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Bigdak
21-03-2013, 21:43
Hi,

My current project is a Savage Orc / Night goblin themed army and I have a list for you to comment upon. The idea is to have not the most competitive army but the best one possible with the spirit Savage Orc and Night Goblin alliance.


Lords:

- Aeshne the Night goblin Warboss : (Duelist) 155 pts
- Ogre Blade
- Talisman of preservation
- The Other Trickster's Shard

- Night Goblin Great shaman (lvl 3) 140 pts


Heroes:


-Bigdak the Savage Orc Big Boss : (General) 79 pts
- Great weapon

-Savage orc Shaman (lvl1) : 120 pts
- Lucky Shrunken Head

-Night Goblin BSB : 109 pts
- Light armor and shield
- The Bad Moon Banner

-Night Goblin Big Boss : 34 pts
- Heavy weapon

-Night Goblin Big Boss : 32 pts
- Additional hand weapon


Core Units


-50 night goblins with spear : Full Command + netters + 2 fanatics : 275 pts

-20 night goblin archers : Musician + 2 fanatics : 120 pts

-5 wolf riders with spear and short bow (Converted into night goblin riders to fit the theme) : 60 pts

-20 savage orc big'uns with additional weapon : Full Command : 255 pts


Special and Rare Units


-1 Troll : 35 pts

-1 Goblin Rock Lobber ( Isn't really night goblinish but orc & goblin war machines are not to be left behind IMO ) : 85 pts


Let me know of any usefull comments. My global idea is putting all the night goblin characters (but not the shaman) in the horde for maximum punch once I'm locked into combat. The orc shaman and the general with the Big'uns for the 5+ ward save. Wolves to take care of war machines and harass flanks.

Thank you for helping,

zielonkak
22-03-2013, 18:09
drop the solo troll and give your biguns additional choppas.

Bigdak
22-03-2013, 18:51
I forgot to say but they already had additional weapons :)

Maybe drop him for something else

zielonkak
22-03-2013, 20:58
Could add a chukka.

Fighting Newfoundlander
22-03-2013, 21:06
I like this list. I'd want more Savages myself, but there isn't really anything (other than solo-troll) that I'd cut to add to the unit. Maybe the NG duelist lord, but I like him too. I think this'll do really well against most 1500 pt armies. Good luck. Let us know how your first few games go w/ it.

Bigdak
22-03-2013, 22:15
I think i'm going to drop de Troll for a Chukka, I'm going to test this list tomorrow, I'll say how it went .

BaSe
22-03-2013, 22:38
For me not enough chaff. The units would be very easy to get to with a competitive army and easy to kill. I'd be happy to see you prove me wrong & make it work but I don't think it will.

Bigdak
23-03-2013, 08:28
For me not enough chaff.

I'm pretty new here and therefore don't get most of the new vocabulary --" .

What is "chaff" ? Triied looking it up on Google but didin't find anything convincing.
For me in my list I feel like I have too few savage orcs and they are going to get killed too fast. But I don't know what to drop to get those extra guys. Any other suggestions ?

Thank you for helping out already :)

zielonkak
23-03-2013, 15:21
I agree with not enough orcs. With two characters for the unit, I would try to add Atleast 8 orcs. You could use points from troll, and maybe cut down a few goblins and a goblin hero to do so

Moss
23-03-2013, 16:23
Chaff units are things like wolf riders and spirit hosts. Their job isn't necessarily to kill anything, but to redirect the enemy and act as speedbumps. Basically, units that help you control the movement phase.

I don't play orcs, but it looks like you could use one more such unit. Just in case you come up against a unit of 30 GG or something. You can keep him out of the game for a round or two with redirectors while you focus on the rest of his army.

Bigdak
24-03-2013, 21:56
I played a game and a half yesterday with a chukka to replace the solo troll.

First game against the Empire with a huge victory for the Orcs and gobbos but I think it's mostly due to bad luck for him : Steam Tank explosed on Turn 2.
The second match was against VC and we unforunatly had to stop with no clear winner but it seemed like I had more chances of winning.

The Chukka was very useless in both battles and so would have been a solo troll. Sadly in the first battle my frenzied savage orcs didn't even get into close combat so I didn't feel the need for more or them --". In the second game they were alot more effectif wiping out in 1 turn a unit of 10 black nights with only 2 casualties. In my next list I will take more of these crazy killers.
The horde NG is just perfect but only thanks to the netters and all of the characters in it. I'm going to add one more big boss in my next list.
For the NG duelist : he stood strong and victorious against an Empire Lord but didn't do so good against a Vampire Lord ( died in the second round ) so to be honest i'm pretty proud of him and I will keep him.
Meanwhile, the lvl 3 NG great shaman wasn't so great mostly because of stinky mushrooms.

Conclusion : I don't feel this list is very powerfull yet but I already have made modifications that I will publish as soon as possible for some criticism.

Thank you all for your comments. :)

Bigdak
25-03-2013, 07:14
Ok here is my 2nd go for the list. Not much change but the idea that The Big Waaaagh is better than the small one.


