tactics, tactics! When you enter a room, get the wizard in a corner and guard him with the other 3 warriors. None of the level 1 card monsters you get in the box have template attacks so he will be safe to heal and cast. Get the party working together so the treasure goes to the person most in need of it.

If all else fails and everyone is getting fed up, try a lower difficulty setting. Give everyone a 6 for thier initial wounds roll, a 6 for the wizards internal power, 3 bandages, 6 provisions and give the wizard "Freeze" and "Healing hands (the heal everyone for 2 power)" spell and go from there. If they still fail badly, as a last resort give everyone 1-3 draws at the treasure deck before you start but I have never had to resort to that.

Good Luck

narrativium
14-09-2010, 10:38
The one rule I've never figured out was: if a monster kills you, you die at the end of the turn unless (say) the elf gets his healing potion to you. Except, the turn ends after the monster phase so the elf can't get to you. I've always played it that you got the following turn to try and save the poor schmuck.

But yeah, the first dungeon is awful.

Inchpractice
14-09-2010, 18:27
I haven't played a game yet to test it but it sounds bad.

Maybe a rule could be put in where if at the end of the turn they roll a 4+ then the others have another turn to heal them. After that turn and consequent turns only a roll of a 6 will give the warriors another turn. However there are 2 stipulations:

1) If the monsters roll to hit which took the hero past 0 wounds was a 6 then you only have until the end of the turn, no rolls allowed as this represents a well placed and vicious strike.

2) If it takes the heroes longer than 2 turns (ie, the turn they were wounded and the turn after you rolled 4+) to get treatment to the hero (this will require another 6 anyway) then the treatment given is half as effective to represent that the hero has been bleeding out and is in a worse state than if they were seen to within 1 turn. Any treatment which only gives 1 wound is deemed to have failed to have any impact.

What do you think of those rules?

Sir_Turalyon
15-09-2010, 16:02
In my observation heroes wipe on their first adventure quite often. We solved it with rerolling the characters and attacking the same dungeon in waves, with fresh party coming to avenge the previous one, until one wave managed to complete the quest and go to settlement.

Once they get to town and buy themselves heavy armour and bandages they can really start adventuring. Waiting with spending money on level up until everybody has maxed out the basic armour, weapons and has some bandages / provisions works, too.

BigRob
15-09-2010, 20:47
The one rule I've never figured out was: if a monster kills you, you die at the end of the turn unless (say) the elf gets his healing potion to you. Except, the turn ends after the monster phase so the elf can't get to you. I've always played it that you got the following turn to try and save the poor schmuck.

But yeah, the first dungeon is awful.

Yes and no. Power phase, Warriors phase then its the monsters phase, then its the end phase.


You can use regular healing items and skills in the warriors phase. At any point in the turn the wizard may cast a defensive, healing or special spell. He may only cast attack spells during the warriors phase. At the very end of the end phase, when no more healing is permitted Fatal Damage is applied. Any warrior still on 0 wounds at this point is slain and can only be brought back with Ressurect/Gems of Life etc (which is why Fatal Damage is so good and only 2-3 monsters actually cause it...)

Therefore even after the monster phase, the wizard can cast a spell, hence why the Healing Hands for 2 power is the absoloute steal spell. That healing potion will go awful fast and sometimes the monsters love to get a good wound roll. It can also be a pain if your wizard player just wants to cast fireball the whole time and refuses to heal because then you will die...alot.

The first game is hard, you need tactics, luck and a decent starting wounds roll. See my "Easy difficulty setting" above. Then after the first game, go buy armour, when you have T3 and 6 points of armour that poor goblin doesnt have a hope :D

Morty
26-09-2010, 13:30
All good points by all.

I would alos add That players need to tjink carfully about party makeup befor starting, ovusly all taking spells casters of sume type or fance dandies such as the nodle is doming the party to an epic fail as the first set of bad rolls in the power phase will kill alot of players.

