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View Full Version : Dark Eldar Super Heavies ??? [CLOSED]



kabalite
01-01-2011, 19:37
Ok I'm just wondering about the subject of Dark eldar super heavy equipment. Now I know logicly they probly wouldn't use many heavy vehicals ,but it stands to reason that in their raids the Dark Kin would come up aginst some large vehicals of the Imperium or for that matter any other race. So to the point ,what if any super heavy would the Dark Eldar have??

Korraz
01-01-2011, 20:22
I'm having a déjà vu. The must have changed the Matrix.

If the Dark Eldar come up against the big stuf...they don't fight it. They don't hang around and give the enemy the opportunity to bring his big guns. And if they have to, they dispose it by sneaky means, dark matter stuff and the usual equipment.

eyescrossed
01-01-2011, 20:24
Like that Apocalypse formation with all the Ravagers.

AlexHolker
01-01-2011, 20:26
Now I know logicly they probly wouldn't use many heavy vehicals ,but it stands to reason that in their raids the Dark Kin would come up aginst some large vehicals of the Imperium or for that matter any other race. So to the point ,what if any super heavy would the Dark Eldar have??
If they're performing raids rather than trying to hold ground, and they have the advantage of speed and stealth, they shouldn't be coming up against large vehicles unless they do something horribly wrong. Even if they do, the whole point of asymmetric warfare is that you counter your enemy's strengths with your strengths, not your weaknesses. Dark Eldar trying to fight Imperial superheavies with their own is like challenging a bear to a wrestling match, instead of just using a gun like a normal person.

Olja
01-01-2011, 21:00
Until recently, the DE line has stagnated. Until about four months ago some people didn't think the DE would revised. Just wait, I'm sure Forgeworld will make something for them. ;)

MajorWesJanson
01-01-2011, 21:27
Until recently, the DE line has stagnated. Until about four months ago some people didn't think the DE would revised. Just wait, I'm sure Forgeworld will make something for them. ;)

Especially since FW now can use the new styling. Likely they didn't make anything before because GW told them not to while Jes was working on redoing the line.

Fw could make a lot of stuff- large haemonucleus creations, heavy talos, sail barges, heavier bombers, heavy jetbikes, more mercenaries for the archons court, ect.

Rabid Bunny 666
01-01-2011, 22:01
What do you call a Dark Eldar Superheavy?

AV12

Whilst I don't like the idea of a Dark Eldar Superheavies (i'd rather see some smaller craft based on the Raider chassis) i'm interested to see what GW or FW can do.

Ozybonza
01-01-2011, 22:13
Yeah I'd say that FW could definitely make some nice flyer or more interesting vehicle options for DE, but super heavies just wouldn't feel right.

SgtTaters
01-01-2011, 22:41
a big evil version of the Revenant Titan would be nice

yeah yeah stealth surprised speed raiders etc., giant evil robots are cool.
and DE are all about being stylish killers.

Stilton
01-01-2011, 23:23
If they're performing raids rather than trying to hold ground, and they have the advantage of speed and stealth, they shouldn't be coming up against large vehicles unless they do something horribly wrong.

That's not true, at all. It depends entirely on the situation at hand.

I'm rather surprised at the negative responses. It's almost as if the OP asked for opinions on a lumbering Dark Eldar Baneblade-equivalent. Just take a look at what the CWE have in their arsenals. Really big things that are just as gracious as their smaller counterparts. I'd love to see a multi-decked Dark Eldar super-barge with a whole heap of sails, transporting multiple squads allowed a drop-down assault-disembark during fly-overs. :)

Defcon
02-01-2011, 03:39
Vect's weekend Strip-crusin' pimpmobile should be a DE Superheavy.

I know there is the Dais, but is it REALLY indicative of the sort of thing Vect would come into battle with?

AlexHolker
02-01-2011, 04:17
It depends entirely on the situation at hand.
No, it doesn't. Unlike the CWE, the DE do not hold ground. They do not capture territory. Their objectives aren't even limited enough that they can't just go somewhere else. A superheavy tank is simply irrelevant, because they are neither fast nor numerous enough to stop the Dark Eldar getting their way.

Mannimarco
02-01-2011, 04:24
Personally Ive always thought that if the DE are fighting the battles we create on the tabletop then their raid has gone horribly wrong.

