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AlphariusOmegon20
12-01-2012, 04:27
After confirming that the Red Duke is NOT in the new book, I've decided to do a Von Carstein themed army (thanks in part to those beautiful looking upgrade packs and Isabella.)


For Characters, I know I need Vlad, Konrad, Manfred, Isabella, and a BSB (Pieter Von Carstein). So I'm good there as far as I can tell. I think I'm good on Core also, as I can pretty much justify every core as being fluffy. The new Civil War rules talks about bat swarms, fell bats, the Black Coach, and Vargheists as being Von Carstein associated


It's all of the specials and rares I'm be a bit fuzzy on. I know I can use Black Knights ( pg. 14 of the 7th ed book), while Grave Guard is allowable (same page citation). I'm good with Corpse carts too. However, I know Blood Knights are out because it was Konrad in power when they were found, not Vlad ( page 16 same book, I'm going for an army at the height of Vlad's power)

But now comes the hard part.




Would Vlad have had?:

Crypt Horrors ( Giant Ghouls would seem to be fluffier in a Strigoi army)

Mortis Engine ( Yes I know it's new, but I'd like to know)

Spirit Hosts

Banshees ( The only Banshee I've ever read about was in the recent Red Duke book)

Zombie Dragons

Terrorgheists (I figured this would be Strigoi)

Vargulfs ( I always saw these as Strigoi also, now I'm not so sure)





It is these units I'm am not sure of, as I have no information on them ever being in a Von Carstein army.

Are any of these units fluffy to a Von Carstein army?

LotusCorgi
12-01-2012, 04:42
let me be the first to help, (always ready to help a fellow alpha legionaire!)
I think that any choices in the vampire codex is appropriate for the Von Carsteins. To compare them to chaos, the Von Carsteins would be "undivided", its the other four bloodlines that are more restrictive, fluff wise. Any undead monster in Sylvainia is a vassal of the master of Drakenhoff Castle. Of course, Pieter would not be appropriate for a present era Von Carstein army, seeing as he is dead. I am confused in general by the whole "Von Carstein" title thing. In the WHFRP book it explains that "Von Carstein" is a sort of honorific title awarded to Vampires whose sire is a Von Carstein. In previous editions of the book this seems inaccurate, as the only Von Carsteins are Vamps Vlad turned personally(?). Herman Posner is the proof to this assumption. The first time Vlad was struck down it was Herr Posner, not any of the other Von Carsteins (manny, petey, konrad, etc.) that took control of the army. Now he was dispatched when the ring returned Vlad to unlife, but he seems to be a "Von Carstein" who was not a Von Carstein. I have not read any of the novels, however, and I don't know what the story is in them or if they are cannon or not. hope this helps.

quietus1986
12-01-2012, 05:49
Vargulfs any vampire army they are just vampire's that lost control over the animal and blood lust in side them. And dire wolfs wear originally made by the Von Carstiens.
spirit hosts an Banshees wold have been attracted to Vlad because of the big spell with all the warp stone. Blood Knights wear before Konrad but Konrad just got them to fight along with him. But there would have been vampiric cavalry in Vlad's army.

Echunia
12-01-2012, 06:03
From pure speculation I would go like this:

Crypt horrors - nah, seems like a strigoi created thing

Mortis engine - sure, just some necromancer thing anyway

Spirit hosts and banshees - Of course, I think these are in common for most vampires bar the strigoi. In the Vampire wars series, Vlad summons a lot of them to attack middenheim or prag (can't remember).

Zombie dragon - Nah, fluff wise I would leave these to the blood dragons and necrachs

Terrorgheist - I would leave this one for strigoi and necrachs too.

Varghulf - Could probably work, but I agree that it feels like it would have more favour in a strigoi army.

pointyteeth
12-01-2012, 06:07
Just read the fluff on Vargheists and they'd fit great. It seems they are Von Carsteins who have fallen out of favour and been locked in tombs beneath castles in Sylvania. Over time, warpstone laced water drips into their tombs and that combined with their unsated hunger transforms them in body and mind. They eventually break out of their tombs and are more powerful in body but weaker in mind and are easily controlled by their jailors as they simply desire food.

AlphariusOmegon20
12-01-2012, 15:23
let me be the first to help, (always ready to help a fellow alpha legionaire!)

LOL.




Of course, Pieter would not be appropriate for a present era Von Carstein army, seeing as he is dead.

So's Vlad, according to the 7th ed. fluff. :D

My army is going back to that time when Vlad was alive and in total power, hence why I used Pieter's name for the BSB. I'd like to find a way to slip in Hans and Fritz too, but the army's already going to be huge enough as it is.