Try to keep the perty balanced.
Main spell caster, cast lots (and lots) of healing spells healing hands by pref at level 1, and try to keep out of trouble dont be afyed to run for it if things look dicey, remember that as long ast you are on the board and in the lantern light you can keep tho others up. Wizard, driuid, shaman all fit best in this role,
Casters Bodyguard, Basicaly works with the Melee Chricter to keep the wizard blocked in and away from combat, prefably moves befoe the wizard so that if an emergancy hapens he can get away. Dwarf, oger, Chaos warror, and troll slayer are all good here.
Melee Thumper, is the main char responsable for droping monsters that attack the party, High Str, dam and T are all good as you whant this char standing on the corner of the defense block, Barbarians, Ogers and Pitfighters are all good options these models need to move Before the wizard and are responcable for creating the pocket the Wizard will hide in as well as killinfg as much as they can when they can.
Support Char, this char has the unenvey able task of filling in for anything that is missing for the party or providing back up skills/spells, normaly an elf or speshalist human, they tend to be squshy classes and should take car so as to be standing next to the wall in a defencve block.


the ideal line up will be,

Melee thumper, Suport. Wall.

Bodygaurd, Wizard, Wall.

Door Space, Wall, Wall.
Just revers and invert as nesisery.

Btw by personal pref my group plays, Wizard(healer), Oger(Bodygaurd), Troll Slayer(thumper), and Snotling Team(suport).

BigRob
26-09-2010, 18:09
That is exactly the formation most of the people I have played Quest with soon adopt upon entering a room. With the wizard in the corner safe then the other warriors can protect him, which works up until the monsters have access to area effect weapons, spells and attacks at a higher level, then things get fun, but of course, by then, the wizard is tough enough to handle himself.

I suppose you could group the warriors by a type, for example, Tanks, Support, Thumper etc but most WHQ party combos will work. Sometimes it can be a little harder like a 4 man spellcaster party with Wizard, Elf Ranger Wizard, Warrior Priest and Someone like a Druid, Kislevite Shaman or other "spell caster type" although the hardest 4 man combo is really the fighty party. Trollslayer, Barbarian, Pit Fighter, Wardancer for example, while it will rampage though most of the rooms the lack of healing magic means once the supplies run out then you have had it. Makes for an interesting game though :)

Sir_Turalyon
27-09-2010, 15:55
party balance sure is important, we always played smaller size party with proportionaly scaled down monsters, with no wizard (so our healing ability was scaled to 0% ). Must try to play as healer one day.

Frogczar
30-09-2010, 22:25
Here are some quick house rules and suggestions to help alleviate this problem:

- Roll one d6 for power and one d6 for the "encounter" roll. That way if a 1 comes up on the "encounter" die, you are likely to have some power for critical healing spells. Alternately, use a d8 or d10 instead of a d6 for the power die, a 1 comes up less frequently and there is more power for critical spells.

- Every hero starts with a single, permanent luck token to help prevent random party deaths/traps from happening during the first outing.

- Give each player an additional healing potion to begin with.

-Frog

Inchpractice
30-09-2010, 23:40
Assuming it doesn't all go badly wrong, how many dungeons does it normally take to get to level 2?

I am asking because I am taking the game around my sisters at the weekend (first chance to play the game since rebuying it :D ) and I am taking my level 1 monsters there and wasn't planning on taking any level 2 I have but if you can get there after 1 dungeon then I might.

BigRob
01-10-2010, 11:56
Totally depends on the group, dungeon length and treasure. You might end up rolling an objective room treasure that is no good to the warrior who gets it, but is worth 2000 gold for example. I wouldn't worry about taking the extra monsters, instead use the ones you have and promote one of them to a champion or level 1 wizard. Even at level 2 the heroes are still quite weak.


The real power, as mentioned above, comes once the heroes have worked out they need to buy as much armour as possible, plenty of mundane healing and have a few decent bits of treasure each. Once you have a couple of quests down and the elf starts getting his elven armour, the wizard has his power staff, the dwarf is packing more flashpowder and firebombs than you can shake a snotling at and the barbarian has swopped the loincloth for heavy armour, helmet and shield they will be more than capable of looking after themselves. Then the monster fun can begin!

Inchpractice
03-10-2010, 01:55
Well we had a really long dungeon and we all died in the objective room with no thanks to rolling a 1 in the objective room power phase which added 7 Dark Elves to a minotaur and 12 Orcs. It was very hard and we were using my adapted monster battle table from the roleplay book and the dungeon event table in the roleplay book which didn't help.