Lords:

- Aeshne the Night goblin Warboss : (Duelist) 140 pts
- Ogre Blade
- Talisman of preservation

- Savage orc Great shaman (lvl 3) : 220 pts
-Lucky Shrunken Head


Heroes:


-Bigdak the Savage Orc Big Boss : (General) 79 pts
- Great weapon

-Night Goblin BSB : 109 pts
- Light armor and shield
- The Bad Moon Banner

-Night Goblin Big Boss : 34 pts
- Heavy weapon

-Night Goblin Big Boss : 32 pts
- Additional hand weapon

-Night Goblin Big Boss : 32 pts
-Sheild


Core Units


-46 night goblins with spear : Full Command + netters + 2 fanatics : 263 pts

-20 night goblin archers : Musician + 2 fanatics : 120 pts

-5 wolf riders with spear and short bow (Converted into night goblin riders to fit the theme) : 60 pts

-26 savage orc big'uns with additional weapon : Full Command : 331 pts
-Banner of Eternal Flame


Special and Rare Units


-1 Goblin doom diver catapult : 80 pts


I still don't have that many chaff units but I don't know where to find the points for them. I can't cut characters in the Horde because they are what makes it powerfull. If you have any idea of what to change tell me :).

BaSe
25-03-2013, 18:40
1500 is hard but chaff is what can win the game. The wolf riders are ideal. Also goblin chariots. Imagine how would you deal with a unit of 9 ogres & a unit of 4 mournfangs?

Use chaff to send 1 away (angled so if they charge they can't charge next turn) and focus everything else on the other unit. With chaff orcs can loose big. You need to control the table & hope you don't roll those 1s at the start of your turn. :)

Moss
26-03-2013, 01:16
1500 is hard but chaff is what can win the game. The wolf riders are ideal. Also goblin chariots. Imagine how would you deal with a unit of 9 ogres & a unit of 4 mournfangs?

Use chaff to send 1 away (angled so if they charge they can't charge next turn) and focus everything else on the other unit. With chaff orcs can loose big. You need to control the table & hope you don't roll those 1s at the start of your turn. :)

To add to this, you need to remember that your opponent can pull the same stunts on you (the presence of frenzied models makes it even easier). Also, some armies (like O&G) have units can deal with opposing chaff almost as well as they themselves can redirect. I personally would shave a few points off each unit to fit in some more wolves (or whatever). It'll save you the heartache of having your savage orcs led across the board while your goblins get surrounded.

Bigdak
26-03-2013, 13:03
Ok. How about squig hoppers. Can they make a good deal as chaff units ?

I can get 5 of them for 60 points so if I take off the banner of eternal flame of the savage orcs and take the points back from the extra NG big boss I could be able to add 1 unit but it's difficult to do more.

Moss
27-03-2013, 03:56
I think squig hoppers are an excellent choice. The random movement hurts, but they're skirmishers, ITP, and probably most importantly, immune to animosity. Plus, at 60pts they're basically expendable. As an added bonus, they're also pretty dangerous in combat.

Let me reiterate that I don't play O&G, so if there's something I don't know about hoppers that would render my previous statement void, I apologize.

zielonkak
27-03-2013, 10:38
could also try out a mangler...they are awsoeme

SimaoSegunda
27-03-2013, 23:55
Squig Hoppers aren't as good as redirectors because they are Immune to Psychology. This means they can't choose to flee as a charge reaction. I tend to find units of 5 wolves with musicians make excellent chaff units, especially with M9, and of course swiftstride, feigned flight, and vanguard, none of which Squig Hoppers get. If I can spare the points, I give them bows, too.

Bigdak
30-03-2013, 09:12
Ok, I think i'll take more wolves with no upgrades for 50 points.

Thank you, if you have some last comments on my second list, feel free to write them.

Jind_Singh
01-04-2013, 06:24
Downgrade level 3 to level 2 - that's going to free up points and he'll still be fine in 1500pts
Drop a single Night Goblin big boss
Take out bad moon banner - it's useless - and you'd be better off with a crown of command - add enchanted shield to BSB to at least get him a 4+/6++ save

This will free up some points to add 'chaff'

Chaff = Wolf chariot, Squig Hoppers, Wolf Riders, spider riders, Boar Chariots, etc.

Best 150pts you could spend is also 15 squigs and 10 herders - there's a sexy unit! I have always ran my savages at 20 strong and not had an issue with them - sure the bigger units do well but it's a lot of points - 6 savages in my eyes is 66pts I can use to buy me some chaff!!

Bigdak
01-04-2013, 09:18
Hi, first of all thanks for the good critique. The only issue I have is that I can't downgrade my shaman without reaching the 25% restriction of heroes.

It's true that I didn't feel the ultimate need to have more savages and it would be probably wiser to use those 66 points on squig hoppers (6 points left)

Now why do you feel the Bad Moon Banner that useless ? With a horde that big which will be charged on all sides the dangerous terrain tests have fairly high odds to wound some foes and chariots think twice before charging in? Now maybe the soft cover isn't very interesting but it is still usefull against very shooting armies. I don't know, I havn't played enough games with this banner to have a very objectif idea about it. I will obviously try out Crown + Enchanted shield on the BSB and see how it goes.

Do you think I should drop the flamming banner off my savages to save some more points for a wolf chariot ? 10 points (Banner) + 32 points (NG big boss) + 6 points (left from the 6 savages) + points saved from the BSB = 50 + ..

Thanks for helping out.