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arthurfallz
01-01-2011, 12:10
So hours of modelling and playing has got my 10 and 9 year-olds interested in Warhammer Fantasy, or at least miniature wargaming in general.

What I am curious about is would the Island of Blood set be a worthwhile pick-up for them? I think it would be a good start (I don't intend on expanding the armies much), something to get them used to the rules.

As a secondary question, is 40k more direct and easy for their age range? I noticed the last time I visited a GW store that the youngin' were mostly playing 40k; if this is the case, how's the starter for 40k?

As a final consideration, is there an alternate wargame that would be easier on the pocket and easy/fun to get them into? The biggest advantage to IoB WHFB is that they would have modest forces to field against my friends and my own army.

Haravikk
01-01-2011, 12:31
The Island of Blood starter is a good set, but as a starter set it's a bit funny as the forces aren't very well balanced at all, mostly due to the High Elf lord on Griffon, as you end up with a ~200 point advantage to the High Elves. So if you do go for it then you might want to grab something to bolster the Skaven, or an alternate hero for the High Elves (as removing the Griffon entirely swings the points difference the other way).

Otherwise it's pretty good, as you get most of the essentials, and the mini-rulebook is great. The bestiary is just about playable if you don't have the armies books, with an online supplement that helps a bit more with how you should play some of the models.

I suppose the real questions are; do they prefer the idea of 40k or fantasy, and do they actually like High Elves or Skaven? The first question really is important, as while 40k probably is a little easier to get into, I think a lot of kids start with it because it's just "cooler" to many of them on account of tanks etc., fantasy isn't really that much harder to get into. Fantasy does however require a lot more models typically, as you want to build regiments rather than small squads, so that's another consideration.
With regards to the armies; for Skaven and High Elf players the Island of Blood set is great as the models are really nice, but if you don't want those armies then you can easily get the other stuff (mini-rulebook, simple templates, etc.) from eBay. The mini rulebook is invaluable for anyone I think, as the main book is rather unwieldy for adults let alone kids :D

kyussinchains
01-01-2011, 13:00
have you looked at kings of war by mantic? very simple ruleset (only 12 pages) which is 100% free to download, and comes in every set, and the starter set 'mhorgoth's revenge' is only 40 at some places (http://www.totalwargamer.co.uk/mhorgoths-revenge-fantasy-battleset.html) you get two armies, including some very very good zombie and ghoul models (both are superior to GW offerings in my opinion)

the models are generally very good, much cheaper than GW equivalents and as they're 28mm scale, they can be used in WFB with minimum hassle!

Island of blood is a little bit odd, the armies are unbalanced, with the high elves having quite a few more points. As far as I'm aware, there are no advanced rules for either army included, so you'd need to pick up two 15-20 army books to utilise the models to their fullest extent....

theorox
01-01-2011, 13:32
I'd probably get the IoB and then expand it (eventually) with more Seaguard, some clanrats/slaves, and some more ratogres or something like that. :)

Makes for small but nice forces.

Theo

mrtn
01-01-2011, 13:56
I suppose the real questions are; do they prefer the idea of 40k or fantasy, and do they actually like High Elves or Skaven?

Yes, ask your kids what they want, not random strangers on the interwebs. :)

rodmillard
01-01-2011, 13:57
have you looked at kings of war by mantic? very simple ruleset (only 12 pages) which is 100% free to download, and comes in every set, and the starter set 'mhorgoth's revenge' is only 40 at some places (http://www.totalwargamer.co.uk/mhorgoths-revenge-fantasy-battleset.html) you get two armies, including some very very good zombie and ghoul models (both are superior to GW offerings in my opinion)


Kings of War is very beginner-friendly, and is designed for fast play (meaning little people won't get bored and wander off halfway through your turn). The Mantic minis are, in general, better for little people as well (fewer small parts to break off), although that might not be an issue with IoB - I haven't seen the minis in person. And the best thing is that you can pick up the GW rules and transfer the armies straight across, since everything that comes in the Mhorgoth's Revenge box has an equivalent in warhammer, although you would need some character models as well. Sadly that doesn't work in reverse, since if you buy the IoB box there is no equivalent to skaven in the Kings Of War rules (yet).