This is just a rehash of a previous topic where sombody posted a link to a youtube video where the designers were talking about the new DE. We see the raid on the table, what we dont see is the great big skiffs floating around above the battlefield so the above mentioned super sized barge does have some merit.

eldargal
02-01-2011, 06:19
Already been discussed here (http://www.warseer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=285993).
To settle this again, yes Dark Eldar most certainly do use large 'super heavy*' vehicles:

Yes, they absolutely do, Jes Goodwin refers to giant slave barges (and something else, from memory, giant raider perhaps?) hovering above the battlefield in one of the Dark Eldar video talk things. There is also a picture of one, beneath the Ravager on its box art:
http://www.games-workshop.com/MEDIA_CustomProductCatalog/m1420352a_99120112011_DERavagerXBox1_873x627.jpg
I think the confusion comes about because people conflate 'super heavy', a game term meaning unusually large vehicles with a heavier (more) firepower capacity with being large, heavy and unwieldy. Which is really only the case for Orks and the Imperium.

And:

Here we are:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8d9ed6okRXo
6:40-6:50 or thereabouts Jes Discusses 'raiders and slave barges, this size (indicates large size).

Dark Eldar have superheavy(or large) vehicles. The End.:)


*For Eldar, perhaps better to think of them as 'super large' rather than heavy.

Stilton
03-01-2011, 07:42
No, it doesn't.

Yes. It. Does.


Unlike the CWE, the DE do not hold ground. They do not capture territory.

... which has absolutely nothing at all whatsoever to do with coming up against superheavies or not.


Their objectives aren't even limited enough that they can't just go somewhere else. A superheavy tank is simply irrelevant, because they are neither fast nor numerous enough to stop the Dark Eldar getting their way.

That is where you are mistaken. You act as if all the Dark Eldar ever do in realspace, exclusively, is going after civilians for the purpose of enslavement.

There is an infinite amount of possible scenarios and objectives more convoluted than that. I would suggest reading p16-17 of C:DE. They detail Lady Malys going after an STC. What if the High Fabricator had secured himself in the midst of a few Titans, awaiting planetary extraction via means of an escort convoy yet more secure? It is really not that hard at all to imagine a scenario where specific objectives and circumstances would force the Dark Eldar to directly engage enemy superheavies.

MajorWesJanson
03-01-2011, 10:24
A superheavy tank is simply irrelevant, because they are neither fast nor numerous enough to stop the Dark Eldar getting their way.

Superheavy =/= superheavy tank.

Dark Eldar do not use baneblade analogues, but plenty of other options:
Talos -> Gargantuan creature version
Voidraven Bomber -> Superheavy flier like the Eldar Vampire
Ravager/Dais -> Superheavy Skimmer/Sail Barge
Beastmaster creatures -> Monstrous and gargantuan creature options

AlexHolker
03-01-2011, 10:58
Superheavy =/= superheavy tank.
Enemy superheavy =/= DE superheavy.

The OP was using "What if they need to fight an enemy superheavy?" as an argument. That is what I was addressing.

Kulgur
03-01-2011, 17:50
Would Dark Eldar have superheavies? Probably
Would a Dark Eldar superheavy be anything like Ork/Imperial style? Absolutely not

Closest equivalent army I can think of would be Tau (and on that note, if I see one more thread saying Tau should have a gundam style superheavy, I may just scream). The superheavy would have speed, force fields, and most likely be a skimmer rather than the stereotypical heavily armoured clanking monstrousities that the imperium puts out. Dark Eldar, like Tau, would fight for an objective rather than ground and would tend toward rapid engagements where rapid redployment is more important than durability.

Moscovian
04-01-2011, 20:06
Going to jump in here with something provocative from the Epic side of the 40K universe. A group of us authored a fan supplement called Epic: Raiders which features Dark Eldar and (big surprise) those DE have super-heavies.
http://www.tacticalwargames.net/archive/rules/epic/raiders.html
I personally handed a copy of this book to Jervis Johnson about 2 1/2 years ago. While it is ONLY speculation, the idea that the 'fan made' pub Goodwin is referring to is Raiders. Given that one of the iconic super-heavies from the Epic supplement is called a "Barge of Pleasure", it is entirely possible.

Also, the direction we took with the fiction in Raiders seems very much in line with everything GW is doing right now with the DE.

Not taking credit for everything DE, just pointing out a possible (probable?) influence and that GW is at the very least thinking along the same lines.

Oh, we added a DE titan too (see the cover).

Friedrich von Offenbach
04-01-2011, 23:44
I think the problem with dark eldar and super heavies is that their combat style does not mix. Its like the veit cong having an aircraft carrier, how are they going to dissappear with such a massive thing!

Rabid Bunny 666
05-01-2011, 00:07
Going to jump in here with something provocative from the Epic side of the 40K universe. A group of us authored a fan supplement called Epic: Raiders which features Dark Eldar and (big surprise) those DE have super-heavies.

Aah, i've seen this a few times before, never realised there was a free download. I see you've got the Razorwing as a bomber like it is in BFG, i'm not too sure why GW changed it to a fighter for the tabletop version.

theunwantedbeing
05-01-2011, 00:29
I think the problem with dark eldar and super heavies is that their combat style does not mix. Its like the veit cong having an aircraft carrier, how are they going to dissappear with such a massive thing!

