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Ealdwulf
03-02-2011, 20:22
So, I've always sort of dug the Ultramarines. I play Dark Eldar, but doesn't every player have to own a small marine army (That's in the rules somewhere right? :-p ). Anyways I've also always sort of disliked the electric blue uniforms of the Ultramarines, and wanted to find a fluff reason for making their uniforms red.

So looking through several items of fluff I discovered that one of the Ultramar planets, Konor, is an Adeptus Mechanicus world. So I thought to myself, maybe these guys would paint their uniforms deep red in honour of the Adeptus Mechanicus being a primary feature on their planet.

After telling my buddy this, he pointed out that the Adeptus Mechanicus has its own body of troops to fight for them, and though the Tech Priest DO train on Mars they are a specialized troop. Which is indeed a valid point.

My question is this: How do I justify painting Ultramarines red? And would it be reasonable that a Ultramarine unit on Konor (A Research World) would paint their uniforms red.

What do you guys think?

Dark Aly
03-02-2011, 20:42
Why not just create your own chapter? you can even use the same models and symbol if thats what you like. If you like the fluff then I don't know.

pigsey1972
03-02-2011, 20:44
it states clearly in the codex that any model can be any chapter or color, i see no reason not to have red ultramarines, also tech marines are red and they are sent to mars for training, yours could just be sent to konor instaed

neko
03-02-2011, 20:45
If you want to stick to the fluff (which I'm guessing you do, otherwise you could just paint them however you like), I would just make them a successor chapter instead. You still get to use the same rules and the like - the only difference is the paint job and whatever name you decide to call the new chapter.

Ealdwulf
03-02-2011, 20:46
I thought about this first. My main reason for choosing Ultramarines was that a lot of the work is done for you. In that you don't have to hand craft new shoulder pads, or scour the net looking for them.

Also why would another chapter have the same essential logo as the Ultramarines? I realize this is really deep fluff for an army, and in the end it doesn't really matter, it's just a fun talking point and way to theme the army.

TheWarmaster
03-02-2011, 20:46
Check out sons of orar: http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Sons_of_Orar

WildWeasel
03-02-2011, 21:10
In the later years of M37, the Ultramarines 3rd Company was on a multi-chapter Crusade against the Jemifax Heresy, routing it out from over a hundred worlds, and chasing the Word Bearer traitors that were behind it. This Crusade was under the command of the Blood Angel Chapter master, Apollonus. During the twelfth year of the Crusade, the 3rd Company was supporting Apollonus and his First Company on the blighted world of Narinus.

While the Blood Angel Terminators held the tides of crazed fanatics back, Apollonus lead the Ultramarines in a strike against the palace-fortress of the Arch-Heretic of Narinus. They were too late, as he and his follows had just completed a great ritual infusing the Arch-Heretic with the power of the warp and the unbridled favor of Nurgle. In the ensuing fight, the thing that was the Arch-Heretic was destroyed, but only by Apollonus accepting a mortal wound to weaken the Arch-Heretic, allowing the Ultramarines to finish it off.

In honor of Apollonus's bravery and heroic sacrifice, for the remainder of the Jemifax Crusade, the Ultramarine 3rd Company painted their armor red, and the veterans of that action worked a bit of red into their heraldry for the rest of the careers.

Viola!

Yes, I made all that up (in case anyone was wondering). 40K encompasses 10,000 years of conflict across an entire galaxy. A company of red Ultramarines wandering about for a decade or two isn't even a blip.

Ealdwulf
03-02-2011, 21:20
In the later years of M37, the Ultramarines 3rd Company was on a multi-chapter Crusade against the Jemifax Heresy, routing it out from over a hundred worlds, and chasing the Word Bearer traitors that were behind it. This Crusade was under the command of the Blood Angel Chapter master, Apollonus. During the twelfth year of the Crusade, the 3rd Company was supporting Apollonus and his First Company on the blighted world of Narinus.