I would also recommend the Lord of the Rings SBG for children of that age. Being skirmish based you have a very low entry cost, and again the rules are designed for fast play meaning less chance of them getting bored and wandering off to play X-box. Its also great for younger kids to feel like they're acting out scenes from the movies...

arthurfallz
01-01-2011, 14:14
Naturally what the kids want factors into it, but considering the size of the investment and their unfamiliarity with the rules, I want a little insight from others before I shell out $100 for something that isn't that functional. They're expressed interest in both 40k and fantasy. I am a huge fan of LOTR, but not sure the skirmish level would be their bag.

yabbadabba
01-01-2011, 14:17
At 9 and 10 years old balance is not a worry. Nor are additional forces, advanced rules or anything else. Any of GW's core games are a good game without the need for additional investment, especially if you are already a hobbyist!

Best bet is to let them pick what they like - SciFi, Historical, Fantasy - and take it from there. If that isn't an option then get them into what you like. Nothing helps kids more than an enthusiastic and supportive parent/relative. As long as your 10 and 9 year old like what they have, and have you helping and supporting them then seriously, anything will be ok.

Good luck Fella :D

the_slosh
01-01-2011, 14:24
agree with yabbadabba, pick the ones they think are the coolest. Both IoB (although a bit more pricey) and AoBR are pretty decent starters. all the models are very straightforward to put together and could be fun for them to clip 40 clanrats from the sprues :D (And GW did put a complete list for all the units/characters from IoB on their website)

Haravikk
01-01-2011, 17:52
At 9 and 10 years old balance is not a worry.
I think balance is still a bit of a concern, as it'll be no fun if one really likes Skaven if they then have a disadvantage every game! Though you can use pretty much anything you want to balance the forces if cost is an issue, nothing stops Skaven bringing an ally :)

arthurfallz
01-01-2011, 18:11
I have a Troll from my BfSP I could throw in as well, which might balance out the Skaven side. Thanks for all the insight and suggestions! :chrome:

yabbadabba
01-01-2011, 18:30
I think balance is still a bit of a concern, as it'll be no fun if one really likes Skaven if they then have a disadvantage every game! Nah, balance is really unimportant for that age. Whats important is fun and unless kids get straight into it they will want to swap armies etc.
What is important is the fun, the looks and don't get too hung up on rules. Of course this is all generalisations, I have known kids at that age with an encyclopaedic knowledge of 40K!

Jind_Singh
01-01-2011, 18:58
Either way both the core game systems are great. Gamewise, now anyway, there isn't that much of a difference between the two, though Warhammer still has more rules to pick up.

As starter sets both do a fine job - they both give you two armies to go toe-to-toe with each other.

Both have their strange factors - 40k gives the Orcs 3 Deffcopptas to take out a dread and 5 terminators! With both you'd have to supplement the evil armies with a small purchase to balance out the forces, but even as they are they can be picked up and gamed with very easy.

It's all about which of the game systems appeals most to the kids - I'd actually take them both down to GW and get them to play a few demos of the games.

Don't be shy about doing LOTR demo either - it's actually great system as they start off with a handful of models and do LOTR, but as their collection grows all you need is the WOTR book and BANG - large scale army madness and fun.

WOTR is a VERY fun game system, I have just over 2000pts of a Dwarf throng.

Either way they won't be disapointed, value wise both Warhammer and 40k starter sets offer great value for money, and it's actually fine you don't intend to expand either the HE or Skaven (if you go Warhammer) as they then provide EXCELLENT painting training armies! What better way to learn how to paint than on armies you won't care about afterwards!

wilsongrahams
01-01-2011, 19:06
40k appeals more due to it's guns and armour - just like computer games. Fantasy appeals to others for it's swords, but that seems less popular. You should speak to your kids as suggested. My step-son loves both, but is more into space marines than high elves despite understanding the mechanics of fantasy better due to models actually being in contact (and not up to 2" away) to fight in combat.

