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juicytomatoes
23-03-2011, 05:34
So at the end of the Silmarillion, the host of the Valar finally march on the armies of Morgoth and he is finally overthrown and cast into the Void.

I've been wondering for a some time now... who made up the host of the Valar? It seems that Eonwe led them ("the trumpets of Eonwe filled the sky"), so I assume there was at least one Maiar among them. The Vanyar were also among the host of the Valar, for they returned to "Valinor in triumph". Earandil and Thorondor and the great eagles fought there too when the dragons of Morgoth counter-attacked. Still, not much else is said of who participated in the final battle against Morgoth. Were any of the Valar present? If not, why not? Would it not make the victory easier to achieve?

canucklhead
23-03-2011, 15:05
Essentially, most of those mentioned in the Alkallabeth and Valiquenta would have made up the hosts of the Valar. The Valar themselves, and all of the Maia who served them, at the very least.

juicytomatoes
23-03-2011, 15:36
Hm... I'm quite convinced that the Valar were not with them. It seems that the host of the Valar were driven back by the dragons, but Earandil, Thorondor and his eagles came to their aid and slew the dragons. I have the impression that the Valar would be able to overcome the dragons on their own. Or have I gotten it wrong somewhere?

That's the reason why I'm wondering who made up the host of the Valar. They took down the balrogs and all the orcs of that time. They seem quite powerful, but not enough to take down the dragons. I don't think the elves, even the Vanyar, can take on the balrogs, so I suspect there must be some Maiar amongst them powerful enough to do so. Apparently, the Teleri refused set foot on Middle Earth on this occasion because of the kinslaying. So no Teleri in the host. I don't think the Valar were among those who fought in the War of Wrath as the host was driven back by the dragons. It took only Earandil and the eagles to vanquish the dragons. I'm sure the Valar are more powerful than Earandil and the eagles of Manwe. Which then raises the question... why didn't the Valar go?

Chaplain of Chaos
25-03-2011, 01:35
I think I am correct when I say that it was Tulkas who wrestled Morgoth down. So if that is the case then at least some of the Valar were there.

I believe it is notable as it was the last time that the Valar ever came forth in war.

enyoss
26-03-2011, 22:38
I seem to remember that too, but wasn't that during the first war with the Valar, when Utumno fell?

Nuada
28-03-2011, 08:10
Yeah i think Tulkas wrestles Morgoth just after the two lamps fall (should look it up really)

In the War of Wrath (with the host of the Valar) Sauron surrenders to Eonwe, then runs away. I don't think any Valar take part in the battle.

Zothos
31-03-2011, 19:44
The host of the Valar was made up of Vanyar, Maiar and the remnant of the Noldor who remained in Valinor after the Kinslaying. It was Led by Eonwe, The Herald of Manwe. There is no evidence in any of the writings i have seen that shows the Valar were there in person.

The Fall of Utumno, That was the Valar and Maiar in person.

jprp
21-03-2014, 21:33
Pretty sure Aule and Tulkas chained Morgoth also Orome would be there-none of the females or Ulmo though as i remember and Manwe appears to have stayed at home.Probably Maia in hundreds or even thousands.