The best moment was when my Elf Ranger got stuck down a pit and we had no rope or levitation spell. I thought I was done for but we threw a 2 after the trap event and another monster event spawned. The 3 of them beat them and when we got the dungeon room treasure card out of all the packs shuffled (1,2 and 3) the one we pulled was the levitation potion and I was saved :eek::D:cool: We were absolutely amazed by the odds and the moment, classic.

Our party was an Elf Ranger, Chaos Warrior, Barbarian and a wizard and we were so unlucky many times. What made it worse was that the Chaos Warriors WS dropped to 1 when the power phase is a 1. He is so unpredictable.

We rolled lots of 1's and the dwarf miner managed to successfully curse 3 out of 4 of us when we killed him and we had lots of rounds where everybody missed in combat.

It was alot of fun although my sisters boyfriend wasn't that impressed as he said that you were not in much control and that there wasn't alot you can do for yourself beyond randomness. Me and my sis liked it alot though.

BigRob
03-10-2010, 11:41
Very unlucky for the chaos warrior to get that attribute but certainly should have been a powerful and well rounded party which would have had a higher than average chance of success what with 2 good fighters, the Elf ranger and a wizard too.

Next time if its the first dungeon stick to the event cards, the table in the book can be a little harsh (pit trap doing 4D6 wounds as an example!). Get that first game in and then start on the book stuff when your warriors have had a good chance to get started.

Inchpractice
12-10-2010, 19:49
With the amount of 1's we threw he ended up being dumb alot. Luckily he had another attribute which gives him some auto hits each dungeon. He also had a thing where if a 6 was thrown he can cast a spell and he gave us some free defence protection because of it. He is an unpredictale character though that is for sure.

It was a great party and we only died because of extra monsters in the objective room due to a 1. I had a torrid time only starting on 9 wounds and had to face a 3d6 wounds stone fall on the first room which nearly killed me. The barbarian is an absolute beast who kills everything in sight, he surely has to be the best hero?

I will take your advice next time and do the first dungeon with just the standard event cards to help get us through and then go to the roleplay book in the second dungeon if we make it.

BigRob
12-10-2010, 23:22
TBH I'd stick to the cards until you have been playing a few games, when your level 2 then you can start to move up to the book events. They can be very harsh for a low level party.

Barbarian is ok, he is not the most powerful warrior but he is very good at what he does, so is the dwarf when he gets going, he suffers from the low I, when he gets to go, everything else is dead! The elf is probably the weakest of the 4 initial heroes. The most powerful character...well that depends on who you ask and what you roll. My Lord of Anerion got some nice training rolls and by level 6 ended up with 10A but he still only had about 16 wounds so if he didn't kill everything he was in trouble.

Of your party, TBH the chaos warrior is the weak link because he is so unpredictable with his gifts.

Inchpractice
13-10-2010, 03:12
Ok so maybe the best idea would be to stick to the card events but move onto the monster battle tables after the second dungeon. I spent alot of money new enemies so I want to face them in level 1 even if it is tough going. I will wait until level 2 for the book events though.

What is the rule for attacking and moving. If you have say 2 attacks and you manage to take out the 3 monsters adjacent to you in your first attack are you allowed to move before your second attack or must you do all movement before your first attack?

BigRob
13-10-2010, 10:22
Oh yeah, use the monster tables for the level your characters are at, I'd just leave the event table for now. There are 10 Monster tables but only one event table and while a 4D6W spiked pit trap is an inconvience at level 6 its lethal at level 1.

Movement is done before combat, if you kill everything in base combat and have attacks left over then they are lost this turn. There are exceptions with skills and certain treasure items. The Wardancers initial skill "Dance of Death" allows him to do this for example and is why he is so nasty against hordes of small weak enemies.

Inchpractice
13-10-2010, 15:58
That's how we were playing it so no mess up there. I have all the wardancer gear but I don't have the model, I really want it, especially now as he has that skill.

BigRob
13-10-2010, 20:30
Any wardancer model is useable, the official one is not all that. He is a very good character but you need to kill everything in base contact as he is very flimsy and his magic belt is no real protection, especially once your past level 2-3.

Inchpractice
13-10-2010, 20:41
I have seen the wardancer lord model in the current GW range but I still prefer the original model. Do you have any other suggestions for the model?

Daemonslave
13-10-2010, 21:46
If your not a fan of the current wardancer models perhaps you could convert an Eldar harlequin.