I bought both starter sets for my step son over the past few years and he has then added equally to both as time goes by. To play out of the box, 40k really requires some terrain or the orks will be shot to death every time. For fantasy, terrain matters little with these small forces as there isn't enough to maneuvere about much, but the skaven benefit from a mission objective other than kill each other!
The intro game in my local store deployed the elves in the middle of the table defending a well, and the skaven deployed all around. All the skaven had to do was to reach the well to poison it. This way, whilst the elves can slaughter the skaven in close combat without much hassle, they must also deal with larger numbers and engage all threats at once. Try it.

What I would do however, is purely to even up the starting forces in the box even if you don't intend to get larger armies, and get the skaven a stormvermin regiment. That gives them halberds which are a good extra weapon not used by any other unit in the starting forces so is worth learning. It also bolsters the rats numbers and allows them to maneuvere for advantage easier.

Alternatively you could get a doomwheel but the rules for these are complex and involved for use in a starter game and you'd need the army book for sure then. For stormvermin you won't even need the points value (just trust me that it evens it up) and all you need is the stats in the back of the rule book, and the assumption by looking at the model that they have heavy armour and a halberd, and by checking the assembly instructions, you can give them shields too if you want.

tezdal
01-01-2011, 23:08
Good Intro for Rich Kids.

Wil Grand
01-01-2011, 23:10
have you looked at kings of war by mantic? very simple ruleset (only 12 pages) which is 100% free to download, and comes in every set, and the starter set 'mhorgoth's revenge' is only 40 at some places (http://www.totalwargamer.co.uk/mhorgoths-revenge-fantasy-battleset.html) you get two armies, including some very very good zombie and ghoul models (both are superior to GW offerings in my opinion)

the models are generally very good, much cheaper than GW equivalents and as they're 28mm scale, they can be used in WFB with minimum hassle!

Island of blood is a little bit odd, the armies are unbalanced, with the high elves having quite a few more points. As far as I'm aware, there are no advanced rules for either army included, so you'd need to pick up two 15-20 army books to utilise the models to their fullest extent....


Got to agree with this!

lowix
04-01-2011, 20:16
I play with my 8 year old son.
Let him look though the armies and see which one he wants. I prefer fantasy, my son can get most of the rules, but he doesn't get the strategy.
Also he gets board after about 1.5 hours. Fantasy takes 2-4 hours to play.
40k is easier, if he likes sci fi rather than fantasy.
I would also look at Kings of War, Reapers Warlords, or Warmachine/Hordes. All of these games play shorter and hold my son’s attention better.
Also see if there is a group of people in the area that play one over the other with a kid friendly atmosphere.
If I had to pick I would recommend Warmahcine/Hordes, buying two starter boxes (about $40 MSRP each). Let them pick the starter box and go.

Ratbeast
04-01-2011, 21:52
Naturally what the kids want factors into it, but considering the size of the investment and their unfamiliarity with the rules, I want a little insight from others before I shell out $100 for something that isn't that functional. They're expressed interest in both 40k and fantasy. I am a huge fan of LOTR, but not sure the skirmish level would be their bag.

LOTR is a kinda failed game GW keeps throwing time and effort at, in the hope it will take off, lol everyone games shop ive been too has had heaps of warhammer and 40k players, and maybe if your lucky 1 LOTR player

Terrenord
07-02-2013, 20:09
I play both Fantasy and 40 k with my son, but I play over a series of days. Say like a turn of two every night after dinner. He's nine and that's just long enough for him to be interested, and want to come back the next night to fight.

shakedown47
07-02-2013, 21:34
My suggestion would be to turn to Ebay and buy the skaven contents of the IoB set, as well as the dwarf contents of the previous set. You'll have to do a bit of finagling to match them up, of course, but it will still be much better balanced than the stock IoB set. Or, if you don't wish to own a hardcopy BRB, purchase the IoB box, then Ebay the dwarves and keep the HE, and that way you'll end up with some dice and a floppy book AND a small, spare starter army of HE.

taylor21
08-02-2013, 14:59
The 8th edition of Island of blood is very good development of this game as it include the easily a similar standard to their regular plastic models.