The difference with the viet cong and the dark eldar being that the dark eldar have a whole other dimension and a laughable ease of interstellar travel to use, rather than a small jungle where anything bigger than a large tree just isn't hideable.

If they did have a humanoid titan it would probably look a lot like TheEND from Eureka seven.

Ozendorph
05-01-2011, 00:32
I imagine they'd have larger aerospace "mother ships" they launch their raiders and ravagers from. Makes me think of the Reaver ships from Firefly, replete with harpoons and grapple-cannons, but obviously a bit more elegant.

Hellebore
05-01-2011, 01:34
As the good Major has already said, a superheavy vehicle doesn't equate to a superheavy tank and really doesn't even need to be 'heavy'.

The Revenant titan is hardly what one would call 'superheavy' and is extremely agile and fast.

It would be a perfect large vehicle for use by dark eldar as it epitomises quick strikes with overwhelming fire power (although underwhelming compared to warhound turbolasers).

I also think a giant alien beast would be cool (I believe the Raiders supplement has one) - even a captured Heirophant. That would be cool.

Hellebore

Moscovian
05-01-2011, 11:53
Yup - Raiders added several elements we felt still kept with the theme of the Dark Eldar. A giant arena beast that they actually set loose on the battlefield and it does its own thing (including attacking DE if it gets close enough). As Ozendorph describes, we put in an Executor transport ship that is used to gather slaves and other materials from worlds where there are no gates. The Barge of Pleasure, Vessel of Pain (another super-heavy), the Tormentor titan, and the Perditor (large Talos).

In Epic, they have bombers and fighter-bombers: our Razorwing is a fighter-bomber so it still has fighter characteristics. We also have a Slavebringer, a Vampire-transport equivalent.

Anyone who likes the DE would probably enjoy perusing through the pictures. You don't have to be an Epic player to enjoy them. If you have any interest, follow the link in my sig. You'll find DE at the very beginning of the book and in the modeling section (about 30 pages of pictures on how to convert DE for Epic), not to mention a bunch of excellent pictures and artwork throughout. I know it's a big download, but Epic is a big game... :)

carldooley
05-01-2011, 12:00
maybe something like the Halo Scarab, except with Slaves stretched across the joints and a psychic beacon on top (in place of the cannon) that transmits the slaves' pain, agony, and despair to anyone under a Flamestorm or other template.

in game you could use a soulgrinder or Defiler with slaves impaled on the spikes with alchemical apparatuses keeping them alive.

I know that the Scarab or Defiler or Soulgrinder slow plodding nature doesn't fit terribly well with the DE playstyle, but with the thought that anything facing it would likely be fleeing in terror rather than firing it rather does. ;)

actually, a Sentinel's Body is just the right size to go where a Defiler's torso is supposed to go. I might do a conversion for giggles and see how it turns out. I'm thinking Defiler Legs & DCCW (with impaled slaves), a Scout Sentinel torso with a DE HQ (maybe a cut up Urien Rakarth for the proper effect) sitting in the seat, surrounded by crucified figures (like those on penitent engines).

Hrw-Amen
09-01-2011, 21:59
I've just posted some new photos in the gallery of my OOP Dark Eldar. I had a bigger 'Heavy Raider' that i made as a conversion. I'm not sure it falls into the Super Heavy category, (It is about the size of the Malcador.) maybe just 'Heavy.'

I made it at the same time that the Vect vehicle was released as that just appeared so flimsy and unsatisfactory.

Perhaps a heavier skimmer of this type could/would be useful for taking out bigger targets, it still fits with the DE style and could be just as quick and agile as the smaller raiders.

http://www.warseer.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=9244&cat=500&ppuser=34952

http://www.warseer.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=9248&ppuser=34952

Bremenwright
20-08-2014, 03:06
I was reading throughout the DE codex and there is a mention of the children of bone. Maybe their mega large grotesques may be the superheavies, I can't think of anything else at the moment

Horus38
20-08-2014, 15:02
Dark Eldar have no problem going against super heavies. In the new timeline Vect leads a month long raid against a forge world held by titans which leaves the place in ruins.

Krucifus
20-08-2014, 15:15
Nice thread revival here, a good 3 years?

Though it is funny looking back and seeing people rage over the idea of Tau having giant gundam style robots.

Horus38
20-08-2014, 17:32
Nice thread revival here, a good 3 years?

Lol whoops, didn't even realize Bremenwright had revived it! But the new background development with Vect is actually a good data point for people wondering about this topic.

philbrad2
20-08-2014, 19:37
Let it lie

PhilB
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