From pure speculation I would go like this:

Crypt horrors - nah, seems like a strigoi created thing

Mortis engine - sure, just some necromancer thing anyway

Spirit hosts and banshees - Of course, I think these are in common for most vampires bar the strigoi. In the Vampire wars series, Vlad summons a lot of them to attack middenheim or prag (can't remember).

Zombie dragon - Nah, fluff wise I would leave these to the blood dragons and necrachs

Terrorgheist - I would leave this one for strigoi and necrachs too.

Varghulf - Could probably work, but I agree that it feels like it would have more favour in a strigoi army.


Thanks for the justification on the Banshees and Spirit hosts. It did just occur to me that I can justify units of wraiths too. There's a wraith on the Black Coach, which is a Von Carstein thing according to the new Civil War rules, so it stands to reason that there might be whole units of them in a Von Carstein army.



Just read the fluff on Vargheists and they'd fit great. It seems they are Von Carsteins who have fallen out of favour and been locked in tombs beneath castles in Sylvania. Over time, warpstone laced water drips into their tombs and that combined with their unsated hunger transforms them in body and mind. They eventually break out of their tombs and are more powerful in body but weaker in mind and are easily controlled by their jailors as they simply desire food.


LOL I had already planned on putting those in the army. The Civil War rules showed the way on that one. I have to wonder if the Vargulf will now be just a bigger nastier version of the vargheist?

nurgle5
12-01-2012, 15:52
My army is going back to that time when Vlad was alive and in total power, hence why I used Pieter's name for the BSB. I'd like to find a way to slip in Hans and Fritz too, but the army's already going to be huge enough as it is.

Awww.. what about (for those of you who have read or have n intention of reading the VC wars trilogy)Jerek and Skellan?They are two of the most badass vampires around IMHO. You could always Vargheists to represent Vlad's retinue of family members and other vampires (like his body guard) in the bestial form they adopted during battles. Blood knights could also work for this.

In the Von Carstein wars books, many of the early vampires encountered are in the form of huge wolves, so Varghulfs could present this. As previously mentioned, spirit hosts and banshees were used by Vlad in the siege of middenheim. As for the crypt horrors, Vlad had large, lumbering, half troll bodyguards. Crypt horrors are perfect stand-ins.

NitrosOkay
12-01-2012, 21:41
Vlad isn't necessarily gone. He shrivelled into ashes on the battlements of the Empire Capital but if someone were to gather his ashes and place them in a black coach...

AM1640
12-01-2012, 21:52
A few editions ago the was a Sylvanian VC army that was lead by vampires (probably Carsteins) but included the local peasants and farmers. If you are trying to include most if not all of the Carstains, you could also include some loyal, deluded, and some what anemic peasants using skeleton rules to build up the core.

Lord Zarkov
12-01-2012, 22:24
Vlad isn't necessarily gone. He shrivelled into ashes on the battlements of the Empire Capital but if someone were to gather his ashes and place them in a black coach...

They went to quite some effort to stop people getting to those ashes though: Soaked in holy water, buried in hallowed ground in the graveyard of the Cathedral of Sigmar in Altdorf, in a plot filled with wards, charms and icons of Sigmar (some even buried in the soil), and all blessed by the Grand Theogenist. Quite some effort would be required to revive him.

AlphariusOmegon20
12-01-2012, 22:44
A few editions ago the was a Sylvanian VC army that was lead by vampires (probably Carsteins) but included the local peasants and farmers. If you are trying to include most if not all of the Carstains, you could also include some loyal, deluded, and some what anemic peasants using skeleton rules to build up the core.

Hmm that could an idea, I honestly hadn't thought of that.


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Iron_Lord
12-01-2012, 22:51
Mannfred in the present day book uses Zombie Dragons and Terrorgheists (the war in the badlands).

Varghulfs seem to choose their nature "embracing the beast" whereas Vargheists get it forced on them (locked away from blood, in coffins, absorbing Chaos taint from warpstone-tainted water).

quietus1986
13-01-2012, 06:37
Vlad isn't necessarily gone. He shrivelled into ashes on the battlements of the Empire Capital but if someone were to gather his ashes and place them in a black coach...
And the 7ed book had some weird fluff that would suggest that Isabella is still alive. Isabella jumpt on a stake and crumbled to dust. some wear in the book it steads that some vampire's use magic to imitate that an than run and hide to get back to full strength. And she would surly try to resurrect vald. By what you can read in the book in bretonia U don't even need black coach to resurrect a dead vampire .