While the Blood Angel Terminators held the tides of crazed fanatics back, Apollonus lead the Ultramarines in a strike against the palace-fortress of the Arch-Heretic of Narinus. They were too late, as he and his follows had just completed a great ritual infusing the Arch-Heretic with the power of the warp and the unbridled favor of Nurgle. In the ensuing fight, the thing that was the Arch-Heretic was destroyed, but only by Apollonus accepting a mortal wound to weaken the Arch-Heretic, allowing the Ultramarines to finish it off.

In honor of Apollonus's bravery and heroic sacrifice, for the remainder of the Jemifax Crusade, the Ultramarine 3rd Company painted their armor red, and the veterans of that action worked a bit of red into their heraldry for the rest of the careers.

Viola!

Yes, I made all that up (in case anyone was wondering). 40K encompasses 10,000 years of conflict across an entire galaxy. A company of red Ultramarines wandering about for a decade or two isn't even a blip.

Ha ha Dude that is FANTASTIC! That is seriously awesome. I am copy/pasting and saving that. Well done my friend.

Tavendale
03-02-2011, 21:53
WildWeasel, your post is my favourite I've seen on Warseer.

You make up a nice bit of custom fluff. You kept it simple, reasoned and well explained.

Most importantly, you helped out the OP, who seems to have really appreciated your post.

Really enjoyed this thread :)

CoolKidRoc
03-02-2011, 21:58
WWMCS - What would Marneus Calgar Say?

Tokamak
03-02-2011, 22:05
If you asked an art teacher if ultramarine can be red he would laugh in your face.

Ealdwulf
03-02-2011, 22:06
If you asked an art teacher if ultramarine can be red he would laugh in your face.

I am an art teacher...

ha ha, totally kidding. If you asked an English teacher he would want to know WHY they were red and not blue.

The Custodian
03-02-2011, 23:06
Another idea is that your ultras colored their armor a different color for a long siege campaign or something where the red camouflages better than the blue. I know its a stretch but it would make sense that they use logic and try to disguise/camo themselves

CoolKidRoc
03-02-2011, 23:12
Do any of the paint armor schemes have anything to do with Camouflage?

ObiWan
03-02-2011, 23:22
WildWeasel your explanation is great!

WildWeasel
03-02-2011, 23:37
Thanks guys! :D

That's the beauty of 40K as a gaming and hobby setting, it's so stonking huge that it's easy to drop weird bits like that in.

And red Ultramarines would look really boss, especially with some of the fancier UM specific metal minis.

AngelofSorrow
03-02-2011, 23:38
There is the sons of guilliman which have a name and no official color scheme. I can imagine they would use the same chapter icon. There more than a few chapters that use the fist and hand icons. So why not multiples of the ultramarine symbol

tezdal
03-02-2011, 23:41
Just play World Eaters....they are kinda like Red Ultramarines right?

Chapters Unwritten
03-02-2011, 23:42
This reminds me of a fun bit from my past: I briefly flirted with the idea of doing red ultras myself, but in addition I wanted to take Calgar in the list and change his name to "Carneus Malgar."

neko
04-02-2011, 00:03
Do any of the paint armor schemes have anything to do with Camouflage?
Some marines use camo (to help better stay alive to bring the Emperor's justice to his enemies), and some marines don't (some rubbish about it being too cowardly). One example of this was the article on the Badab rebellion in one of the Rogue Trader expansions. I'm not sure if this has been carried over to the more recent FW take of the Badab rebellion though.

theunwantedbeing
04-02-2011, 00:12
Do any of the paint armor schemes have anything to do with Camouflage?

Marines use SEP camo.
Which is simply making themselves stick out so much that the brain of the viewer just decides they're too rediculous and ignores them, declaring it to be somebody elses problem.

Gimp
04-02-2011, 00:14
Oh wow I thought that piece of fluff was for real real. Very good work

WildWeasel
04-02-2011, 00:18
Oh wow I thought that piece of fluff was for real real. Very good work

Haha. Apparently the key to writing good 40K fluff is looking at it and being able to say, "Yeah, that's kind of cool, but Apollonus? Really that's a bit silly." :D

Bestaltan
04-02-2011, 00:20
As the galaxy of Man is approaching the End Times and stares into the abyss, the Lords of Terra have called for a new founding. The Ultramarines, always dutiful to the call of the birthplace of mankind, quickly send in their geneseed tithe. A new chapter is birthed from their tithe, but to honor the forthcoming tide of blood that will usher humanity through this time of trial, the chapter elects to paint their armor red.

LOTS of ways you can do this. Or just paint them red and say "Hey, I wanted red Ultramarines."

Wyrmwood
04-02-2011, 00:28
The Sons of Orar are Ultramarine successors; their armour is a dark crimson and white. A potential option?

http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Sons_of_Orar

Ozybonza
04-02-2011, 00:39
If you want to use UM shoulder pads, make them a UM succesor chapter who's name starts with "U". Then the shoulder pads won't look out of place :)

Pitalla Crimson
04-02-2011, 00:43
Ha ha Dude that is FANTASTIC! That is seriously awesome. I am copy/pasting and saving that. Well done my friend.

You could also play a Succesor chapter, there is The Sons of Orar chapter which has pretty neat story.
Or you could also play Blood Ravens too ^.^

Xandros
04-02-2011, 00:46
Official colour scheme is a demented notion. First off, pretending there is only way of painting blue. Just look at the Battle for Macragge cover and consider how often you've seen Ultramarines like that. Furthermore, divergent colours are easily justified.

Ealdwulf
04-02-2011, 01:01
And red Ultramarines would look really boss, especially with some of the fancier UM specific metal minis.

That was really my main reason for wanting red ultramarines. I just think you could do some really bad-ass stuff with them, art wise.

You guys have given some great options. Most of this was triggered by me looking at paintings/illustrations of Roman Legionaries and wanting a Ultramarine force that reflected that.

I think I'll get a small command paint em up and see how it goes.

I'm glad people still enjoy the fluff of the game. To me it's what really makes the game what we know and love. It's what pulled me into the game, and what makes me continue building, painting and converting units. It's always fun to make up your own story, even if nobody cares or ever hears it!

Dark Aly
04-02-2011, 11:31
Some marines use camo (to help better stay alive to bring the Emperor's justice to his enemies), and some marines don't (some rubbish about it being too cowardly). One example of this was the article on the Badab rebellion in one of the Rogue Trader expansions. I'm not sure if this has been carried over to the more recent FW take of the Badab rebellion though.

"Camoflage is the colour of fear" from either the RT rule book or the compendium of the same(ish) time.

Wildweasel's back story is a very acceptable method but to be honest if you wanted a game with me and just said "I wanted red ultramarines" then I'd go "cool, let's game"

Godzooky
04-02-2011, 11:37
Makes a change from the more common occurrence of people fielding blue Blood Angels, I guess. :D

AlphariusOmegon20
04-02-2011, 15:38
There is the sons of guilliman which have a name and no official color scheme. I can imagine they would use the same chapter icon. There more than a few chapters that use the fist and hand icons. So why not multiples of the ultramarine symbol

Actually they do have one. It's on the 100 Chapters poster that GW sells at their store birthdayys.

Thalenchar
04-02-2011, 16:39
Also why would another chapter have the same essential logo as the Ultramarines? I realize this is really deep fluff for an army, and in the end it doesn't really matter, it's just a fun talking point and way to theme the army.


This happens more often than you'd think. Just look at the logo's of the Black Consuls / White Consuls / Mentors, or the Raven Guard / Hawk Lords / Knights of the Raven, or the Red Talons / Brazen Claws, or...

Godzooky
04-02-2011, 17:00
This happens more often than you'd think. Just look at the logo's of the Black Consuls / White Consuls / Mentors, or the Raven Guard / Hawk Lords / Knights of the Raven, or the Red Talons / Brazen Claws, or...

I think that's more to do with boosting metal shoulder pad sales. :D

Dark Aly
04-02-2011, 17:17
This happens more often than you'd think. Just look at the logo's of the Black Consuls / White Consuls / Mentors, or the Raven Guard / Hawk Lords / Knights of the Raven, or the Red Talons / Brazen Claws, or...

....Imperial fists, crimson fists (except colour). IIRC in the compendium the red scorpions also shared their symbol with another chapter as well as various colour schemes depending on their campaign

carlisimo
04-02-2011, 21:22
You can use the same symbols on a successor chapter, imo. Call them the upsidedownomegamarines.

Hrw-Amen
04-02-2011, 21:29
You could just go with parts of the armour, like a single shoulder pad or helmet.

ashrumx
04-02-2011, 22:00
How about considering Genesis chapter, their armor is red. Just as the Dark Angels have the honor of being the first legion, Genesis is the absolute first chapter created under Guillimans' codex reforms.

Sergeant Uriel Ventris
04-02-2011, 22:10
This reminds me of a fun bit from my past: I briefly flirted with the idea of doing red ultras myself, but in addition I wanted to take Calgar in the list and change his name to "Carneus Malgar."

I want to name my son Carneus Malgar. It sounds strong.

Shnerg
04-02-2011, 23:57
Captain Abalar swung his power sword with all his might, beheading yet another Genestealer. His patrol, which consisted of only 20 men, was fighting tooth and nail to survive.

"Alpha, move behind me, and cover my blind spots!" Abalar roared to the terminator armour-clad warriors, positioned to his left. Alpha squad ran to Abalar's blind spots and slashed with all their might at the horde of Tyranids assailing them.

Abalar knelt down, and called for an escort ship to beam them back up to safety, as there were too many creatures for such a small platoon to handle.

As he rose again, a member of the accompanying Tactical Squad fell, and created a gap in their defensive line.

A stray Termagant shot, and hit Abalar in the head. Blood sprayed out of his neck, splattering the armour of his squad red.

Enraged by this, a marine picked up Abalar's sword, and, muttering a prayer to the Emperor, charged straight into the horde of bugs.

Bug after bug was smashed under the power of that blade. As the marine was about to plunge the sword into the heart of a Tyranid Prime, the escort 'Redeemed' beamed them up.

After dropping the patrol off at their Battle Barge, the squad said to debriefer that they felt their armour should be painted red as a tribute to the Captain who sacrificed himself to save his friends.

Something like that.

Son of Morkai
05-02-2011, 00:20
I actually love the name Ultramarines of Konor. Hell, if there can be Lunar Wolves and Space Wolves and Red Wolves and Wolf Wolves and White Consuls and Black Consuls and derpadperpady Wolf Consuls, then why the hell not?

A significant force of Ultramarines led by the fourth company, and including large elements of the reserve companies deployed to defend a forge world from an Iron Warriors assault. Warp storms cut off the system from the Imperium for several centuries, during which the Ultramarines defeated the Iron Warriors and forged strong ties with the Mechanicum.

When the warp storms died and they were able to return to Macragge, they found their place had already been replaced by new warriors, believing them lost.

With no home to return to and strong ties with the Mechanicum, the lost Ultramarines were granted a new founding and a place on the world of Konor. The new chapter was unwilling to completely forsake their previous heraldry or name, believing themselves to still be Ultramarines heart and soul.

Eldartank
05-02-2011, 06:25
The red Ultramarines idea is an awesome idea! But I think it would work best as a successor chapter. It would be cool to see an entire army of red Ultramarines on the tabletop - red armor and vehicles, with the chapter symbol being identical to the Ultramarines symbol, but black instead of white. And you could even use all the Ultramarine-specific characters with all their rules - just give them different names.